Expressing Emotions

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popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

I Like Sushu wrote: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:57 am What comes more natural to the human heart the desire to express “positive” thoughts of joy, hope optimism and love, or the desire to express “negative” thoughts of pain, suffering, hate, rage and pessimism?

My view is that people generally have a natural disposition to express more “negative” thoughts and feelings than they do more “positive” thoughts and feelings. Also, what are your thoughts about “Cartharsis” in respect to Aristotle and the various interpretations of this term (not particularly interested in dictionary definitions as this has remained a contentious issue among scholars for quite some time!)
As the world is cause to all organisms, then the organism's reaction is cause to the physical world. To be is to experience and one must be wary of bad experiences that could be considered life diminishing, these experiences would logically place first in occupying our attention, for that which is bad is life diminishing and that which is good is life-supporting. Dangers are what the organism needs mainly to be concerned with so, naturally, this is what it communicates to organisms of a like kind. I believe that is why the evening news is mainly bad news because it is a dangerous world out there and collectively, we need to communicate the dangers to others.
Last edited by popeye1945 on Thu Dec 01, 2022 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Walker
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Walker »

I Like Sushu wrote: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:57 am What comes more natural to the human heart the desire to express “positive” thoughts of joy, hope optimism and love, or the desire to express “negative” thoughts of pain, suffering, hate, rage and pessimism?

My view is that people generally have a natural disposition to express more “negative” thoughts and feelings than they do more “positive” thoughts and feelings.

Also, what are your thoughts about “Cartharsis” in respect to Aristotle and the various interpretations of this term (not particularly interested in dictionary definitions as this has remained a contentious issue among scholars for quite some time!)
Versions of wrathful guardians manifest within a personality, and they protect what is precious. Within personality, the cause and effect of what is precious, is satchitananda.

A version of wrathful guardian which is suitable to many circumstances in the civilized world, is any particular expression of financial circumspection. One doesn’t tell where one has buried the silverware, the gold, and the guns ... or even of their existence. It’s because they are precious. They are universal fungibles.

In another example, farmers keep their savvy and prosperity close to the vest. Their knowledge of farming is valuable and precious, hard won, as is their prosperity from farming, so they will protect it and not blab it. Someone might knock him in the head and take it.

Another example of a wrathful guardian for civilized times, protecting what’s precious: Sam Walton infamously drove an older used car, or maybe it was a pickup truck. That's part of the hardscrabble Arkansas mentality that protects what is precious, not “showing off” the profits, which were most valuable to him.

These days, mean and nasty words are wrathful guardians. They’re protecting something precious. Protection racket can be a philosophy of life, a guiding light.
Iwannaplato
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Iwannaplato »

I Like Sushu wrote: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:57 am What comes more natural to the human heart the desire to express “positive” thoughts of joy, hope optimism and love, or the desire to express “negative” thoughts of pain, suffering, hate, rage and pessimism?

My view is that people generally have a natural disposition to express more “negative” thoughts and feelings than they do more “positive” thoughts and feelings.

Also, what are your thoughts about “Cartharsis” in respect to Aristotle and the various interpretations of this term (not particularly interested in dictionary definitions as this has remained a contentious issue among scholars for quite some time!)
I think it is natural to express emotions. You have to learn (generally be punished or criticized, not necessarily intentionally) to learn not to. And this is so for all emotions, those judged by some as negative and those judged by some as positive.

Negative emotions are, at the base, a reaction to something unpleasant - hunger, abuse, unmet needs...whatever. So the emotions one expresses will vary due to experience. One can learn to whine, say, rather than express the actual emotion - often anger. Whining has a victim air, when the emotion is more neutral about power status. IOW there can be all sorts of habits in the expression of emotions and the hiding an emotion in a different emotion's expression. You can also learn bad habits in toxic households and toxic cultures (which includes all cultures to some degree or other).

But I see nothing wrong with emotional expression of either category, not that I use the two categories of emotions (positive and negative) any more. The two categories in the OP; that is.
Annette Campbell
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Annette Campbell »

Emotions are crucial in our everyday lives. Every day, we spend a significant amount of time seeing and analyzing the emotions of others, as well as deciding how to react to and deal with our own complicated emotional experiences. Since Charles Darwin presented emotion as an evolved faculty, psychologists have offered many distinct and frequently competing conceptual model that explains emotions and emotional expression. Though no commonly recognized theory of emotion exists, emotion theorists agree that emotional experience and expression in several ways, including with faces, voices, and bodies, is critical to human communication. A society's cultural norms and values can influence and shape its members' emotional expressions, and expressions that are permissible and essential for one culture could be taboo in another.
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

Annette Campbell wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 12:47 pm Emotions are crucial in our everyday lives. Every day, we spend a significant amount of time seeing and analyzing the emotions of others, as well as deciding how to react to and deal with our own complicated emotional experiences. Since Charles Darwin presented emotion as an evolved faculty, psychologists have offered many distinct and frequently competing conceptual model that explains emotions and emotional expression. Though no commonly recognized theory of emotion exists, emotion theorists agree that emotional experience and expression in several ways, including with faces, voices, and bodies, is critical to human communication. A society's cultural norms and values can influence and shape its members' emotional expressions, and expressions that are permissible and essential for one culture could be taboo in another.
Annette.

