Christianity

[Gary Childress]

Sorry, chum. You won’t be able to suck me into a pity-session.

You seem to seek ‘advice’ but I have determined you are actually just nourishing your wound.

If it were me I’d have to realize that I’d have to make changes.

You’ll hear no more from me on the topic though.

Sounds good. I commend you on your wisdom of not further engaging.

[Gary Childress]

You are very adept at sucking sympathy for your *terrible plight* but what you receive does you no good at all.

I surely can't be the first one to tell you this, can I?

No. You're not the first. Everyone says that. You're not alone. Feel free to join the mob and peck on the mentally ill. Blame us for our illnesses. None of us are looking for "sympathy" only for a cure which is highly unlikely to ever manifest itself unless you suggest a lobotomy or something to keep us from voicing our annoying views.

Have you tried changing the way you think? Cognitive behavioural therapy will help you to come to grips with reality, and is not very expensive.

I've had therapists before. I'm not aware of any of them having used CBT on me. If they did, I didn't know it at the time. I'll check into finding that specific skill in one. I'm in the process of finding another therapist now.

[commonsense]

Is this what you teach in your podcasts or videos or whatever? How to despise the weak? Do you have a final solution to my problem, perhaps?

You are very adept at sucking sympathy for your *terrible plight* but what you receive does you no good at all.

I surely can't be the first one to tell you this, can I?

No. You're not the first. Everyone says that. You're not alone. Feel free to join the mob and peck on the mentally ill. Blame us for our illnesses. None of us are looking for "sympathy" only for a cure which is highly unlikely to ever manifest itself unless you suggest a lobotomy or something to keep us from voicing our annoying views.

There’s ECT as a last resort.

[Gary Childress]

You are very adept at sucking sympathy for your *terrible plight* but what you receive does you no good at all.

I surely can't be the first one to tell you this, can I?

No. You're not the first. Everyone says that. You're not alone. Feel free to join the mob and peck on the mentally ill. Blame us for our illnesses. None of us are looking for "sympathy" only for a cure which is highly unlikely to ever manifest itself unless you suggest a lobotomy or something to keep us from voicing our annoying views.

There’s ECT as a last resort.

Yes, I've heard. By God everything is fine and if anyone thinks differently we'll try running some electricity through his brain. If it works it works, if it doesn't then we can up the voltage.

[reasonvemotion]

commonsense wrote:

The Old and New Testament, just stories and wishes.

Many people such as yourself question whether the Bible can be trusted, in fact in today's society the Bible has become to be seen as a book of fables. Just stories and wishes, yet it is possible to verify the authenticity of it.

The Bible contains 66 books written over a 1500 year period of time by 44 different authors. 

The authenticity of its stories and of the people that lived in its history has been authenticated by the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1948.
The scrolls date back to 150-170 BC and contain all or parts of the Old Testament books except the book of Esther. 

Many other discoveries have helped prove many details of the Bible that had been scoffed at by higher critics:

The Cyrus Cylinder, discovered in 1879, records Cyrus' overthrow of Babylon and his subsequent deliverance of the Jewish captives.
The Rosetta Stone, discovered in 1799 in Egypt by Napoleon's scientists, was written in three languages Hieroglyphics, demotic and Greek.  It unlocked the mystery of the hieroglyphics which have helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible.
The Moabite Stone discovered in 1868 at Dibon, Jordan, confirmed Moabit attacks on Israel as recorded in 2 Kings 1 and 3.
The Lachish Letters, discovered in 1932-1938, 24 miles north of Beersheba, described the attack of Nebuchadnezzar on Jerusalem in 586 BC.

[commonsense]

commonsense wrote:

The Old and New Testament, just stories and wishes.

Many people such as yourself question whether the Bible can be trusted, in fact in today's society the Bible has become to be seen as a book of fables. Just stories and wishes, yet it is possible to verify the authenticity of it.

The Bible contains 66 books written over a 1500 year period of time by 44 different authors. 

The authenticity of its stories and of the people that lived in its history has been authenticated by the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1948.
The scrolls date back to 150-170 BC and contain all or parts of the Old Testament books except the book of Esther. 

