Moral Capitalism

[tbieter]

At the dog park this morning, my liberal friend Dean drew my attention to an article about social darwinism in the Republican Party in yesterday's Star Tribune newspaper:
http://www.startribune.com/opinion/comm ... y#continue

I find that the local author is the current executive director of an international organization headquartered in St. Paul that advocates ethical principles for business: http://www.cauxroundtable.org/

What do you think of the ethical principles?

[artisticsolution]

At the dog park this morning, my liberal friend Dean drew my attention to an article about social darwinism in the Republican Party in yesterday's Star Tribune newspaper:
http://www.startribune.com/opinion/comm ... y#continue

I find that the local author is the current executive director of an international organization headquartered in St. Paul that advocates ethical principles for business: http://www.cauxroundtable.org/

What do you think of the ethical principles?

Hi Tom,

I really enjoyed that article..very long but interesting. I have not had time to look at the ethical business principles though. Is it also interesting? Is it in keeping with the article or does he change his mind? Do I have to watch the whole video or can you just sum it up for me?

What are your thoughts about his opinion?

[bobevenson]

Can somebody summarize in a few sentences what moral capitalism is all about?

[tbieter]

Can somebody summarize in a few sentences what moral capitalism is all about?

This is more of a description than a definition, but it is the best that I can come up with:

"The CRT Principles for Business are a worldwide vision for ethical and responsible corporate behavior and serve as a foundation for action for business leaders worldwide. As a statement of aspirations, The CRT Principles aim to express a world standard against which business behavior can be measured.

The Caux Round Table has sought to begin a process that identifies shared values, reconciles differing values, and thereby develops a shared perspective on business behavior acceptable to and honored by all.

These principles are rooted in two basic ethical ideals: kyosei and human dignity. The Japanese concept of kyosei means living and working together for the common good enabling cooperation and mutual prosperity to coexist with healthy and fair competition. "Human dignity" refers to the sacredness or value of each person as an end, not simply as a mean to the fulfillment of others' purposes or even majority prescription." Emphasis added)
http://www.cauxroundtable.org/index.cfm?&menuid=8

[bobevenson]

That seems to be heavy on generalities and light on specifics. Can you give me some actual examples of what would be a violation of of moral capitalism? In other words, what are some specific things a company should or shouldn't do?

[chaz wyman]

Can somebody summarize in a few sentences what moral capitalism is all about?

Yeah its like a peaceful war; A silent noise; a calm storm; a light darkness; and a good evil.

Capitalism is amoral.
It is practiced by people who may have moral or immoral intentions and act in moral or immoral ways.

[tbieter]

That seems to be heavy on generalities and light on specifics. Can you give me some actual examples of what would be a violation of of moral capitalism? In other words, what are some specific things a company should or shouldn't do?

PRINCIPLE 7 – AVOID ILLICIT ACTIVITIES

A responsible business does not participate in, or condone, corrupt practices, bribery, money laundering, or other illicit activities.
A responsible business does not participate in or facilitate transactions linked to or supporting terrorist activities, drug trafficking or any other illicit activity.
A responsible business actively supports the reduction and prevention of all such illegal and illicit activities.

[tbieter]

Here is an interesting principle:

6. Justice shall be provided.

The civic order and its instrumentalities shall be impartial among citizens without
regard to condition, origin, sex or other fundamental, inherent attributes. Yet the civic
order shall distinguish among citizens according to merit and desert where rights,
benefits or privileges are best allocated according to effort and achievement, rather
than as birth-rights. http://www.cauxroundtable.org/index.cfm?&menuid=55

This would seem to rule out the blanket vilification of "the rich", or "the 99%," since many, Mark Zuckerberg, for example, obtained their wealth through talent and work.

[Arising_uk]

This would seem to rule out the blanket vilification of "the rich", or "the 99%," since many, Mark Zuckerberg, for example, obtained their wealth through talent and work.

That and a touch of IP theft, he could also have said to have been dishonest in his dealings with those who first employed him.

[tbieter]

This would seem to rule out the blanket vilification of "the rich", or "the 99%," since many, Mark Zuckerberg, for example, obtained their wealth through talent and work.

That and a touch of IP theft, he could also have said to have been dishonest in his dealings with those who first employed him.

Behind every great fortune lies a great crime.
Honore de Balzac
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/autho ... pJbwAel.99

[tbieter]

This would seem to rule out the blanket vilification of "the rich", or "the 99%," since many, Mark Zuckerberg, for example, obtained their wealth through talent and work.

That and a touch of IP theft, he could also have said to have been dishonest in his dealings with those who first employed him.