The fact that the brain developed from the inside-out leaves little doubt that emotions came before much in the way of thought, emotions are basically a reactionary system. The part of the brain governing emotions is called the R complex, R for the reptilian brain. I believe too that all organisms in order to adapt and survive are of necessity reactive creatures, so, across the board I believe emotions are much more fundamental to life in general. I suspect that creatures forming groups, small societies even pair bonding was responsible for the development of the frontal lobes and higher levels of consciousness. Perhaps is might be measurable the level of intelligence/consciousness by the level of the consistency and intensity of one's socialization. It seems strange to me so little attention is given to this subject in the educational system. I always thought the teachings of Spinoza in this regard might prove a worthy endeavor. The expressions which are permissible and essential are rather the triggers of the same emotions across the board, but yes, very easy to get into trouble if you do not know the norms of a culture your visiting. Interesting to that many of those we find in power do not experience the same emotions as the majority, speaking of psychopaths of course, this is true of all cultures, the world might be a somewhat more peaceful place if there was some way to keep psychopaths out of the halls of power. Emotions are reactions caused to other individuals, who in like kind will react to our expressed emotions--- we are reactionary creatures.
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Agent Smith
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Agent Smith »

Philosophy ain't science and therein lies the rub.
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

Emotions are more elemental than thought processes, coming into being as a means of survival and when in organisms they become imprinted into a species, we call them instincts, instant reactions to a particular stimulus. We know this basically because we know the brain evolved from the inside out. It is often called the R-complex or the reptilian brain. It approaches closely the instantaneous reaction of tactile touch, fight, or flight fall into this category. Emotions tend to be less than precise and offer up false reactions, errors in the interests of safety, this is where fear is recognized as a positive service to survival. Bravery is not always a virtue, in fact, most often not, but in societies, the individual that will sacrifice himself to the many is seen as a hero, so defined by the many. Schopenhauer called this occurrence a metaphysical revelation, for what would possess an individual to such a sacrifice. Schopenhauer's answer is, it's a revelation that you are one with the other, and emotion delivers you up to that sacrifice. Emotions generally speaking are selfish survival mechanisms but in society, this often creates cognitive dissonance, mental stress which is itself emotional. To express emotions is natural but not always wise in the interactions within society, this is in conflict with one's own nature causing much emotional despair.

Science was philosophy, philosophy is its origin.
Iwannaplato
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Iwannaplato »

popeye1945 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 4:50 pm The fact that the brain developed from the inside-out leaves little doubt that emotions came before much in the way of thought, emotions are basically a reactionary system.
Do you believe thoughts are not a reactionary system? If so, then some of your statements about humans being only reactionary are not correct. If you think thoughts are reactionay, then it should be clear here that as far as that is concerned they have nothing over emotions.
The part of the brain governing emotions is called the R complex, R for the reptilian brain.
While the R-complex has something to do with emotions, emotions are much more associatedy with the limbic system. And you can see that reptiles are not the most emotional creatures. But futher....
the triune brain theory is controversial at best and generally consider disconfirmed....
https://medicine.yale.edu/news/yale-med ... ompelling/
https://how-emotions-are-made.com/notes ... %20science.
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
https://cos.northeastern.edu/news/its-t ... nce-myths/
https://mindmatters.ai/2021/03/no-you-d ... man-brain/
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

Iwannaplato wrote: Wed Nov 02, 2022 11:09 pm
popeye1945 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 4:50 pm The fact that the brain developed from the inside-out leaves little doubt that emotions came before much in the way of thought, emotions are basically a reactionary system.
Do you believe thoughts are not a reactionary system? If so, then some of your statements about humans being only reactionary are not correct. If you think thoughts are reactionay, then it should be clear here that as far as that is concerned they have nothing over emotions.
The part of the brain governing emotions is called the R complex, R for the reptilian brain.
While the R-complex has something to do with emotions, emotions are much more associatedy with the limbic system. And you can see that reptiles are not the most emotional creatures. But futher....
the triune brain theory is controversial at best and generally consider disconfirmed....
https://medicine.yale.edu/news/yale-med ... ompelling/
https://how-emotions-are-made.com/notes ... %20science.
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
https://cos.northeastern.edu/news/its-t ... nce-myths/
https://mindmatters.ai/2021/03/no-you-d ... man-brain/
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
The R complex, the limbic system and the neocortex are functionally one brain, but as stated the brain developed from the inside out, thus the body and its central nervous system can also be considered part of the whole brain. The body created or generated the brain which is ultimately a secondary organ in serves the body. I did not state that any part of the brain was not reactionary indeed the organism is fully a reactionary creature in tuned you might say with the music of the spheres. As far as Reptiles are concerned, they are considerably more emotional than they are intellectual. ADDED: Just read an article you posted so I might stand corrected, the women author/scientist wasn't really clear on just how the construct of the brain did occur, so I am all ears. Science is self-correcting!
Iwannaplato
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Iwannaplato »

