Rights
Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:57 am
Is the only way for one group to gain rights is for other groups to give up on theirs?
PhilX
PhilX
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Men did lose some of their power that comes with the right to vote (a diluted vote in effect).-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:04 am With regard to the Opening Post:
Best is to go with some examples.
Women gained the right to vote. Men did not lose their right to vote.
In many countries, some minority religions gained a right to practice their religion. Those who had been practicing the mainline religion, did not lose their right to practice their religion.
Hola. You must name a checkable fact of a power lost by a male or some males that came with the the right for females to vote. It is your duty and responsibility to provide an example.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:18 amMen did lose some of their power that comes with the right to vote (a diluted vote in effect).-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:04 am With regard to the Opening Post:
Best is to go with some examples.
Women gained the right to vote. Men did not lose their right to vote.
In many countries, some minority religions gained a right to practice their religion. Those who had been practicing the mainline religion, did not lose their right to practice their religion.
PhilX
I thought my response was straightforward. Here's an example:-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:37 amHola. You must name a checkable fact of a power lost by a male or some males that came with the the right for females to vote. It is your duty and responsibility to provide an example.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:18 amMen did lose some of their power that comes with the right to vote (a diluted vote in effect).-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:04 am With regard to the Opening Post:
Best is to go with some examples.
Women gained the right to vote. Men did not lose their right to vote.
In many countries, some minority religions gained a right to practice their religion. Those who had been practicing the mainline religion, did not lose their right to practice their religion.
PhilX
Yes, your response was straightforward. You just repeated it, thanks. I understood it the first time around, that's not what the problem was. The problem was, which you are trying carefully and desparately not address, that RIGHTS HAVE NOT BEEN LOST BY GIVING THE SAME RIGHT TO SOME OTHERS.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:47 am I thought my response was straightforward. Here's an example:
Suppose there are 1,000,000 males voters. Now suppose there are two candidates, A and B. If 501,000 men vote for A and the law specifies a simple majority, then A wins.
Same situation except now there are 1,000,000 male voters and 1,000,000 female voters. Now if 501,000 men vote for A and 502,000 women vote for B, then B wins under this scenario.
Plain enough?
PhilX
I'm saying that when rights are shared, they may be lost (depending). If they're not shared, then there's nothing to lose. I don't see a straw man fallacy in this case.-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:00 pmYes, your response was straightforward. You just repeated it, thanks. I understood it the first time around, that's not what the problem was. The problem was, which you are trying carefully and desparately not address, that RIGHTS HAVE NOT BEEN LOST BY GIVING THE SAME RIGHT TO SOME OTHERS.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:47 am I thought my response was straightforward. Here's an example:
Suppose there are 1,000,000 males voters. Now suppose there are two candidates, A and B. If 501,000 men vote for A and the law specifies a simple majority, then A wins.
Same situation except now there are 1,000,000 male voters and 1,000,000 female voters. Now if 501,000 men vote for A and 502,000 women vote for B, then B wins under this scenario.
Plain enough?
PhilX
You are sticking to your Strawman like a tic to a coondog. I don't want more hypothetical explanations. I want a real life example to back up your claim. And don't come up with a real life example how some lose POWER; that was not the original claim. Show us real life example that some lost their rights because the same rights were given to others.
Language comprehension is not rocket science. Just read the claim, and address it, not something different. Power is not the same as rights. I don't want a discussion now how power and rights have common overlapping areas. I want you to give me / us a real life example how giving the same right as one have to others makes one lose that right.
This is my second request, and I can't be any clearer. If you again waffle and dodge and do a Strawman, I'm quitting here.
In other words, you keep on waffling and avoiding quoting an actual occurrence of your claim. The third time you repeated an obvious hypothetical event, despite my obvious and clear message that it would not be necessary.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:06 pmI'm saying that when rights are shared, they may be lost (depending). If they're not shared, then there's nothing to lose. I don't see a straw man fallacy in this case.-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:00 pmYes, your response was straightforward. You just repeated it, thanks. I understood it the first time around, that's not what the problem was. The problem was, which you are trying carefully and desparately not address, that RIGHTS HAVE NOT BEEN LOST BY GIVING THE SAME RIGHT TO SOME OTHERS.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 3:47 am I thought my response was straightforward. Here's an example:
Suppose there are 1,000,000 males voters. Now suppose there are two candidates, A and B. If 501,000 men vote for A and the law specifies a simple majority, then A wins.
Same situation except now there are 1,000,000 male voters and 1,000,000 female voters. Now if 501,000 men vote for A and 502,000 women vote for B, then B wins under this scenario.
Plain enough?
PhilX
You are sticking to your Strawman like a tic to a coondog. I don't want more hypothetical explanations. I want a real life example to back up your claim. And don't come up with a real life example how some lose POWER; that was not the original claim. Show us real life example that some lost their rights because the same rights were given to others.
Language comprehension is not rocket science. Just read the claim, and address it, not something different. Power is not the same as rights. I don't want a discussion now how power and rights have common overlapping areas. I want you to give me / us a real life example how giving the same right as one have to others makes one lose that right.
This is my second request, and I can't be any clearer. If you again waffle and dodge and do a Strawman, I'm quitting here.
PhilX
I equate voting rights with power-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:34 pmIn other words, you keep on waffling and avoiding quoting an actual occurrence of your claim. The third time you repeated an obvious hypothetical event, despite my obvious and clear message that it would not be necessary.Philosophy Explorer wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:06 pmI'm saying that when rights are shared, they may be lost (depending). If they're not shared, then there's nothing to lose. I don't see a straw man fallacy in this case.-1- wrote: βWed Apr 04, 2018 10:00 pm
Yes, your response was straightforward. You just repeated it, thanks. I understood it the first time around, that's not what the problem was. The problem was, which you are trying carefully and desparately not address, that RIGHTS HAVE NOT BEEN LOST BY GIVING THE SAME RIGHT TO SOME OTHERS.
You are sticking to your Strawman like a tic to a coondog. I don't want more hypothetical explanations. I want a real life example to back up your claim. And don't come up with a real life example how some lose POWER; that was not the original claim. Show us real life example that some lost their rights because the same rights were given to others.
Language comprehension is not rocket science. Just read the claim, and address it, not something different. Power is not the same as rights. I don't want a discussion now how power and rights have common overlapping areas. I want you to give me / us a real life example how giving the same right as one have to others makes one lose that right.
This is my second request, and I can't be any clearer. If you again waffle and dodge and do a Strawman, I'm quitting here.
PhilX
..Which is a huge mistake.