Inner-Rebellion: Cause of Free-Will

[Wizard22]

A few months on 4chan.org/pol/ the meme of "inner-monologue" made a circuit.

The hypothesis is that only a small portion of Humanity have an "inner-monologue" by which people "talk to themselves" (interpreted as Schizophrenia) with an "inner-voice". This split the community by those who have it versus those that do not, or those who believe such an "inner-voice" is possible, versus those who do not. The Ancient Philosophers, Hellenes interpreted those with "inner-monologue" as Mystical types of souls who could "Converse with the Gods". So this is not a new phenomena per se.

Digging deeper into the phenomena, I personally hypothesize that "inner-monologue" is the direct result of Evolved human intelligence, that gave rise to Textual Literacy, reading and writing, in the first place. As such, those who were/are Literate are deemed 'Intelligent' ipso facto. Thus, Literacy is a sign of Intelligence, but not exclusively, since such a creative outlet could be redirected to Artistry, Painting, Music, Performance, or any litany of complex or intricate work, etc. However, being the first "Literate" hominids, presuming genetic heritability of intelligence, such a capacity for "inner-monologue" would then be inherited directly from the original hominids who 'became literate' for the first time. Inner-monologue would be indication of that lineage.

This is why only a section of Humanity would have this ability (a whole capacity for Literacy).


The same phenomena can be directly applied to Mathematics and IQ, along with how some students are 'Gifted' and 'Intuitive' at Mathematics, while most Humans are not, and cannot learn math easily by comparison. This Fact damages the pervasive Liberal-Leftist and Marxist-ideologies popular in this Postmodern Era, by which it's implied or stated, that "All Humans are Equal, and thus can learn Equally with the 'proper' tutelage and Nurturing". If IQ is truly genetically heritable (which it is), then the Liberal-Leftist institutions and ideologies falter, and fail, in application of Literacy and Mathematics, or what most people understand as "The Hard Sciences".


Thus, a small fraction of Humans can "converse inside their heads" or "have an inner-voice", while most others cannot.


Consider the development of those with "inner monologues" or "inner voices".

Across the world, the most intelligent children have the highest capabilities for innate pattern-recognition, by which to detect Lies or Falsehoods (Contradictions) in others. Thus, when Human societies indoctrinate children, there will always be a very small percentage of them who can not only detect such Contradictions, but 'integrate' them into their Psyche, resulting in that "inner monologue". For example, a particular child with these capabilities will have no one to talk to because his/her Parent, Guardian, Priest, or Whomever cares, raises, or educates the child—none of them will suffice the need of the child to rectify observed Contradictions. Because the Contradiction comes from a natural, biological "Authority".

Because all humans interface with Authority, regularly through their biological parents (especially Mother), the extent of any "Nurturing" or "Education", indoctrination or propaganda, would need to pass an observation check with logical consistency, from the child. This is the very nature of "Human Intelligence". Because if Observation cannot match Indoctrination, then the child will need to 'seek elsewhere' for a Highest Imaginable Authority that it doesn't even realize can yet Exist, in order to "make sense" of subconsciously intuited Contradictions. The result would be, manifestation of an inner-monologue or inner-voice.

[Wizard22]

Inner-Monologue in children is the direct-result of Cognitive Dissonance, produced from faulty or failed Propaganda, Indoctrination, or "Education".

It is a failure of Nurturing, thus also a failure of the Liberal-Leftist-Marxist paradigms.


The deeper cause of this Failure, is applying a false-ideology, full of Contradictions, logical inconsistencies, irrationality or simply Fear, to the mind of a Child that has already 'sectioned' him/herself off from such apparent Contradictions. Thus, the inner-monologue is like a flame that becomes stoked with fuel and air. It breathes and grows, flaming into an inferno. More falsity and lies applied to it, will only stoke it higher, creating a natural distrust (and eventual animosity) to those around him/her that share in the greater agenda of the applied-lies. Paranoia and Anti-social behaviors would be inevitable, as they naturally are, in most of Humanity anyway. The difference between the "Anti-Social", from the merely social or "Pro-Social", would represent a natural difference, deviation away from, the intelligent and the unintelligent. Because the unintelligent children would not have the innate ability of pattern-recognition to differentiate between when Indoctrination were to be True or False, outside of its given Authority (biological parent, Mother first and foremost).

