Why do innocent people suffer?

[dattaswami]

That would include any harm the mother does to herself by getting the abortion. Or the harm having the kid does to her body. That would also be deserved. All harm would be deserved. There would be no way for any harm to not be deserved. I won't even bring up the statistics around which causes more harm to the mother's body, cause then you'll go off on some tangent as if this was about abortion.

When you are walking on the road, an ant dies accidentally under your feet and this does not come under the cycle of deeds and fruits (Karma Chakra) because there is no intention in you to kill the ant. Always intention is linked with the fruit of action and the mere inert action is not linked with the fruit.

Sins done unintentionally, like accidentally stepping on and killing ants while walking on the road, do not yield punishments. When the intention is absent, the person is not directing the work towards sin, and so the fruit of sin also does not arise (Jñānāgni dagdha karmāṇam, padma patramivāmbhasā—Gita). The inert energy needed for doing any work is supplied by God and it is never linked with the fruit since it is inert. It cannot have any intention which gives direction to the work. Intention is part of awareness and awareness has two sides:

i)
The soul or ātman is the basic inert energy that produces awareness

ii) The individual soul or jīva is the produced awareness and is a bundle of thoughts.

Ātman is inert energy (Sthāṇurachalo’yam—Gītā). It is not touched by the fruits of deeds since it cannot have any intention. This Ātman is the limited amount of energy present in the finite human body and is like a drop of water. The same inert energy or ātman is also qualitatively the material of the entire cosmos, which is like the ocean. The difference between the ātman present in a body and the entire inert energy in the cosmos, is only quantitative (Nityaḥ sarvagataḥ—Gītā).

Jīva or the individual soul is the awareness in the form of a bundle of thoughts.
It is responsible for the intention, and giving direction to the work. Unintentional sins are excused because in case of such actions even the jīva, which is responsible for the intention, remains silent. Since the jīva is not involved in the deed, it can also be considered as inert like the ātman. Hence, in unintentional deeds no fruit is given to the jīva. When a sin is done with intention, the jīva gets the fruit since intention always belongs to the jīva. When ants get crushed under the feet of a human being, the fruit of sin does not arise and reach the human being, since the case is similar to ants getting crushed under a car on the road. There is no difference between an inert car and the human being in this case since the intention to kill is absent in both.

On the other hand, the case of intentional sin leads to punishment. Further, a person, who plans to kill somebody, is a worse criminal than the person whom he employs to kill another. Of course, the employed person is not like an inert car since he takes money to kill and commits the sin of killing. But he is a criminal of a lesser grade. He too will be equally punished due to his intention of earning money through sinful means.
Your husband, being a lawyer, can explain this point with more clarity. In the case of sins done with intention, the direct doer of the sin, the employer of the direct doer, the promoter and the supporter; all share the fruit of the sin equally (kartā kārayitā caiva, prerakaścānumodakaḥ...). According to the divine constitution, the lawyer who supports the sin through his arguments for the sake of earning money, and a corrupt judge who supports the sin through his biased judgement, also share the sin equally. Even if there is a total failure of justice in courts run by human beings, the judgement of God does complete justice.

Four Types of Work

Let us consider the four types of work mentioned in the Gītā.

i) Karma yoga is God’s work done by a devotee on the path of nivṛtti to attain the abode of God or Brahma Loka.

ii) Karma is good social work done by the devotee on the path of pravṛtti to attain temporary good fruits in heaven or in this world. Both karma and karma yoga are often used in the same sense, but they differ tremendously.

iii) Vikarma is sinful action. It is the deeds that should not be done, and if done, the fruit of such sin is punishment in hell or sometimes punishment in this world itself.

