Philosophy Now Forum

WIKI:-
Ancasta was a Celtic goddess worshipped in Roman Britain. She is known from a single dedicatory inscription found in the United Kingdom at the Roman settlement of Clausentum (Bitterne, near Southampton). Ancasta may be taken to be a local goddess, possibly associated with the nearby River Itchen.

The votive dedication to Ancasta reads:
DEAE ANCASTAE GEMINVS MANI VSLM
"To the goddess Ancasta, Geminus Mani[lius] willingly and deservedly fulfills his vow."

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

I was born between the River Itchen and Test and used to travel through Bitterne for secondary school..hence my interest.

A while ago i searched and searched again for reference to this Geminus Mani[lius] - i found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England.

Since, i have lost whatever i sourced - perhaps on an old HDD, who knows. My question here is, do you think this Roman (i'm presuming he's a Roman) would be some sort of 'general' or at least someone of importance within a Roman Legion?

I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

attofishpi wrote:WIKI:-
Ancasta was a Celtic goddess worshipped in Roman Britain. She is known from a single dedicatory inscription found in the United Kingdom at the Roman settlement of Clausentum (Bitterne, near Southampton). Ancasta may be taken to be a local goddess, possibly associated with the nearby River Itchen.

The votive dedication to Ancasta reads:
DEAE ANCASTAE GEMINVS MANI VSLM
"To the goddess Ancasta, Geminus Mani[lius] willingly and deservedly fulfills his vow."

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

I was born between the River Itchen and Test and used to travel through Bitterne for secondary school..hence my interest.

A while ago i searched and searched again for reference to this Geminus Mani[lius] - i found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England.

Since, i have lost whatever i sourced - perhaps on an old HDD, who knows. My question here is, do you think this Roman (i'm presuming he's a Roman) would be some sort of 'general' or at least someone of importance within a Roman Legion?

I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

This is just a factor of your ignorance of history. There is nothing remarkable about this.

eg you said; "I found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England."
Ancient Rome was never, could never be associated with England, as there was no such place whilst Rome ruled in these Isles.

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

attofishpi wrote:WIKI:-
Ancasta was a Celtic goddess worshipped in Roman Britain. She is known from a single dedicatory inscription found in the United Kingdom at the Roman settlement of Clausentum (Bitterne, near Southampton). Ancasta may be taken to be a local goddess, possibly associated with the nearby River Itchen.

The votive dedication to Ancasta reads:
DEAE ANCASTAE GEMINVS MANI VSLM
"To the goddess Ancasta, Geminus Mani[lius] willingly and deservedly fulfills his vow."

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

I was born between the River Itchen and Test and used to travel through Bitterne for secondary school..hence my interest.

A while ago i searched and searched again for reference to this Geminus Mani[lius] - i found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England.

Since, i have lost whatever i sourced - perhaps on an old HDD, who knows. My question here is, do you think this Roman (i'm presuming he's a Roman) would be some sort of 'general' or at least someone of importance within a Roman Legion?

I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

This is just a factor of your ignorance of history. There is nothing remarkable about this.

..and results in your condescending arrogance. What here is not remarkable to you?

Hobbes' Choice wrote:eg you said; "I found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England."
Ancient Rome was never, could never be associated with England, as there was no such place whilst Rome ruled in these Isles.

Your point being that England as a term for a landmass never existed?

attofishpi wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

attofishpi wrote:WIKI:-
Ancasta was a Celtic goddess worshipped in Roman Britain. She is known from a single dedicatory inscription found in the United Kingdom at the Roman settlement of Clausentum (Bitterne, near Southampton). Ancasta may be taken to be a local goddess, possibly associated with the nearby River Itchen.

The votive dedication to Ancasta reads:
DEAE ANCASTAE GEMINVS MANI VSLM
"To the goddess Ancasta, Geminus Mani[lius] willingly and deservedly fulfills his vow."

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

I was born between the River Itchen and Test and used to travel through Bitterne for secondary school..hence my interest.

A while ago i searched and searched again for reference to this Geminus Mani[lius] - i found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England.

Since, i have lost whatever i sourced - perhaps on an old HDD, who knows. My question here is, do you think this Roman (i'm presuming he's a Roman) would be some sort of 'general' or at least someone of importance within a Roman Legion?

I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

This is just a factor of your ignorance of history. There is nothing remarkable about this.

..and results in your condescending arrogance. What here is not remarkable to you?

Hobbes' Choice wrote:eg you said; "I found some resources but nothing to account for a particular Roman associated by the name with anything related to England."
Ancient Rome was never, could never be associated with England, as there was no such place whilst Rome ruled in these Isles.