popeye1945 wrote: Thu Nov 03, 2022 1:10 am
Iwannaplato wrote: Wed Nov 02, 2022 11:09 pm
popeye1945 wrote: Fri Jun 10, 2022 4:50 pm The fact that the brain developed from the inside-out leaves little doubt that emotions came before much in the way of thought, emotions are basically a reactionary system.
Do you believe thoughts are not a reactionary system? If so, then some of your statements about humans being only reactionary are not correct. If you think thoughts are reactionay, then it should be clear here that as far as that is concerned they have nothing over emotions.
The part of the brain governing emotions is called the R complex, R for the reptilian brain.
While the R-complex has something to do with emotions, emotions are much more associatedy with the limbic system. And you can see that reptiles are not the most emotional creatures. But futher....
the triune brain theory is controversial at best and generally consider disconfirmed....
https://medicine.yale.edu/news/yale-med ... ompelling/
https://how-emotions-are-made.com/notes ... %20science.
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
https://cos.northeastern.edu/news/its-t ... nce-myths/
https://mindmatters.ai/2021/03/no-you-d ... man-brain/
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
As far as Reptiles are concerned, they are considerably more emotional than they are intellectual.
Even in the original triune brain hypothesis the limbic system is considered the main center of emotions. Yes, rage, aggression was attributed to the r-complex, but range of emotions we have was limbic. But, as said, the triune brain (development and modular) hypothesis has fallen out of favor.
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

Iwannaplato wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 7:24 am
popeye1945 wrote: Thu Nov 03, 2022 1:10 am
Iwannaplato wrote: Wed Nov 02, 2022 11:09 pm Do you believe thoughts are not a reactionary system? If so, then some of your statements about humans being only reactionary are not correct. If you think thoughts are reactionay, then it should be clear here that as far as that is concerned they have nothing over emotions.

While the R-complex has something to do with emotions, emotions are much more associatedy with the limbic system. And you can see that reptiles are not the most emotional creatures. But futher....
the triune brain theory is controversial at best and generally consider disconfirmed....
https://medicine.yale.edu/news/yale-med ... ompelling/
https://how-emotions-are-made.com/notes ... %20science.
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
https://cos.northeastern.edu/news/its-t ... nce-myths/
https://mindmatters.ai/2021/03/no-you-d ... man-brain/
https://thebrainscientist.com/2018/04/1 ... ard-brain/
As far as Reptiles are concerned, they are considerably more emotional than they are intellectual.
Even in the original triune brain hypothesis the limbic system is considered the main center of emotions. Yes, rage, aggression was attributed to the r-complex, but range of emotions we have was limbic. But, as said, the triune brain (development and modular) hypothesis has fallen out of favor.

Thanks for the heads up Iwannaplato!!
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

popeye1945 wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 12:46 pm
Iwannaplato wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 7:24 am
popeye1945 wrote: Thu Nov 03, 2022 1:10 am
As far as Reptiles are concerned, they are considerably more emotional than they are intellectual.
Even in the original triune brain hypothesis the limbic system is considered the main center of emotions. Yes, rage, aggression was attributed to the r-complex, but range of emotions we have was limbic. But, as said, the triune brain (development and modular) hypothesis has fallen out of favor.

Thanks for the heads up Iwannaplato!! Which of the above is the best link to this new theory?
Iwannaplato
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Iwannaplato »

popeye1945 wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 1:00 pm
popeye1945 wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 12:46 pm
Iwannaplato wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 7:24 am Even in the original triune brain hypothesis the limbic system is considered the main center of emotions. Yes, rage, aggression was attributed to the r-complex, but range of emotions we have was limbic. But, as said, the triune brain (development and modular) hypothesis has fallen out of favor.

Thanks for the heads up Iwannaplato!! Which of the above is the best link to this new theory?
I'm not enough of an expert to say. I am also not sure they argue a new theory, but rather have decided that the triune model doesn't hold.
popeye1945
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by popeye1945 »

Iwannaplato wrote: Sat Nov 12, 2022 8:51 am
popeye1945 wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 1:00 pm
popeye1945 wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 12:46 pm


Thanks for the heads up Iwannaplato!! Which of the above is the best link to this new theory?
I'm not enough of an expert to say. I am also not sure they argue a new theory, but rather have decided that the triune model doesn't hold.
It does seem logical to affirm at least that the brain evolved from the inside out, that much seems self-evident.
Walker
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Re: Expressing Emotions

Post by Walker »

I Like Sushu wrote: Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:57 am What comes more natural to the human heart the desire to express “positive” thoughts of joy, hope optimism and love, or the desire to express “negative” thoughts of pain, suffering, hate, rage and pessimism?

My view is that people generally have a natural disposition to express more “negative” thoughts and feelings than they do more “positive” thoughts and feelings.

Also, what are your thoughts about “Cartharsis” in respect to Aristotle and the various interpretations of this term (not particularly interested in dictionary definitions as this has remained a contentious issue among scholars for quite some time!)
If you're too happy someone will try to take that away from you. This is why folks are reluctant to discuss their wealth, especially with the gubberment. Like happiness, someone will try to take that away. Happiness is the first wealth.

Expressing ... bitching made beautiful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfbClAFWXDk
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