Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am
ken wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:34 pm
How many times do I have to tell you that just because you see some thing, from your perspective, then that does NOT mean that I can see it?
So -- if you recognize the above statement as truth -- then why do you keep telling me that I
have not done what I said, because you cannot see it?
BECAUSE I have NOT seen you do it. Even AFTER I ask you nicely to show it, you will NOT do it. You just keep repeating that you have done it. By just showing WHERE, you say you have done it, which can very easily be done with a simple link, then that WOULD prove you right and Me wrong, which I am pretty sure you would get great entertainment, joy, and pleasure out of doing. Your continual saying, "I have done it already and do not want to do again", just reinforces, to Me anyway, that you have NOT done it at all, which is what I am saying.
I would LOVE for you to prove Me WRONG, because then we can look at what it is that you SEE, and say, I do. Only then I, and we, can SEE what YOU SEE.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 amIf people are repeatedly telling you that they've done something which is recorded on the forum, they probably have.
That does NOT necessarily logically follow. Just because a person repeatedly tells Me that they have done some thing, which is or is NOT recorded any where, then that does NOT mean that they have probably done it. That just means that they are saying that they have done it, and WITHOUT evidence I am none the wiser. By writing it that way, to Me, that just means that they want Me to believe it without having to show any proof at all. If people HAVE DONE IT, which is supposedly recorded and they keep repeatedly insisting that they have done it, then WHY NOT just provide the actual evidence, especially when they are saying the "evidence" has been recorded down?
You do realize you could have used far less "time" and "energy" by now if you had just provided a link for us to look at and see from the outset of this?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am It wouldn't make sense that they would say such a thing over and over if they hadn't done it.
Do you understand that I am NOT saying that you have NEVER done it. I am just saying I HAVE NOT YET SEEN IT. And, I would love to SEE it. I just wish you would do show it again or show us where you, supposedly, did it last time.
Also, do you realize that many upon many people say things that do NOT make sense, just to cover up their purposefully past deceitful and lying ways, or their forgetful, or unrecognizable, past behaviors and ways?.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am And the reason they don't want to show you again, is because it didn't work before when they tried, and they have more interesting things to do with their energy than go in the same circles with you.
Do you realize that IF you just showed it, then you would NOT be wasting energy at all and we would NOT be going in circles now. If you were to show it, then we can stop going in circles. Simple really.
And, just because some thing did not work before, especially if the other one says that they did NOT even see it, then that is no excuse for giving up. If I would use that as an excuse, then I would have 'given up' ages ago. I keep going, especially to show things that obviously NO one has yet seen. I do NOT give up. Each time it did not work I just use that as a learning experience of what to try next time.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 amMeanwhile, you say that the reason you can't see it is because it has not been done.
If I have NOT yet seen some thing, then I have JUST NOT yet seen it.
You might have done it, for all I know. Until I see it, I will NOT know if you have done it or not. Could you PLEASE show us all where you did it, so that you can prove your self right?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 amBut do you really think that the problem is with everyone else?
If I have NOT yet seen some thing has been done, then that is NOT any problem with any one else. All that means is that I have just NOT yet seen some thing. I am not sure why you appear to be taking this so personally. I have openly admitted that I have NOT yet seen some thing or that I did NOT recognize it or that I did NOT notice it, when you have said that you have done it. You say you have done it already. SO, all you have to do is just show us WHERE you have done it. I can NOT prove what I am saying, whereas you can very easily prove what you are saying, that is if you have already done what you say you have done.
Is there any other reason, other than you just do not want to do it again, for NOT providing a link, or for NOT just saying what page and which post it is in, or for NOT just doing it again?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Or, can you agree that your inability to see does not mean that people are not actually doing what they say they are doing?
OF COURSE My inability to see and notice some thing, which you may or may not have done, does NOT mean that you have NOT done it. I obviously can NOT prove some thing is there if I can NOT see it. You, however, have the chance to prove what you say you have done. I just continue to wonder WHY you do NOT just prove it, instead of doing what you are now?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 amken wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:34 pm
Lacewing wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:22 pm Could it be that you're so caught up in what you think -- and what you WANT to think -- that you're missing or ignoring what is actually written and recorded in this thread and in this forum?
YES.
/...What people see can be a distortion, or a complete block, of what IS true and real.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:22 pmDo you realize this about yourself, Ken? Is it possible that what you're seeing is a distortion, or a complete block, of what IS true and real?
YES, very much so.
So, if we consider that you continually request that people ask more clarifying questions (to the point that their heads appear ready to explode) in regard to your communication --
Heads appearing ready to explode seems to be bit beyond any sort of reality.
If people have maintained their natural curiosity, or want to learn some thing which may be new, not thought of previously, or maybe unheard of before, then they will remain naturally inquisitive and thus continually ask clarifying questions. If, however, people do NOT want to do any of this, then that is fine. I am NOT here to force any thing at all. If people are NOT inquisitive nor open, then I understand. The reason WHY they are like this is easily and totally understandable.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am it seems clear that you're trying to steer the communication for yourself, and this would likely be based on your own distortions and blocks.