iv) Akarma is inaction. Inaction or the avoidance of action should be applied only to the case of sinful action. In other words, only sinful action should be avoided. Avoiding good worldly action or avoiding the work done for God, is not recommended (Karmaṇohyapi boddhavyam—Gītā).
Karma, which is doing good deeds for the sake of selfish enjoyment, and vikarma, which is sin, are related to each other and they constitute the phase of pravṛtti. Both are done for selfish enjoyment. As long as the desire for selfish enjoyment is limited, the person performs karma or good deeds, whereas when the desire reaches its climax, it leads to sins. It is for this reason that Śaṅkara opposed Maṇḍana Miśra, the Pūrva Mīmāṁsāka, for following the path of doing deeds (yajña) to attain temporary heavenly enjoyments. During that time, the philosophy of Pūrva Mīmāṁsā had fallen to such a low level that the followers had begun to say God does not exist (Devo na kaścit...).

[dattaswami]

There are just rules in a game. You shouldn't do it, but in fact any killing will be just. Any rape must be just.

It is good that you have responded against the injustice and for the justice. If possible, you should also think the best that can be done by you either by taking up some practical step or by taking up some theoretical step through suggestions and propaganda of right concepts. You should always try to support the justice and condemn the injustice whether it is the case of an individual or a community. Such reaction is very important part of your worship to God. God will be highly pleased by such effort from your side involving in the establishment of justice and destruction of injustice since God feels that this is His primary responsibility towards His creation.

Your practical participation in trying to help the primary duty of God is highly appreciated always by God. If one fails in this aspect, any quantity of personal worship of God is useless. God says that He incarnates on this earth mainly to protect the justice and suppress the injustice. This is very important divine quality and contributes mainly to your achievement of divine nature. Therefore, you must develop this attitude within the limits of your capacity, knowledge and analysis. You must live always maintaining this divine nature irrespective of the defeat and success of your trials in establishing the justice against the injustice.

All the above concept is one side of the coin only. The other side is regarding the actual mechanism of the system arranged by God that involves the history of the case related to the future birth and previous birth. It is also related to the nature of the judgment of God based on several special and specific points of each individual case. The actual proceedings of the system run by the constitution created by God may sometimes differ from your analysis based on limited knowledge. You are not aware of previous and future births (Natvam vettha… Gita). The actual direction of the running of the case depends on the previous and future births known to God alone. The analysis of the Almighty is also far superior to your limited and inefficient logic.

However, you should not be discouraged by the actual proceedings of the case. You are totally justified within your limits. In fact, the proceedings of this entire Universe are beyond your capacity and about which you need not be worried. When the contradiction arises between your effort and the actual direction of a case, do not become emotional to find fault with the proceedings of the Universe, which are based on the direction given by God only. Thus, by criticizing the administration of Universe, you are criticizing only God, Who is the Universal Administrator.

In case of the contradiction between your effort and the path of the world, God is not blaming you since you are putting sincere effort within the restricted limits of your knowledge and capacity. On the other hand, God appreciates the behavior of your good psychology as per the divine expectation. In the case of such contradiction, you are only blaming God by condemning the universal direction and you are not realizing that this is the result of your incomplete knowledge. Therefore, your duty is to support the justice and oppose the injustice within the limits of your knowledge and not to blame God directly or indirectly in case of the failure of your effort due to contradiction by the universal tendency directed by God.

The Gita says that the practical nature of the activities in the Universe is very much complicated and every case is highly specific like the thumb impression. If Prakash is beaten by Manohar, the punishment given to Manohar differs in several ways depending on very minute details of the case and the possibility of psychological transformation of the sinner. For this sin, Manohar may be beaten here itself in this very birth by somebody or may be beaten by Prakash here itself in this very birth or may be beaten by the servants of the Hell in the upper world or may not be beaten by any one at any time since it is the reaction-punishment as Manohar was beaten by Prakash in the previous birth.