All of these factors lead to an "Inner-Rebellion" of those children with "Inner-Monologues" or "Inner-Voices".


This phenomenon of "Inner-Rebellion" develops against the expectations and desires of Society to which anyone Human is born. So although Liberalism, Leftism, and Marxism are the most popular, virulent, and given forms of Propaganda in Western Civilization today, so too do these rebellions occur among the Conservative-Right or Abrahamic religious sects. It doesn't really matter which particular culture or sub-culture these 'rebellions' take place, since they are naturally occurring across all Cultures, and for all Time. Essentially, the 'rebellious' child, with "inner-monologue", is developing an 'ulterior' reality by which its Cognitive Dissonance is soothed and placated.

This results in development of Fantasy, Illusion, Delusion, and most dangerously, Self-Deception. Because those with inner-monologue now have the ability to differentiate between what is observably True, against what is propagated False, and can pit one against the other 'internally' (which is in the "Psyche" or the "Mind").

This leads to the phenomenon of "Choice", that, Choice is now a measure of different 'realities' by which some realities are purely logically consistent, while others are Not, or Should Never Be.

[Iwannaplato]

Where does the rebellion in the title of the thread come in. What is rebelling against what? or who against whom or what?

[Wizard22]

Where does the rebellion in the title of the thread come in. What is rebelling against what? or who against whom or what?

Still writing here, quick-draw McGraw...

[Wizard22]

Okay I'm done now...probably add more later. Have fun!

[FlashDangerpants]

Where does the rebellion in the title of the thread come in. What is rebelling against what? or who against whom or what?

Get the popcorn, he's writing the autobiography of his own intellectual development in the face of all the adversity and indignities that a cruel society can heap upon a gifted child with the power to see through lies. I hope he calls the book "My Struggle".

[Iwannaplato]

Where does the rebellion in the title of the thread come in. What is rebelling against what? or who against whom or what?

Still writing here, quick-draw McGraw...

I'll work on my mindreading and avoid asking questions when I want clarification.

[Iwannaplato]

Thus, when Human societies indoctrinate children, there will always be a very small percentage of them who can not only detect such Contradictions, but 'integrate' them into their Psyche, resulting in that "inner monologue".

Those who can sense falsehood in authorities in a society, should they act on these insights and try to make things better, are generally not conservatives. They are rebels and reformers, going against what is in place. Like Jesus or the founders of the USA. Neither of these were going back to an earlier format, but in fact changing things to something new. Just as most famous artists, writers, philosophers, etc., all saw contradictions in society or traditional aesthetics and went somewhere new.

You may need tactical creativty to uphold a tradition, but you don't need fundamental creativity to do that. It's already been done for you.

[Wizard22]

Those who can sense falsehood in authorities in a society, should they act on these insights and try to make things better, are generally not conservatives. They are rebels and reformers, going against what is in place. Like Jesus or the founders of the USA. Neither of these were going back to an earlier format, but in fact changing things to something new. Just as most famous artists, writers, philosophers, etc., all saw contradictions in society or traditional aesthetics and went somewhere new.

You may need tactical creativty to uphold a tradition, but you don't need fundamental creativity to do that. It's already been done for you.

You can only be 'Liberated' from Lies and Falsities.
You can only 'Conserve' The Truth from your subjectivity.

You cannot be "Liberated" from The Truth.
Nor can you "Conserve" Lies, because in order to Lie, you need to also withhold The Truth by which to differentiate and prove the Lie.

While it may appear that a scientific discovery and paradigm shifts 'liberates' its followers from the previously Conservative traditions—if it is indeed "The Truth" then it becomes the new Conservatism. Thus, "The Truth" doesn't change. Instead it is Re-Discovered by the "Liberator". This is why Liberals and Liberalism routinely fail in their New Age and Postmodern Philosophies. Because they pretend to offer something 'New', when what is Timeless, is already good-enough or better than these "new" alternatives.