What distortions and/or blocks are you alluding to? If you can see any, then I want to be made aware of them. And, remember, that just because you see them as distortions and/or blocks, then that does NOT make them so. Until I have be able to express all that I want to express as clearly and as succinctly as possible, then you will NOT know if what you now see as being distortions and/or blocks are really what you see and think they are.
Not until I have expressed ALL of what I want to the full story will not have been told. Without the full story, you are NOT aware what it is that I will reveal.
If you want to communicate some thing, then would you try to steer the communication for your self or would you allow the other to steer the conversation the way that they want to steer it? If it is the latter, then what you want to communicate to others must not be of any real importance anyway.
Also, why would Me trying to steer the communication for thy Self likely be based on My own distortions and blocks?
How and why does it supposedly logically follow that steering communication for one's Self is because of distortions and blocks?
Is it at all possible that trying to steer communication in one particular way or another IS based upon and because of the absolutely crystal clear and open views One has?
To Me it seems far more reasonable to try to steer and keep the communication on a straight and narrow path that One has already experienced and thus SEEN as being a way that has worked and one that SO FAR has NOT been wrong. In fact the more open and thus clear the view IS, then the more that One would want to keep steering the communication. It logically follows, to Me anyway, that if one has any sort of distortion or block that they are aware of, then they would NOT necessarily want to, nor could, keep steering the communication. If, however, One is pretty sure that they are on the right path and have the right, clear, and unobstructed view, then they would ask for clarifying questions and ask to be challenged as much as possible.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Until you get those out of the way, you're not really open to communication other than your own because that's all you can see (as you're demonstrating).
That is fair enough. But I am getting sick and tired of being told
what IS right, especially when it is so obviously NOT right.
Again what are THOSE distortions and/or blocks that you SEE I have?
If you do NOT clearly express them openly and honestly here and now, then WHY say I have them?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 amken wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 8:25 amI am here in this forum to learn how to better explain HOW YOU can observe, and see (understand), 'stuff' all by your own self, which is actually
what IS.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:22 pm Here you are saying that you want to tell me HOW I can observe and understand?
That is an assumption. See how easily words can be misunderstood and misinterpreted. I used the word 'YOU' specifically. But as you have previously said, "this is not all about
you". Why did you think that I was directing that at you, lacewing, personally?
Your entire post was directed at me personally, Ken, and here you used the word YOU, as well.
If you THINK, ASSUME, or BELIEVE that My entire post was directed at you personally, lacewing, then I think that says far more about you, than Me.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am How am I supposed to know that you've switched gears and are not talking to me when you say "you"?
Every time you see or hear the word "you" do you ALWAYS assume that that is in direct reference to lacewing?
If so, then could there bit a fair bit of what you call "ego" going on there in that body?
I specifically used the word "YOU" knowing full well that this would come about. There is a reason WHY I say it is better to NOT assume ANY THING, ever. The reason should be clearly obvious by now.
By the way, HOW you are supposed to KNOW what another person is doing or is saying IS by ASKING CLARIFYING QUESTIONS. A truly open, and thus inquisitive, curious person would do that instead of just assuming and/or believing they KNOW what is happening and/or going on. This latter way is more of what closed people do.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Instead of recognizing this obvious issue for yourself, you accuse me of making an assumption.
I just once again accused you of making yet another assumption.
Is it an issue for YOU that I accuse YOU of making assumptions?
Also, what is the actual "obvious" issue for My self that you see, and I DO NOT? Are you alluding to Me "switching gears" and not talking to you when I say and use the word "you"?
If it is that, then for starters that is NOT an issue at all for my Self. Second, if it is an issue for you, then so be it, but again it is NOT for Me. Thirdly, just because I say or use the word you that does NOT mean it is directed at lacewing always. 'You' is a singular and a collective word. I USED the word 'you' here in this particular way to highlight HOW assuming, without firstly clarifying, can lead people astray and cause unnecessary confusion and "conflict", which I have just provided further and and another example of.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am ken wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 8:25 amLacewing wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:22 pm Why would YOU even NEED to explain that?
WHY do YOU even NEED to come on here and explain things?
I'm having fun.
Well continue to enjoy.
If you are having fun, then you will NOT have an "issue" with any thing that I say, or do?
And, if you really are having fun coming on here and explaining things, then you would really ENJOY explaining to Me, "once again", what it is that you see, about Me, which you say you have already explained and shown. If you do NOT want to do that, then you do NOT have to. But continually saying you have done it already and that you do NOT want to do it, seems, to Me anyway, far less FUN, then just explaining it, which you say you have fun doing anyway. The more we look into this the more is seems to make less sense.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:22 pmken wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2017 8:25 amSo, what is your response to, you do NOT come across as seeing/feeling humor at all? You always appear to be very upset, frustrated, and angry if I come across as expressing "I KNOW A WAY", for example. You come across fixated on that, and the anger that is within you about that is very obvious to see. The hatred and anger you have and feel comes across very noticeable. That hatred by the way also distorts what you see in
what IS actually written down too.