When the fact is the last option, people misunderstand that good Prakash was beaten by bad Manohar and nothing happened to Manohar. Your effort to beat Manohar fails if it is the last option. Now, you will start blaming the universal tendency and thereby blaming God indirectly since the direction of motion of any activity in the Universe is totally under the control of God only. Due to the existence of so many complicated options of the deeds of the souls, Lord said that the analysis of the three dimensional network of the deeds and fruits is very much complicated (Gahanaa Karmano Gatih).


The essence of this message is that you should try to uplift the justice and reject the injustice within the limits of your knowledge and analysis. But at the same time, when your such good wish and effort are repelled by the forcible universal direction controlled by the divine system, you should not be emotional and should not get any pain or depression. You will be appreciated by God for your behavior within the possible limits since the change of the attitude of the soul towards the right direction is the main aim of God since He does not require even a trace of the contribution of your effort as help or assistance in His administration. The Lord said in the court of king of Kauravaas like this “If certain people (like Bhishma, Drona etc.,) here have neglected the justice allowing the injustice to win, this does not mean that justice will be defeated and injustice will win. Anyway, I am always there to protect the justice and destroy the injustice. Moreover, such people shall also be punished by Me”. In fact, Bhishma suffered by lying on the bed of arrows and Drona suffered while his head was cut.

In the above given options, the selection of the choice is mainly based on the nature of the psychology of the human being to be changed. According to the suitability, the option is selected by God since the main aim is only to transform the soul and not to revenge through the punishment. The punishment gives only temporary suppression and the permanent transformation can be brought only by the powerful knowledge. Once the human being is convinced through the logical steps of the analytical knowledge, the practice will be spontaneously affected. For this purpose, God comes down in the human form again and again. Of course, God is engaged always through such activity and this aspect is totally different and should not be linked in the context of the present level. The human incarnation is such Leader as expected by you and such divine program is already going on and you are the best witness of that.


The concept that you should not hurt any living being is totally wrong and the concept that every living being is God since awareness is God is also wrong. Awareness is a property existing in certain created items called as living beings. God also has this property since all the properties of creation basically belong to God only. Hence, awareness is not at all God. If you are not hurting any living being, you are like an inert stone. You have to differentiate good and bad unlike the inert object. Then, you should encourage and help the good and discourage and even hurt the bad to control the bad. This differentiation of good and bad and different activities related to good and bad are followed by God also as said in the Gita that protection of good and destruction of bad are the divine duties of God (Paritranaaya saadhunaam).

Sometimes, you have to hurt even your own children to inculcate the discipline. If you become inactive by not hurting anyone, bad grows without control, hurting the good people more and more. In such case, you are indirectly hurting the good people and your basic concept that you should not hurt anyone is failing. Apart from the human beings, you should extend this interpretation to the other living beings also. The soft natured animals like cow should be respected and wild cruel animals should be hunt.

The above concept that you should hurt bad people should not be misused especially for your selfishness. There may be a rich man, who looted the innocent poor people in a region. You can cheat him and steal away his wealth. But, such wealth should not be stored in your house for your selfish advantage. In such case, you are hurting the bad but the result is for your selfishness. You should distribute that wealth to all the poor innocent people in that region. You can also share with them if you are also a poor man. Sometimes, you are becoming angry towards a rich man on some other personal reason.

Now, you interpret him as a sinner in amassing the wealth of the poor people and follow the above procedure. You are superimposing the sin on him for your personal grudge. It is like saying that if you want to beat a person, call him as dog and then beat him! Therefore, the justice and injustice should not be concluded in a hasty way. You should take the help of the ethical scriptures and the help of proper scholars before any conclusion (Atha Yadi te… Dharma vichikitsaa… Veda).

Whenever, any unjust situation taking place in the world comes to your notice, you should stop there and be involved in condemning the injustice as far as possible. You should not go in your own way avoiding the risk in it. If everybody follows this principle, you are not alone to fight against the injustice. You have the support of several such people and hence, you need not fear. God will be pleased with you by such practical involvement since you are doing the duty of God. All your worships, rituals and devotional prayers cannot please God. This is the real way to please the God. God is the deity of justice (Dharmasya Prabhurachyutah). God is honored if the justice is honored. God is insulted if injustice is honored.