For example, with these LGBTQMAP+ trends, all a person needs to do is step back, "Regress" to the time when there were only Two genders, and Men knew how to be Men, and Women knew how to be Women, and then The Truth is Re-Discovered. The Lies are exposed. There aren't a rainbow color number of Genders. There is no need to obsess about paraphilias and sexual perversions. All you need to do, is join Man and Woman in Marriage, Holy Communion, and then you are "Conservative" once again.

Liberals and Liberalism need Lies, in order to convince the masses that there are "countless choices", when there aren't...

There aren't many Choices in life, when it comes to the most important aspects of life, such as Sex and how one Ought to conduct themselves.



This means that a Family is a Moral Paragon, and it is 'Conservative' because it must be preserved, by definition, in order for a Specie to survive.

[Wizard22]

How the Inner-Rebellion "CAUSES" Free-Will:

What is a Cause?

What people know as "Causes" are based entirely on Experiential Memories of Sequence. You put your hand on a stove. Your hand burns. Therefore, you associate putting your hand on a stove, as THE CAUSE OF your hand being burned. Event B (burning hand) followed from Event A (hand on the stove). The human brain, and all animal brains too, have instinctive ways of interpreting separate events in order to Learn or Understand existence. Thus, your brain separates the event of "putting your hand on the stove" with "your hand burning".

Reality is then Partitioned into many events, many experiences, many memories. And the sequencing and re-sequencing of these events, are what and how Humans know of Causality.

But Causality is not crystal-clear. You can put your hand on a stove...and it doesn't burn. So why not? The stove isn't On. But if it were On, then the stove would burn your hand. So what you previously thought and isolated as "The Cause" of your hand burning, changes. It's not only-one-event, nor is it only-one-cause, but there are many possible causes and explanations, Justifications and Blame, which can be attributed or assigned to any sequences of events.


This 'Judgmental' process of assigning Cause (also Blame), is based on Human intuitions and Personal-Subjectivity.

So whereas on person will claim "The Stove Caused" your hand to be burned, another person will claim "The Electricity turning the Stove On Caused" your hand to be burned. And another person will claim "The Heat Caused" your hand to be burned.


Now that "CAUSE" is out of the way, I'll return to demonstrate how inner-rebellion "CAUSES" Free-Will.

[Iwannaplato]

You can only be 'Liberated' from Lies and Falsities.
You can only 'Conserve' The Truth from your subjectivity.

You cannot be "Liberated" from The Truth.
Nor can you "Conserve" Lies, because in order to Lie, you need to also withhold The Truth by which to differentiate and prove the Lie.

While it may appear that a scientific discovery and paradigm shifts 'liberates' its followers from the previously Conservative traditions—if it is indeed "The Truth" then it becomes the new Conservatism.

I don't assume that all or even most change is good. I am not arguing that change is correct. I am pointing out that the very term itself, conservative, is pointing to a keeping traditions. You were talking about the ability to and positive aspects of questioning authority IN GENERAL. I pointed out that this is specifically going against traditions in most cases.

Yes, recent changes can get the dominant position and someone who is a conservative can question these recent changes and still be conservative. But in general the ability to question authority is going against tradition.

This connects with a point I don't think either you or AJ have responded to clearly which is that the traditions you both want to uphold were made by non-conservatives breaking with tradition.

Yet, both of you write as if changing tradition is bad, keeping tradition is good.

As far as technology...for most of my life the people who were conservative about technology were more likely to be on the Left, with some similar reactions from the more neo-Luddite parts of the religious right. Only recently have I seen conservatives in general begin to question technology in greater numbers. Any criticisms of technology and corporations was seen by conservatives as anti-capitalist and 'advances' tended to be seen as simply good.

That's changing, but I'm not going to pretend that conservatives as a category have been consistent in their relation to toxic advances in technology. They haven't been. And it's a fairly recent phenomenon where conservatives are critical of corporations and banking in more general ways.

Thus, "The Truth" doesn't change. Instead it is Re-Discovered by the "Liberator". This is why Liberals and Liberalism routinely fail in their New Age and Postmodern Philosophies. Because they pretend to offer something 'New', when what is Timeless, is already good-enough or better than these "new" alternatives.

