Decline of the West???

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Wizard22
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Wizard22 »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:27 amBut you do think there is a conspiracy of jewish control over the banking system, with a predictable outcome being the financial ruin of western civilisation?
Jews own a majority control of Western banking, but not finance in general. I wouldn't directly implicate them in a declining economy. That's short-sighted and simple-minded.

Your accusations and implications are unfounded. You paint me as a redneck, hill-billy conservative "DA JEWS CONTROL EVERYTHING!" with relation to Western Civil decline. It's nowhere that simple.

Jews are not to be blamed for everything, yet does not mean they are blameless either. Nobody is immune to criticism in Philosophy, not even the self-professed 'Chosen' Ones.
Maia
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Maia »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:22 am
Maia wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:05 amIsrael is a thoroughly Western society, and doesn't seem to be in decline, either. Perhaps that's the answer, having a common sense of purpose.
The Jewish sense of purpose is based on fundamentalist, Abrahamic religious zealotry. The Orthodoxy over there, instills deep metaphysical ideology into their children. Foreign Jews tend to call themselves "Secularist" and Atheist/Agnostic, despite their Hebrew relatives linked to their religion.

The reason why Jews are motivated differently than other peoples, tribes, societies, and cultures, is because of their historical antagonism, mostly between the Romans, and then the Persians and Arabs.

You claim to be a native British Druid. Is your religious fanaticism and zealotry any different than theirs? Except, the Abrahamic religion is totalitarian, prophetic, and apocalyptic. Thus their ideology is fit for large, sprawling, warring Empires. This is why Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are the popular majority. It is why a small, pagan operative, is debased, baseless, and non-competitive. These ideologies are a battle of few versus many.

Most people choose Quantity over Quality, by default. What is popular, is true, to them.


I don't think of Israel as "Western". Why do you?
I assure you that I have never claimed to be a Druid! A Pagan, certainly, but Druidism is a specific path within that, which I've never been closely involved with. I used to be in a Wiccan group, but not any more. As for fanaticism and zealotry, no, I don't like those things at all.

Israel is a secular society. The only example of religion I encountered when I was there was when we were in the hotel in Eilat, and I was surprised to discover that the lifts were going up and down all day, even with no one in them. I asked about this and our guide told us that because it was a Saturday, the sabbath, this was so that devout Jews could use the lifts without having to press the buttons, which would have constituted work. And that was it. There was no evidence of religion at all other than that.
Wizard22
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Wizard22 »

Maia wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:36 amThere was no evidence of religion at all other than that.
Orthodox Jews run Israel. It's not a conspiracy. They are as devout, if not more so, than the Roman Papacy and Arabian Mullahs.

Perhaps the pivotal reason for Israel's world significance, are the 4000 years they sat at the center of trade routes between Europe, Africa, and Asia.

So it shouldn't be a surprise to people that Jews excel at mercantilism, trade, and math for banking. No "conspiracy theory" is required, just rub two brain cells together.


I'll ask again, why do you attribute Israel to "The West"?
Maia
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Maia »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:44 am
Maia wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:36 amThere was no evidence of religion at all other than that.
Orthodox Jews run Israel. It's not a conspiracy. They are as devout, if not more so, than the Roman Papacy and Arabian Mullahs.

Perhaps the pivotal reason for Israel's world significance, are the 4000 years they sat at the center of trade routes between Europe, Africa, and Asia.

So it shouldn't be a surprise to people that Jews excel at mercantilism, trade, and math for banking. No "conspiracy theory" is required, just rub two brain cells together.


I'll ask again, why do you attribute Israel to "The West"?
Another reason why Jews were represented in commerce is that in the Middle Ages, they were often banned from pursuing other trades.

Israeli society, as I experienced it, has all the things we expect in society in the West. Both good and bad. There was even a Pizza Hut right in the middle of the Old City of Jerusalem, which we were very thankful for, incidentally, on that extremely hot day, to get a coke in. There was also a McDonald's right in the middle of the Negev Desert, on the road between Tel Aviv and Eilat, like an oasis I suppose, only more tacky.
Wizard22
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Wizard22 »

If McDonalds and Pizza Hut are symbolic of the West, then we must be in decline.

Their food, prices, service, restaurants, have all declined in quality since the 90s.

Take me back to 96.
Maia
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Maia »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:55 am If McDonalds and Pizza Hut are symbolic of the West, then we must be in decline.

Their food, prices, service, restaurants, have all declined in quality since the 90s.