Behind every great fortune lies a great crime.
Honore de Balzac
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/autho ... pJbwAel.99

Apparently, Facebook was created by Zuckerberg and others' actions, not as a result of a crime:

"Zuckerberg was born and raised in a Jewish household in New York state. While still in middle school in his early teens, he took up writing software programs as a hobby, beginning with BASIC, with help from his father. His father then hired a tutor to help his son develop his programming skills further. Zuckerberg's enjoyment in writing programs led him to developing computer games, writing a music player, and setting up a primitive home network he called "ZuckNet." His private tutor calls him a "prodigy." In high school he excelled in classic literature and science, while becoming proficient in four other languages. He was also captain of the school's fencing team.

He later enrolled in Harvard, majoring in computer science and sociology. In his sophomore year he wrote a program called Facemash as a "fun" project, letting students on the college's network vote on other students' photo attractiveness. It was shut down within days, but would become a template for his writing Facebook, a program he launched from his dormitory room. With the help of friends, including roommate Dustin Moskovitz, Facebook went national on other campuses, and they moved to Palo Alto, California"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Zuckerberg

[bobevenson]

That seems to be heavy on generalities and light on specifics. Can you give me some actual examples of what would be a violation of of moral capitalism? In other words, what are some specific things a company should or shouldn't do?

A responsible business does not participate in drug trafficking.

Actually, in this case, it's government immorality against free choice.

[Arising_uk]

Seen the film about him Tom? Given he's not sued them I assume it has some factual basis. So he stole the idea from some other Harvard seniors who hired him to build the prototype, accepted he built something slightly different but the IP was theirs I think and he shafted his first backer in a particularly nasty way by making his shares the only ones that were split, effectively making them worthless. Both parties sued him and won but with the proviso that the settlements be kept quiet. Not a very moral capitalist at all. But no surprise as its a fools game to think Capitalism can be an ethical and moral system in its own right as its a 'corrupt' and 'corrupting' economic philosophy in the first place, hence it can exist with any political system. One, as Marx pointed-out, with obvious end-results when it comes to the agglomeration of power and wealth and with inherent contradictions that cannot be smoothed away no matter how much good moral will is involved, i.e. it will always boom and bust, and as Gerry Cohen showed cannot even fulfil the promise of meritocracy for anyone who tries, as even if you do everything right, someone needs to be poor for the rich to have value and it may well be you despite how hard you work.

[tbieter]

Seen the film about him Tom? Given he's not sued them I assume it has some factual basis. So he stole the idea from some other Harvard seniors who hired him to build the prototype, accepted he built something slightly different but the IP was theirs I think and he shafted his first backer in a particularly nasty way by making his shares the only ones that were split, effectively making them worthless. Both parties sued him and won but with the proviso that the settlements be kept quiet. Not a very moral capitalist at all. But no surprise as its a fools game to think Capitalism can be an ethical and moral system in its own right as its a 'corrupt' and 'corrupting' economic philosophy in the first place, hence it can exist with any political system. One, as Marx pointed-out, with obvious end-results when it comes to the agglomeration of power and wealth and with inherent contradictions that cannot be smoothed away no matter how much good moral will is involved, i.e. it will always boom and bust, and as Gerry Cohen showed cannot even fulfil the promise of meritocracy for anyone who tries, as even if you do everything right, someone needs to be poor for the rich to have value and it may well be you despite how hard you work.

I have not seen the film.

"Not a very moral capitalist at all. But no surprise as its a fools game to think Capitalism can be an ethical and moral system in its own right as its a 'corrupt' and 'corrupting' economic philosophy in the first place, hence it can exist with any political system."

I don't agree that "free enterprise" is necessarily corrupt or corrupting. And I know a Marxist economist who would not agree with your statement, namely, Professor Richard Wolff. He advocates worker cooperatives. http://rdwolff.com/content/democracy-wo ... capitalism Of course, the opportunity to engage in "free enterprise" is a condition precedent to the start of a worker-owned enterprise. I have previously mentioned a very successful workers coop that I was acquainted with, the Builders Commonwealth, in Duluth. http://www.builderscommonwealth.com/ I previously raised a basic question that no one addressed: Why don't more workers, who find themselves unemployed when their job moves to China, form worker cooperative enterprises in their skill, trade, or economic activity?]

I'm not familiar with Professor Cohen. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Cohen
How would he answer the question that I put to you above?

[Arising_uk]

Workers co-ops are Socialism and history shows that the Capitalist does its best to destroy them.

Do you have a difference between Capitalism and 'free enterprise'?

Not sure what he'd say but I'd say because the capital is tied to the capitalists banks and they are loathe to lend it. At least over here they are. There is also the problem that those of that class, in general, do not have the skills, education nor belief to do such things as they've been to busy working for a bare living.