If the justice is protected (Pravritti), the society runs with smooth functioning. Then, the spiritual effort (Nivritti) can also take place on smooth basis. The stage should be safe for the drama to run in peaceful way. God is not much bothered about the Nivritti, which is your personal relationship with God. God is highly bothered about Pravritti, which is your behavior to the society. God said that He incarnates on the earth only to protect Pravritti (Dharma Samsthaapanaarthaya – Gita) and not to protect Nivritti. The scriptures of other religions totally deal with this Pravritti only.

Shankara told that you are God (Tattvamasi) even though the reality is that yourself, an imaginable item of creation, cannot be God, the unimaginable creator. Shankara is not ignorant of this truth. The main aim is that you will develop noble divine qualities of God when you think that you are that very God. In such case, Pravritti is tremendously protected since everybody becomes extremely good assuming himself or herself as God. Selfishness vanishes away completely since all this creation is already the property of God i.e., yourself. You need not steal your own property and corruption disappears. Such tremendous wonderful results are seen as the development of a single lie that you are God.

A lie is not a sin and in fact is auspicious act when it gives good results. The mother says to the child that the moon will come down if it eats the food offered by her hand for the good result that the child grows well by eating the food. She is not punished in the hell for that lie. In fact, she is honored in the heaven for that good act. People see Shankara as the Divine Preacher of Nivrutti. He is in the disguise of Nivritti and should be treated as the excellent preacher of Pravritti. Shankara is the incarnation of God and hence, the basic nature of God to protect Pravritti (justice) can be clearly identified in Him in a hidden way. Shankara exploited the ambition of every human being to become the highest God for achieving the best peaceful society.

[Walker]

Your practical participation in trying to help the primary duty of God is highly appreciated always by God. If one fails in this aspect, any quantity of personal worship of God is useless. God says that He incarnates on this earth mainly to protect the justice and suppress the injustice. This is very important divine quality and contributes mainly to your achievement of divine nature. Therefore, you must develop this attitude within the limits of your capacity, knowledge and analysis. You must live always maintaining this divine nature irrespective of the defeat and success of your trials in establishing the justice against the injustice.

dattaswami says that injustice should be answered with justice.
(Whether or not I have a different take on that topic is irrelevant to what he is communicating here, and this is what it means to be objective in understanding his meaning. First, understand before attempting to dismantle.)

This is what I'm beginning to like about dattaswami.
He tunes into the gist of what's happening now, and his response is analytical, always aiming for the principle.

In other words, dattaswami walks the talk of objective analysis.

Western Emotionalism doesn't stack up to that.

His does not aim to answer unfairness with unfairness.
He answers unfairness, with fairness.
And he does it well, even with all the words.

To accomplish this, he answers emotionalism and belief with time-tested prescriptions of real cause and effect, rather than wishful imaginings of what should be if God was not such a boogie-man. This is most helpful to those who listen, and who hear in the spirit of understanding.

Once understood, teachings can be transmitted with words within situations, as part of the situation, and dattaswami is tuned into that. He just doesn't dance to other tunes that are composed within the questions of others, with all their assumptions.

At first I thought dattaswami wrote too much for the situation, but the more he writes, the more the consistency of his meaning reveals. The rascal grows on you. It all ties together, so if you don't get that, then keep reading if you don't yet see it.

It's also helpful to not extrapolate out into absurd conclusions the misinterpretations of what dattaswami transmits, or what anyone transmits.

Just sayin'.

[Iwannaplato]

God was not such a boogie-man.

Still a strawman.

Once understood, teachings can be transmitted with words within situations, as part of the situation, and dattaswami is tuned into that. He just doesn't dance to other tunes that are composed within the questions of others, with all their assumptions.

