Dimebag wrote: ↑Fri May 27, 2022 12:53 am
bahman wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:25 pm
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
So you believe your mind is imbedded in a greater mind, which causes qualia.
My mind is embedded inside qualia that are caused by another/other mind/minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
You mind directly perceives these Qualia, which the supermind has produced.
Yes, if there are only two minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
The light which is being projected, IS the qualia itself, as are all objects.
The light is qualia. What do you mean with as are all objects?
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Nothing exists except the mind, and the qualia.
Yes.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
What if instead of calling the greater mind a mind, we call it existence, which would make the objects also part of that existence.
What do you mean by existence? I have a precise definition for mind.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
What happens when you die, do the qualia remain, or do they cease?
My mind remains. If objectivism is true then my body decay since it is an object but minds within my body including my mind remain.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Are the qualia dependent on your mind, or independent?
Qualia is caused by mind/midns so it depends on mind/minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
If they are independent, how can you distinguish between the two ideas of mind independent objects, and mind independent qualia?
Qualia are not mind-independent.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
If you say, the objects are the qualia, how can someone have a hallucination?
I already define objects. An object is no qualia. Hallucination is nothing more than qualia so it is caused by mind/minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Or, maybe misidentify something, like mistake a rope for a snake? If your mind does not interpret the qualia, if it doesn’t assemble some internal model which acts as a proxy for whatever is out there, how do you account for these discrepancies?
Mind experience qualia as it is. It does not interpret the qualia.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
So you do agree your sensory system has some work to do, to interpret that light pattern, and distinguish it as for example, a rope and not a snake.
That is the duty of the brain which is an object to deliver proper qualia to mind.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
If there is some interpretation, then what you see in your mind is a representation of what is out there.
There is no interpretation. Mind just experiences qualia.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Therefore there can be a difference between what is out there, and what is in the mind.
We cannot be sure about what is out there. I already asked you whether you have an argument for more than two minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
So there is something out there which the qualia refer to, which could be different from what they appear to be. This must be a mind independent object.
If objectivism is true then objects exist given the definition of the object.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
You might say, this object (qualia using your term) is dependent on the greater mind (existence in my term).
If objects exist then they cannot be dependent on a greater mind since the object is made of mind and qualia as it is illustrated.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
I would agree that objects require existence. They must be imbedded in some existent framework. We call this the universe, you call it a universal mind. Seems like semantics now.
Object is not embedded in a universal mind.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
See it seems you want qualia to be able to do all the work that the current understanding of the physical universe does, such as having physical properties, mass, momentum, etc.
Yes.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Would you say then that physicists are studying and describing the behaviour of qualia and the universal mind?
Physicists study and describe minds and qualia.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Does this universal mind have the same property as our mind being awareness? Does it know that it exists?
Any mind experiences but it is not necessary self-aware.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
I want to understand if there is any difference between this greater mind, and what others might term, existence?
What do you mean with existence?
So you admit there are objects to which qualia represent?
Yes, if objectivism is true given the definition of the object.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
I thought you said there is only mind and qualia?
Yes, there is only minds and qualia.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
So are there also objects?
Yes.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Is there a world outside of qualia?
No. Minds are embedded in qualia. Of course, if minds are local, by which I mean that they cause and experience qualia locally, instead of non-local. A world in which the experience is local and the world is made of local minds and qualia is easy to understand. It is extremely difficult to imagine such a world by non-local minds.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
If there ARE objects, where do these objects exist?
In space where space is qualia too.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Inside the great mind, or somewhere else?
No.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
Or are these objects somehow tied to the qualia? Like, objects have qualitative properties like size, colour, etc?
I already explained what objects and perceptions are. I can explain them again if you wish.
Dimebag wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 2:10 pm
If there ARE objects, how can this view be idealism?
There is no conflict. Given the fact that qualia, the subject of experience, are by-products of minds then we are dealing with idealism. If objectivism is true then we are dealing with realism too.