Notice how you went from saying how I "appear", to telling me how I feel... which is completely inaccurate.
I did NOT, directly, tell you how you feel. I said the anger that is within you (about that) is very obvious to see.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am I do not feel hatred and anger... so what then, IS actually noticeable?
What then that IS actually noticeable is the anger WITHIN you. Are you suggesting that there is NO anger at all within you?
If so, is that for ALL time, or just at a very particular moment you are talking about?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Your perception of me -- is THAT what you're noticing?
Of course.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am You have your way of communicating... and I have mine.
Very true. And, very obvious.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am My way is playfully rowdy.
Does that particular way come across that way to ALL human beings, always and equally?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Is there a particular way that I'm supposed to respond to all of the lunatic behavior on this online stage?
The way you respond is perfectly normal and understandable due to reasons of WHY you are the way that you are.
If you see lunatic behavior on this online stage, then that is fine. That is what you SEE. NOT ALL people SEE the same things.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am I'm simply playing too! Swinging my sword of logic, humor, truth, love, or craziness in whatever way seems appropriate for each situation.
That is fine. It all depends on what you are LOOKING FOR.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am
Any idea of what the 'reasons' are or could be?
Any idea of what the 'reasons' are or could be, FOR
WHAT EXACTLY?
If "any idea of what the 'reasons' are or could be' for what you
think, then the sole reason for them IS because of the previous experiences that that body has had. If, however, the 'reasons' you were asking about were for some thing else, then I will await your clarification.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Okay, that sounds kind of snotty. I was simply answering your question.
It did NOT sound "snotty" at all to Me. (Not that I really KNOW what you mean by "snotty") But anyway I was very excited and pleased that a clarifying question was asked.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am I don't know why people create what they do. I create what I do because either it pleases me, or I don't know any better.
People generally create what they do to reduce pain and/or increase pleasure. What each person chooses to create in order to try to alleviate pain and/or to try to elevate pleasure is solely depended on the past experiences that they have had.
WHY people want to or have to decrease pain and/or increase pleasure is because they have NOT experienced living in a truly peaceful, harmonious, non-greedy, stress free, and unpolluted world yet. When we are living in that world, then people will NOT have to, nor want to, decrease pain or increase pleasure. ALL people will be just truly happy anyway and will be just doing and creating what they are for ALL people and not just themselves. Doing for others naturally increases ones own self and well being naturally and any way.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am
Who does CREATIVITY entertain? Anyone who is open to it, right? Isn't the ultimate creativity manifested from ALL THAT IS, or the connectivity of all as one? So who is entertained by that? ALL THAT IS, right?
You're not fathoming very broadly, Ken.
If that is what you see, then fair enough.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am I thought you understood the view that sees beyond the individual human being.
And what do you think now?
Do you think that I do NOT understand the view that sees beyond the individual human being?
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Don't you think that there's a broader view than that of the individual?
I KNOW that broader OPEN view beyond just human beings perspectives.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am From that broader view, wouldn't there be beauty and magnificence in all of creation?
OF COURSE.
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Even the ugly and destructive?
The very REASON that the ugly and destructive came into existence, and continues to exist, for the moment anyway, is because of what is learned and gained from that ugliness and destructiveness. Human beings learn far more, and far better, from experience than they ever learn from just being told some thing. Experiencing and feeling ugliness and destructiveness teaches
what is right, and more importantly
WHY what IS right IS right
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:24 am Wouldn't there be love from that broader view? Wouldn't there be humor? Wouldn't it be entertaining?
It could even be argued that only things like that exist from that broader view. BUT standing back there "behind the curtain", as you would say, and looking out at the ugliness and destruction going on is NOT real pleasant, to Me anyway. Especially when KNOWING HOW to stop and prevent the ugliness from appearing and the destruction from occurring for ALL people. Also, KNOWING HOW to bring ALL people back "behind the curtain" and show them
what IS (or could be) and show them HOW they can feel and experience ONLY love, humor, entertainment, et cetera, is just what I want to do. Being "behind that curtain" alone is a pretty lonely feeling, which is ALL I have experienced. Now, is the time, that I want to SHARE HOW to obtain the broader view with ALL others. By only showing HOW to obtain that broad open view, and NOT showing nor telling what they have to do, allows them to do what they want. And, IF people are gaining that much more open view from that much broader advantage point, then they have done it, themselves, which brings with it a far more satisfying and rewarding feeling, of which things just "snowball" progressing forward.
Being alone and thus never communicating fully openly and honestly previously has led Me to NOT learning HOW to communicate "properly" or more thoroughly, previously. So, learning how to communicate better is just another learning experience, for Me. I had always previously just shown, on the outside anyway, acceptance and agreement with what others have said just to keep the "peace". But now I am getting over that and feel that I deserve to be heard and listened to, at least just once anyway.