It's also helpful to not extrapolate out into absurd conclusions the misinterpretations of what dattaswami transmits, or what anyone transmits.

Yes, just take his word for it. Don't mull implications, don't feel into what he says. Just take the word from on high, like Walker.

In other words, dattaswami walks the talk of objective analysis.

Well, he does make a lot of assertions. If that's your sense of objective analysis, you've found a good home.

[wtf]

When you are walking on the road, an ant dies accidentally under your feet and this does not come under the cycle of deeds and fruits (Karma Chakra) because there is no intention in you to kill the ant.

That is a very interesting remark. I seem to remember that followers of a certain Indian religion carry a broom to sweep the path under their feet specifically so that they don't kill any ants. Here's a reference I found.

In complete dedication to nonviolence, the highest-ranked Jain monks and nuns avoid swatting at mosquitoes or sweeping a path on the floor so they do not step on an ant.

https://education.nationalgeographic.or ... ce/jainism

Now that seems like a far higher morality than not watching where you're going, and carelessly murdering ants under your feet that you had every expectation were there, and that you made no attempt to avoid.

It would be like looking at my smartphone while driving my car, and running over pedestrians. "But Your Honor, it was a complete accident. I did not deliberately run over those pedestrians. In fact I didn't even see them!"

If you know there are ants on the ground, and you are a highly moral person dedicated to not taking innocent life, you must carry a broom and sweep the ants from under your feet. And look where you're going when you drive.

What do you think?

[dattaswami]

When you are walking on the road, an ant dies accidentally under your feet and this does not come under the cycle of deeds and fruits (Karma Chakra) because there is no intention in you to kill the ant.

That is a very interesting remark. I seem to remember that followers of a certain Indian religion carry a broom to sweep the path under their feet specifically so that they don't kill any ants. Here's a reference I found.

In complete dedication to nonviolence, the highest-ranked Jain monks and nuns avoid swatting at mosquitoes or sweeping a path on the floor so they do not step on an ant.

https://education.nationalgeographic.or ... ce/jainism

Now that seems like a far higher morality than not watching where you're going, and carelessly murdering ants under your feet that you had every expectation were there, and that you made no attempt to avoid.

It would be like looking at my smartphone while driving my car, and running over pedestrians. "But Your Honor, it was a complete accident. I did not deliberately run over those pedestrians. In fact I didn't even see them!"

If you know there are ants on the ground, and you are a highly moral person dedicated to not taking innocent life, you must carry a broom and sweep the ants from under your feet. And look where you're going when you drive.

What do you think?

The soul must be reformed by spiritual knowledge and this alone brings permanent solution. However, in absence of permanent solution, the sinful attitude is suppressed by punishments and hell represents this concept.

This concept is based on logic and hence, it is valid in any age because the logic of the concept is beyond time. The logic is as follows. The meaning of reformation is that the soul passes through realization, repentance and finally non-repetition of the sin in practice. What is the aim of the punishment for sin? It is not revenge or tit for tat! It is only to create fear in the mind of the soul so that the soul does not repeat the sin. But mere punishment without giving spiritual knowledge can only bring fear in the soul; not realization. In the absence of realization, there is no question of repentance and the non-repetition of the sin in practice. Of course, due to the fear, there will be a temporary avoidance of the sin.

The non-repetition of sin is most important since it is the final practical step. Therefore, the soul is punished for its sins here on earth as well as in hell so that the soul does not repeat the sin at least for some time. After being punished in hell, when the soul is reborn on earth, its tendency to commit the sin is greatly reduced. As the child grows, it learns from its surroundings. Based on these external influences, the child picks up different qualities. But generally, the soul picks up qualities that are matching with its own inherent qualities. These inherent qualities have been accumulated by the soul over numerous previous births. As a result, in each birth, the soul usually develops a nature matching with his or her own inherent qualities. A change is possible only when the soul receives the true spiritual knowledge preached by the Human Incarnation of God. Such spiritual knowledge may bring total or partial reformation in the soul depending on how intense the soul’s inherent qualities are.

