As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

What is the basis for reason? And mathematics?

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PeteOlcott
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As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by PeteOlcott »

Unless and until we make True(L, x) computable so that there is an objective way
to discern dangerous lies from Truth humanity remains at great an increasing risk.

This is the reason why we need to refute Tarski Undefinability and its analogs
(isomorphisms) such as Gödel's 1931 Incompleteness Theorem.
Impenitent
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Impenitent »

as long as people want something for nothing, humanity may soon perish...

computations are luxuries

-Imp
PeteOlcott
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by PeteOlcott »

Impenitent wrote: Sat Apr 29, 2023 10:59 pm as long as people want something for nothing, humanity may soon perish...

computations are luxuries

-Imp
I vehemently disagree. As it stands now very effective propaganda could unite 70% of the
population of a country in using nuclear weapons to right a misconstrued wrong.

This could cause nuclear Winter that starves 99% of the population to death and murders
the remaining 1% by some of the 99% just trying to get some food.
PeteOlcott
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by PeteOlcott »

The key urgency of the matter is to divide the opposing ideas:
(a) Putin invaded Ukraine as a land grab to bring back that Russian empire.
(b) Putin invaded Ukraine to legitimately prevent hostile powers from getting too close to its borders
in a way similar to the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Whether or not there was substantial voter fraud that changed the outcome of the
2020 presidential election.

Whether or not climate changed is actually caused by humans and what are the reasonably
plausible range of best case to worst case scenarios of simply ignoring it.

My ultimate goal is to make True(L,x) computable.
Skepdick
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Skepdick »

PeteOlcott wrote: Sat Apr 29, 2023 10:25 pm Unless and until we make True(L, x) computable so that there is an objective way
to discern dangerous lies from Truth humanity remains at great an increasing risk.

This is the reason why we need to refute Tarski Undefinability and its analogs
(isomorphisms) such as Gödel's 1931 Incompleteness Theorem.
Olcott, you are a fucking idiot.

Computation is strict rule-following.

Choice undermines computability.
Computability undermines choice.

That is what computers do - they obey.

Your perspective amounts to "Humans can't be trusted with making choices - they must obey strict rules.".

Putin agrees. Obey! Or else.
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Harbal
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Harbal »

Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:41 pm
Olcott, you are a fucking idiot.
Couldn't you have broken it to him a bit more gently. :|
Skepdick
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Skepdick »

Harbal wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:56 pm
Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:41 pm
Olcott, you are a fucking idiot.
Couldn't you have broken it to him a bit more gently. :|
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

When being gentle fails to work with idiots like Olcott you have to switch it up...
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Harbal
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Harbal »

Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:02 pm
Harbal wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:56 pm
Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:41 pm
Olcott, you are a fucking idiot.
Couldn't you have broken it to him a bit more gently. :|
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

When being gentle fails to work with idiots like Olcott you have to switch it up...
Okay, well I'm sure he'll thank you for it in the long run.
Iwannaplato
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Iwannaplato »

Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:02 pm Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
I knew I was right to stop practicing scales, etc. I just wish I had the natural gift that makes other piano players great from the womb.
PeteOlcott
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by PeteOlcott »

Harbal wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:09 pm
Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:02 pm
Harbal wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 6:56 pm

Couldn't you have broken it to him a bit more gently. :|
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

When being gentle fails to work with idiots like Olcott you have to switch it up...
Okay, well I'm sure he'll thank you for it in the long run.
I am not the nitwit that honestly believes
FALSE <proves> Donald Trump is the Christ.
ex falso [sequitur] quodlibet
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Agent Smith
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Agent Smith »

PeteOlcott is a worrywart ... me 30 odd years ago. Yes, I'm ancient but minus the wisdom that accrues over such timespans. :mrgreen:

As it seems to me, PeteOlcott is rediscovering, what to some is, a vexing issue as old as the hills. Bravo!

The solution?

Lead the way, PeteOlcott.
Skepdick
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Skepdick »

PeteOlcott wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 10:19 pm
Harbal wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:09 pm
Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:02 pm
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

When being gentle fails to work with idiots like Olcott you have to switch it up...
Okay, well I'm sure he'll thank you for it in the long run.
I am not the nitwit that honestly believes
FALSE <proves> Donald Trump is the Christ.
ex falso [sequitur] quodlibet
Olcott, you are a fucking idiot.

You keep confusing life for an axiomatic system.
Skepdick
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Skepdick »

Iwannaplato wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:16 pm
Skepdick wrote: Mon May 01, 2023 7:02 pm Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
I knew I was right to stop practicing scales, etc. I just wish I had the natural gift that makes other piano players great from the womb.
Practice implies learning and continuous improvement. Identifying and correcting mistakes. You aren't doing "the same thing" because you are making micro-corrections.

Olcott is incapable of that.
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Agent Smith
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Agent Smith »

There is, as obvious as the bright red truck parked in the street, an irreresistible obsession, an idée fixe, a monothematic delusion, that we have to tend to ... a raggedy-edged, dirty, laceration that hasta be cleaned with copious amounts of hopefully sterile normal saline, debridement next, obviously, and then suturing, followed by dressing. :mrgreen:
Eodnhoj7
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Re: As long as True(L,x) remains uncomputable humanity may soon perish

Post by Eodnhoj7 »

PeteOlcott wrote: Sat Apr 29, 2023 10:25 pm Unless and until we make True(L, x) computable so that there is an objective way
to discern dangerous lies from Truth humanity remains at great an increasing risk.

This is the reason why we need to refute Tarski Undefinability and its analogs
(isomorphisms) such as Gödel's 1931 Incompleteness Theorem.
Can you compute objectivity without first defining it through uncomputable means? Can computation result in a dictionary? Can you compute choice when all other variables are equal?
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