Take me back to 96.
Sadly, they are indeed symbolic of the West.
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FlashDangerpants
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by FlashDangerpants »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:33 am
FlashDangerpants wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:27 amBut you do think there is a conspiracy of jewish control over the banking system, with a predictable outcome being the financial ruin of western civilisation?
Jews own a majority control of Western banking, but not finance in general. I wouldn't directly implicate them in a declining economy. That's short-sighted and simple-minded.
Jews don't own a majority control of Western banking, that's pure nonsense.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:33 am Your accusations and implications are unfounded. You paint me as a redneck, hill-billy conservative "DA JEWS CONTROL EVERYTHING!" with relation to Western Civil decline. It's nowhere that simple.
But you do also believe in white replacement theory don't you? You are a conspiracy nut, that's why you didn't even question that rubbish about jews running the world bamking system.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:33 am Jews are not to be blamed for everything, yet does not mean they are blameless either. Nobody is immune to criticism in Philosophy, not even the self-professed 'Chosen' Ones.
What besides banks do you blame on the jews?
Wizard22
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Wizard22 »

Maia wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:56 amSadly, they are indeed symbolic of the West.
I think cars, rockets, and ships are more symbolic of the West.
Wizard22
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Wizard22 »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:57 amWhat besides banks do you blame on the jews?
That's enough indulging your twisted fantasies for one session.

Stay on-topic.
Maia
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Maia »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:19 am
Maia wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:56 amSadly, they are indeed symbolic of the West.
I think cars, rockets, and ships are more symbolic of the West.
Which Israel has in abundance, I'm sure. Certainly cars, absolutely everywhere.
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FlashDangerpants
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by FlashDangerpants »

Wizard22 wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 12:48 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 10:56 amJews made the west wealthy for a while?..... how did they do that?
By providing huge amounts of loans at low interest to Western countries, through the banks, from the 1950s onward.

Nowadays, the US just barely agreed to increasing the US debt by trillions of dollars. Eventually this magic funny money won't work.

Then the chickens will come home to roost.


And you will get your chance to see real anti-semitism and meet these real nazis you so greatly adulate.
One of your predictions for the decline of the west are that the nazis will stage a comeback after the Jews have done their jewy thing to destroy the world economy, that's already apparent. It is not of topic to ask what other stuff you blame on the jews.

After that we may, time permitting, wish to look into why you so frequently reference black people as particularly violent.
Skepdick
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Skepdick »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:13 am
Skepdick wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:03 amIf my daughter has half the business acumen Kim Kardashian has - I'd be extatic.

Scratch that. If I had half the business acumen...
Yikes....

There are more valuable things in life than money, such as honor, decency, integrity. And this is before the intellectual arena.
It's not about the money. It's about the ability to create something of social worth.

You have this tendency to default to reductionism... It's precisely what makes your value system worthless.
Skepdick
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Skepdick »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am The point is, noble and wealthy societies tend not to last long across history. This maybe the case for USA, the "American Empire", or "Western Civilization", depending on how these terms are argued and defined.
I think you are confused. There's no such thing as societies (plural). There's society (singular). The whole thing of human affairs.

Countries/nations/empires come and go.

Society carries on.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am As I argued to Iwan, it could be as simple as optimism across a population over time. It's complicated.
Obviously it's complicated, but what good is optimisim if it ultimately causes the quality of life to diminish?

Hoping for the best doesn't work unless you are ready to deal with the worst also.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am AND societies don't keep improving forever automatically. Many fail, hence the declines.
There's your conceptual confusion again. Yes nations and empires fall but society (as a whole!) keeps improving.

It's not automatic, but it's despite the failure of empires and nations.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am If this is the crux of your argument, then it's a bad one. You're implying that people don't work like slaves and dogs today.
I am implying no such thing. What I am saying is that the working conditions today are better than they were 5000 years ago.

But I sense you are going for the false equivalence again.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am They do. And many do, in the West, under the auspice of "illegal immigration". These people have little to no civil rights. So 5000 years is not much of an advancement, correct?
I'll take your concession that it's an advancement. Even if it doesn't meet your pretentiously high expectations.
Wizard22 wrote: Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:11 am I'm not yet convinced.
Of course. That's why your cynicism is misplaced. You think the past was better than the future.

There's a word for that...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactionary
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Dontaskme
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Re: Decline of the West???

Post by Dontaskme »

Wizard22 wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 10:13 am Some claim that the West is in decline, or stagnant at best.
Earth is a bug planet. Humans are no exception.

According to the national history museum. The world's insect populations are plummeting everywhere we look.
The number of insects is falling at such a perilous rate that if nothing is done to halt the decline, our own future could be at risk.
Without insects, the environment would simply fall apart.

Everything that lives is already in decline. That's just how life works.
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