To speed up the reformation, God uses a combination of fear through punishment and realization through spiritual knowledge. It is like administering antibiotics along with vitamin B-complex to a patient so that the weakness caused by the antibiotics is overcome by the vitamins. The simultaneous exposure of the soul to both spiritual knowledge and the punishment for its sins is very essential. The punishment creates fear and weakness in the soul. The spiritual knowledge not only brings some strength to the soul overcoming the weakness but it also gradually brings permanent reformation in the soul. This is the basis of the divine system of God for managing and reforming souls. It involves these two simultaneous efforts of punishing souls for their sins and preaching spiritual knowledge to them through divine Incarnations.

Now, the main point is the cancelation of the soul’s pending punishments upon attaining total reformation. This cancelation is perfectly justified by logic since the aim of the punishment is basically to bring about the reformation of the soul. By instilling fear in the soul, it prevents the repetition of the sin by the soul temporarily. The non-repetition of the sin is the final step and the practical proof of reformation, which is achieved through punishment even if temporarily. So, it is clear that the intention behind the punishment for sins is only the soul’s reformation. But spiritual knowledge is far more effective in reforming the soul. Reformation attained through spiritual knowledge is permanent.

When permanent reformation has already been attained by a soul through spiritual knowledge, what is the use of punishing the soul further in order to bring temporary reformation? The aim of the punishment was never taking revenge against the soul for committing the sin. The aim was only the soul’s reformation, which has already been achieved in a permanent manner through the spiritual knowledge. So, the pending punishments for sins already done, get canceled. Actually, the file of these pending punishments is kept in an inactive state in hell as if in cold storage. It is never activated again as long as the reformed soul stays reformed. So, it is important that the soul remembers this point and does not go back to committing sins, thinking that the file of its deeds has been totally destroyed!

[wtf]

So, it is important that the soul remembers this point and does not go back to committing sins, thinking that the file of its deeds has been totally destroyed!

You entirely ignored my point about the ants. You said it's ok to kill ants if you don't look down to notice them. By that logic I can run over pedestrians with my car as long as I'm not looking where I'm driving. And to support my point, I noted that some people carry brooms to sweep ants out of their way so they don't kill them.

You completely ignored what I said and typed in another pile of words. That's why I asked you if you're a bot.

Can you address my point about the ants?

[dattaswami]

So, it is important that the soul remembers this point and does not go back to committing sins, thinking that the file of its deeds has been totally destroyed!

You entirely ignored my point about the ants. You said it's ok to kill ants if you don't look down to notice them. By that logic I can run over pedestrians with my car as long as I'm not looking where I'm driving. And to support my point, I noted that some people carry brooms to sweep ants out of their way so they don't kill them.

You completely ignored what I said and typed in another pile of words. That's why I asked you if you're a bot.

Can you address my point about the ants?

If you run over pedestrians you will be jailed and imprisoned. People also kill animals for food. It is also a grave sin because while killing the animal undergoes lot of pain and agony. Hence it is a grave sin. When you have been given lot of vegetarian food still you are killing a living being for food.

If you walk on the center of the road you will get hit from behind and die. It is all your carelessness. If you put your finger on fire your finger get burned immediately. While walking if you see ants you shall try to avoid stepping on them and you can avoid even killing an ant. It is upto you. If you drive carelessly and kill others you will get punishment in jail. It as simple as that. It is you who decides your fate by your own action. Kill or not to kill is based on your own pure will.

[Age]

Define 'innocent people'?

[dattaswami]

Define 'innocent people'?

Are those who do not harm good people and obey justice in this world.

[iambiguous]

Just for the record, let's get back to the manner in which human beings do suffer day in and day out:

...an endless procession of earthquakes and volcanic eruptions and tornadoes and hurricanes and great floods and great droughts and great fires and deadly viral and bacterial plagues and miscarriages and hundreds and hundreds of medical and mental afflictions and extinction events...making life on Earth a living hell for countless millions of men, women and children down through the ages...



