Wizard22 wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 7:54 am
Concerning your previous posts, you definitely underestimate how difficult it is to resist and "fight back" against these domineering Faiths.
I don't think it's easy at all. Or, better put, some people seem to think it's easy. They rebel easily and never show any doubt or admit it to themselves. I am not sure those people are really feeling and thinking their way through.
It's not so simple. Surely you can go around telling 99.9% of Western people that they are wrong/incorrect/inaccurate in BOTH their fundamental religious AND scientific views...but you'll be spinning your wheels rhetorically against the lowest of the low.
I don't think there's any need to do it in some large blanket condemnation. One can just bring unique views, one a time, into discussions, for example.
These systems are protected and reproduced from the Top-Down. This means that, unless you represent the apex of authority in any part of the system, the masses will ultimately write you off as a lunatic.
I agree.
It doesn't matter how effective or persuasive your presentation. It doesn't matter how reasonable or rational. It doesn't matter how philosophically invested the Interlocutors deign to be
.I agree, but again, one can, if one wants, introduce specific ideas or phenomena, carefully, online or in person with people who at least seem potentially open.
What matters are fundamental shifts of direction, "paradigm shifts", away from the center of these systems.
Imagine taking over a Church, and trying to teach them that God is false.
Imagine taking over a School, and trying to teach them that the Big Bang is false.
You'll get visceral, vicious reaction from all directions. Again, you underestimate the human mass' dependence on these prevailing and domineering ideologies.
I don't know what you're basing your belief that I am underestimating the problems with going public with truly unique or alternative positions.
Why? Because the masses want to be left alone. They want to be indoctrinated with lies and falsity. They want Magic-thinking. They want pretty words, instead of deep meaning.
Philosophy is for the outside-Outsiders, not for Humanity.
Well, if you look around this forum there are a good number of people who would be and are diagnosed by people online. Nothing beyond that seems to happen. I am not ruling it out, but my gut sense is that as long as you don't put forward some concrete threats of violence against people with power, you can present alternative ideas and be ignored by anyone with political or economic muscle.
Maybe, just maybe, when space colonization occurs, some new Puritan sects can take new non-Human or anti-Human or anti-Abrahamic ideologies with them to new places. But then they'd be "starting over", reinventing the wheel.
For good or for ill, I am not ready to cede this planet. It's my home.
I think I recently asked, in this thread, what is this nature of Dependence on Abrahamism and its Secularization? Why are so few, essentially nobody, willing to "leave" these plantations? Because they are most effective at what they do. So if you start over, try to re-invent the wheel, you'll eventually reassert a Monotheistic faith against Polytheism. You'll eventually preposition One God against Many. You'll eventually require Messianism, Prophecy, and Victimization/Scapegoating. Much or most of your Morality will 'repeat' the grand design.
I didn't really understand this part.
It seems like this part and the post as a whole is saying it is hopeless and in some strong sense you consider yourself unfree. Even to reveal your unique positions in a philosophy forum no one with power gives a shit about or takes seriously.
But I am not sure you are hopeless of feel unfree to speak, just making my best guess of the general message here.