Many other discoveries have helped prove many details of the Bible that had been scoffed at by higher critics:

The Cyrus Cylinder, discovered in 1879, records Cyrus' overthrow of Babylon and his subsequent deliverance of the Jewish captives.
The Rosetta Stone, discovered in 1799 in Egypt by Napoleon's scientists, was written in three languages Hieroglyphics, demotic and Greek.  It unlocked the mystery of the hieroglyphics which have helped confirm the authenticity of the Bible.
The Moabite Stone discovered in 1868 at Dibon, Jordan, confirmed Moabit attacks on Israel as recorded in 2 Kings 1 and 3.
The Lachish Letters, discovered in 1932-1938, 24 miles north of Beersheba, described the attack of Nebuchadnezzar on Jerusalem in 586 BC.

What do you mean by authenticated? Are all the stories non-fiction?

[Gary Childress]

There's a difference between authenticating historical events incorporated into myths, legend and fable versus authenticating that Jesus Christ was in fact the Earthly incarnation of the creator of the universe or that he even knew what he was talking about when he credited everything to a "loving" creator, including earthquakes and all other kinds of nasty stuff.

Personally, I don't find the Abrahamic religions very convincing as anything much more than fables.

I would be very surprised if there's no more to the universe and world we live in than spreading "good news" and thinking that the God of the universe is going to visit our dusty little corner of it someday and then the whole story ends happily ever after. That seems to place a lot of importance on a tiny planet that has, since that time, been proven is NOT the center of the universe.

But if people don't want their dream bubbles busted, then by all means, don't let me spoil all the fun. Just don't be blasting my brain with chemicals and invasive procedures just because they don't like what I have to say.

Thanks. I'll pass on the "brave new world" project. Give me reality and truth, for better or worse.

[Lacewing]

I've only said that the unafflicted don't understand if they think we can just "snap out of it" or think happy thoughts instead.

You do realize that just about everyone has to work at maintaining peace, happiness, and clarity for themselves, right, Gary? It can be hard work and we can forget how. Sometimes it helps for others to remind us that we have some control over our situations. You don't seem to want to hear that.

You don't seem interested in the compassionate and thoughtful feedback you receive. Perhaps you don't see it that way because you automatically frame other people as having 'a lack of understanding in that you cannot do anything about it'. So, you keep complaining and ignoring people... and that's kind of self-absorbed and rude. What do you want people here to do?

If you want to feel love and appreciation, help someone less fortunate than yourself without desiring anything from them. Maybe that will help get your focus off of your own frustration and reset your perspective.

[Belinda]

No. You're not the first. Everyone says that. You're not alone. Feel free to join the mob and peck on the mentally ill. Blame us for our illnesses. None of us are looking for "sympathy" only for a cure which is highly unlikely to ever manifest itself unless you suggest a lobotomy or something to keep us from voicing our annoying views.

Have you tried changing the way you think? Cognitive behavioural therapy will help you to come to grips with reality, and is not very expensive.

I've had therapists before. I'm not aware of any of them having used CBT on me. If they did, I didn't know it at the time. I'll check into finding that specific skill in one. I'm in the process of finding another therapist now.

Psychotherapeutic process is very close to educational process which is not "used on" the child by the teacher , but is a starter motor that leads to the child's own activity.

[Dontaskme]

Note to IC:

All there is, is infinity, appearing as everything, unlimited, endless, beginingless, seamless without division. Impossible to have been created which implies illusory division. Any seeming division arising here is likened to a dream.

The God story is a dream, it's a fictional story, nothing else.

There was never and individual "I"
Existence doesn't recognise a need to be conscious of consciousness. Being concious(verb) and Conciousness are the same one existence/reality.

The experience ''I AM'' is an illusion, because you already are prior to the thought ''I Am'' but existence already is, and has no need to recognise or experience being.
There is no ''I AM'' except as 'objective thought' which is illusory because existence never experiences or recognises itself as an object EVER. That's Impossible.

Existence is not happening to an object. Everything is happening totally wild and free including the thought of 'me' aka an object.