No. The founders of the US did not rediscover the form of government they created. They went against traditions going back thousands of years. You had to get to tribal cultures, which the West tended to destroy, to get anything like modern democratic ideas. (of course they were inspired in part by some Eastern Tribes)

Liberals and Liberalism need Lies, in order to convince the masses that there are "countless choices", when there aren't...

Yeah, the religious right didn't need lies. Warmongering conservatives didn't need lies to get their wars. Conservatives didn't need their lies when they freed up corporations from any oversight. When they gave banks the keys to all our resources.

I know you can only hear this as Left Good, Right Bad. But that's because you're so binary in your thinking, you assume everyone else is binary. And you have to hallucinate history to justify this radically oversimplified model.

Like much of both the left and right, you want a simple Lord of the Rings type enemy. Because it's too painful to take responsibility for how 'your team' contributed and contributes to the problems or because it seems like if you have to concede anything you have to concede everything or because you're lazy, I have no idea. But it's just mental abstractions, moving around in the mind, all neat and perfect and disconnected from reality.

the monotheists broke from pagan traditions, Jesus broke from Judaism
the founders of the US broke from royalty, class rigidity and fundamental notions of what different people were - they did other things also. And AJ often mentions hierarchy - the founder shattered hierarchies. Yes, they had hierarchies, but they destroyed many and set up a system that SPECIFICALLY ALLOWED for more changes in tradition, including more elimination of hierarchy. IOW they decided that tradition would not be fixed anymore. So, that's anti-tradition at the governmental level.
the modern family is not what older traditional families were, The West slowly over time broke down kinship relations and rigid kinship structures
You go outside the West and many cultures maintained traditions that the West broke (China, India as a couple of examples)
Individualism is a radical break from tradition.
Questioning authority is a radical break from tradition, unless one goes back to tribal ways of running their small societies.

Some things the West ended up creating as traditions has been good, from my persepective, some bad. And there is not THE WESTERN traditions. There are changing traditions over time.

An atheist like you would have been put to death, potentially, for just questioning authority and speaking his beliefs. The traditions of freedom and thought and speech are not traditional in the West. They weren't and then they were. (and if you want to go on about how the Left is ending that, sure. But conservatives have done that also. You have a micro- highly selective view of history fueled by hate. And the religious right would love to throw out a whole mass of traditions including separation of religion and state and all sorts of freedoms. And in those areas of life where they can do this, they do.

[Wizard22]

You're missing the main point, Iwan...

If a bunch of 'Liberals' liberate a society or usurp an authority, then what is that Authority or State or Tradition or Society replaced with??

Is the "New Order" fundamentally different than the old one? Is the new tradition, really "new"?


In the case of the American Revolution, the choice of a 'Republican' Government is very old, not new. In fact, it's so old, that they went back to Hellenic Greece and Athens, to model their new system, society, and culture. As I mentioned, that is a return to something 'Older' (more Conservative) than before, by comparison. Correct??

[FlashDangerpants]

In the case of the American Revolution, the choice of a 'Republican' Government is very old, not new. In fact, it's so old, that they went back to Hellenic Greece and Athens, to model their new system, society, and culture. As I mentioned, that is a return to something 'Older' (more Conservative) than before, by comparison. Correct??

To dispose of the customs and practices of the society you grew up in and adopt in theor place those of a foreign nation from the distant past is not conservative, it's neo-traditionalism
viewtopic.php?t=41943

[Skepdick]

To dispose of the customs and practices of the society you grew up in and adopt in theor place those of a foreign nation from the distant past is not conservative, it's neo-traditionalism
viewtopic.php?t=41943

The weasel word in your claim is the elastic word "society".

To dispose of the practices of the society you grew up in and adopt in their place those of a past version of your society is conservative.

Where does your society begin and end exactly? 20km from your home? Your nation? Your geographic region? Earth? Your global contemporaries? 5 years into the past? Human history?

Any change of tradition can be viewed as "neo-traditionalism" soon as you draw the lines right.

[Wizard22]

Thanks for saving me an argument, Skepdick... niiice.