"Each day, 25,000 people, including more than 10,000 children, die from hunger and related causes. Some 854 million people worldwide are estimated to be undernourished, and high food prices may drive another 100 million into poverty and hunger." United Nations

Believe in God? Believe in an omniscient and omnipotent God?

Why?

[Iwannaplato]

Define 'innocent people'?

Are those who do not harm good people and obey justice in this world.

So, it is possible to harm good people? One can be harmed and not have a lesson to learn involved or as punishment.

[dattaswami]

Just for the record, let's get back to the manner in which human beings do suffer day in and day out:

...an endless procession of earthquakes and volcanic eruptions and tornadoes and hurricanes and great floods and great droughts and great fires and deadly viral and bacterial plagues and miscarriages and hundreds and hundreds of medical and mental afflictions and extinction events...making life on Earth a living hell for countless millions of men, women and children down through the ages...



"Each day, 25,000 people, including more than 10,000 children, die from hunger and related causes. Some 854 million people worldwide are estimated to be undernourished, and high food prices may drive another 100 million into poverty and hunger." United Nations

Believe in God? Believe in an omniscient and omnipotent God?

Why?

Why to blame God for this. The fate of each person is decided by his own actions only. But when you see a suffering person you shall help him without pondering over the past sins etc. Even then if that person suffer then it is his or her fate. But you shall always help such suffering person to the maximum possible extent.


The tsunami is always due to anger of God since you are killing the living beings present in water for food. The earthquakes are due to killing of living beings that exist on the earth. God in the form of Buddha and Mahavir preached the non-violence and severely opposed the killing of living beings.

God in some other human forms might have followed the practice of non-vegetarian food in order to join with non-vegetarian people so that, certain other higher aspects to be preached might have been taken into consideration. That does not mean that God has encouraged the killing of living beings through non-vegetarian food. He might have kept silent on this issue in order to give importance to other serious issues. God follows the ignorance of the students in order to become friendly with them. To control a running bull, you have to run along with it for some distance before controlling it.

All these are the basic concepts of nivrutti, which are the core of pravrutti. By following the ethics of pravrutti, you will avoid God becoming furious with you. Then, through nivrutti, you can please God. On one hand, you are making God furious by not following the ethics of pravrutti and how can you please God through nivrutti simultaneously?




The sea with its wave-hands is always warning the people not to kill the poor harmless acquatic creatures like fish etc., for the sake of food. God created lot of vegetable food, which is the best even according to present science of health. The sea represents the Lord and finally kills the sinners with his own wave-hands. Goddess earth kills the sinners through quakes since these sinners kill the innocent creatures on the earth. Tsunami is the result of combined anger of father-sea and mother-earth.

These innocent creatures have no advocate and even cannot file a criminal case in our courts. Such formalities are not necessary for His all-pervading court. One sees the punishment only and not the sin, which is the cause. One sympathizes the human beings affected in other countries also since all human beings are one. But one should broaden his mind and should feel that all the living beings are one and sympathize every living being. The natural calamities will then disappear.

[dattaswami]

Define 'innocent people'?

Are those who do not harm good people and obey justice in this world.

So, it is possible to harm good people? One can be harmed and not have a lesson to learn involved or as punishment.

In this world full free will is given to all the people. When you are walking on the road a theif can come from behind and snatch your purse..It is quite possible...

[dattaswami]

Define 'innocent people'?

Are those who do not harm good people and obey justice in this world.

So, it is possible to harm good people? One can be harmed and not have a lesson to learn involved or as punishment.

In this world rarely people exists without any sins. Hence there is any true good person, who is devoid of suffering....If one become liberated soul such a person is untouched by the world and worldly relations due to extreme attachment to God.