[Dontaskme]

Note to IC:

Nothing dies.

No one who thinks it is alive can ever tell itself it is dead. So who actually dies? the answer is no one. Infinity has no birth or death.

Who you think you are is the dream.

There is no creator IC.. except in the dream, where nothing ever happened, only seemed to happen.

[attofishpi]

No. You're not the first. Everyone says that. You're not alone. Feel free to join the mob and peck on the mentally ill. Blame us for our illnesses. None of us are looking for "sympathy" only for a cure which is highly unlikely to ever manifest itself unless you suggest a lobotomy or something to keep us from voicing our annoying views.

There’s ECT as a last resort.

Yes, I've heard. By God everything is fine and if anyone thinks differently we'll try running some electricity through his brain. If it works it works, if it doesn't then we can up the voltage.

If you have electricity at home you can do this yourself. Get two flannels and dampen them (with water, not a solvent). Strap the flannels to the end of an electricity cable (with insulation removed) using cable ties, and have the other end of the cable plugged into the mains power supply.
Place the flannels on each side of the head (around the temples for true spiritual enlightenment) and secure with a headband.
Switch the mains power point on...and voila!

Worked for me, except all the pigeons are pink now for some reason.

[attofishpi]

This was removed, but you have added back in above quote:--> "Sure. A specific personality, seemingly outside of this world, who determines destiny, who intervenes in history, who has determined specific ends (cataclysm, apocalypse) and will ‘return’ one day to set up divine administrative offices — I assume in Jerusalem."

I don't recall anything in the four main Gospels re any of that. Anyway, I am off to India as you know but I do find it astonishing that you don't believe in the Gospels re the life of Christ. Well, me saying that sage\God informed me at least a few times that He did suffer the crucifiction isn't going to sway anyone's belief...so..mmm.

The Gospels form a complexity of writing from before the time of Jesus (Essenes and other odd groups) through the time of Jesus and to apocryphal writing. Then there is the Revelation which makes all sorts of strange claims.

I refer to all of that, or much of that, to then develop and explain the picture that traditional Christianity (generally) believes.

Fair enough, from being taught what the Gospels were at primary school I was under the impression they were related to the Gospel of <disciple.>

I remember the teacher stating that Gospel literally translates as 'good news'

But I will say this, that when dealing with the TESTS and the wrath of God, keeping faith in that man bloody well works.

When someone makes this sort of statement to me -- based in faith, based in something experienced, and something real -- I do not contradict. Myself, I wonder why you talk about very personal experiences in a forum-context where they cannot be well received. But that is just my own curiosity.

I guess I am not overly concerned on my experiences not being 'well received'. It's a major part of the life of Brian, and I feel I need to provide some account of it since God is a major consideration on a philosophy forum whether people like that fact or not.

ps Loving the way Indians drive....honk honk honk - I'm going over there - roundabouts with no painted lines for lanes, and if the road has lines nobody cares and just drift across...this kind of madness suits me for some reason!

[Alexis Jacobi]

Personally, I don't find the Abrahamic religions very convincing as anything much more than fables.

If that is so, it lead to the question: What is ‘spiritual life’? What is ‘the life of the soul and spirit’? What is ‘growth’ and self-development.

All these things, and very much more, opened up when the metaphoric “god’s death’ presented itself

That ‘god’ died — and man came to life. The orientation shifted. In this sense ‘man came back into the body’.

There are hundreds of ‘modalities’ of life (spiritual life) that opened. Some trite and mawkish perhaps, but some of a profound and meaningful sort.

None of them can transcend (escape) life’s tragic dimension: the ‘situation’ we face.

“The only way out is through”.

[Alexis Jacobi]

ps Loving the way Indians drive....honk honk honk - I'm going over there - roundabouts with no painted lines for lanes, and if the road has lines nobody cares and just drift across...this kind of madness suits me for some reason!

I have lived in so many lawless places — the N coast of Venezuela being one — that I know what you mean. It is charming, stimulating somehow — until it isn’t. Our Occidental lives are so regulated, so confined within lawfulness and over-order that when we confront anarchic chaos it is like fresh wind.