Your point being that England as a term for a landmass never existed?

Correct England was NEVER a landmass.

As for Geminus it was likely that he was a Briton, despite his Romanised name. If he was Roman by birth there is nothing odd about a dedication to a genius loci. What became known as "Paganism" was a fully polytheistic set of religions.

But since the example you give is the ONLY single example of "Ancasta" ever to be found in anywhere, there is not much you can say about her.
Her name could as easily be from Casto meaning pure. Or casta meaning Lineage. Or a thousand other words.

And there is absolutely NO reason why she should be called Celtic.

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

The prefix 'an' is frequently seen in place names and I understand it's one of the Celtic water or waterways prefixes. River names tend to be the oldest sort of place names. It would be interesting to know if either or the rivers which Attofishpi knows so intimately is at all swift.

attofishpi wrote:...I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

Pretty much up until the time of Constantine, it was generally Roman practice to tolerate the local mythology. It was all part of the 'hearts and minds' strategy. The Romans had learnt the hard way that people are never so violent as when they are defending their cherished beliefs, which most of us on this forum have some experience of. So it would not be a surprise if it was someone of importance, leading by example and showing respect for the local custom. Much easier than beating it out of them.

Gods of place are important for all pagans and so the Romans would naturally adopt the local gods of place. It's the location that matters about gods of place.

Belinda wrote:

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

The prefix 'an' is frequently seen in place names and I understand it's one of the Celtic water or waterways prefixes..

Examples?

I know of no language where river is spelled with anything like AN, beginning with an or anything similar.
So where are you getting this from?

uwot wrote:

attofishpi wrote:...I find it extremely intriguing if this is someone of importance within a Roman legion, its quite a submission isn't it?

Pretty much up until the time of Constantine, it was generally Roman practice to tolerate the local mythology. It was all part of the 'hearts and minds' strategy. The Romans had learnt the hard way that people are never so violent as when they are defending their cherished beliefs, which most of us on this forum have some experience of. So it would not be a surprise if it was someone of importance, leading by example and showing respect for the local custom. Much easier than beating it out of them.

Before Constantine no one was ever interested in beating anything out of anyone.
The Roman empire was in a constant state of syncretism, adaptation, adoption and inclusion.
Right through the imperial period there was only one requirement and that was to include the divine Julian family as part of your pantheon; to honour the emperor.
Cults were allowed to spread and grow. It was only the Christians that insulted this tradition.
Subject people's adopted foreign and Roman gods and Romans adopted foreign gods.

When the Christians got power the shit hit the fan, and all the old traditions were stereotyped as "Pagan", and they were persecuted whereso ever Christianity spread. This was a burning issue' literally.

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

Belinda wrote:

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

The prefix 'an' is frequently seen in place names and I understand it's one of the Celtic water or waterways prefixes..

Examples?

I know of no language where river is spelled with anything like AN, beginning with an or anything similar.
So where are you getting this from?

I think it's the Celtic abhainn. The spelling changes, and the sound is shortened. Another common one is aln or alan for river or stream, and this can get shortened to al or ale.

Attofishpi wrote:

It may be possible that the name 'Ancasta' is related to Proto-Celtic *kasto- meaning 'swift'.

That supposition interests me because ancient river names often refer to the character of the water, such as swift, dark, red, white.

Hobbes' Choice wrote:Right through the imperial period there was only one requirement and that was to include the divine Julian family as part of your pantheon; to honour the emperor.

Up to a point. Prior to the imperial period, Rome had been a lot more aggressive, they flattened Carthage and Corinth, for example. Having firmly established who was boss, the Romans eased up, but when Jerusalem rebelled, in AD 60 something, they flattened that, including Herod's Temple, building a pagan temple on the ruins to hammer the point home.

Belinda wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

Belinda wrote:
The prefix 'an' is frequently seen in place names and I understand it's one of the Celtic water or waterways prefixes..

Examples?

I know of no language where river is spelled with anything like AN, beginning with an or anything similar.
So where are you getting this from?

I think it's the Celtic abhainn. The spelling changes, and the sound is shortened. Another common one is aln or alan for river or stream, and this can get shortened to al or ale.

I think not.

uwot wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:Right through the imperial period there was only one requirement and that was to include the divine Julian family as part of your pantheon; to honour the emperor.

Up to a point. Prior to the imperial period, Rome had been a lot more aggressive, they flattened Carthage and Corinth, for example. Having firmly established who was boss, the Romans eased up, but when Jerusalem rebelled, in AD 60 something, they flattened that, including Herod's Temple, building a pagan temple on the ruins to hammer the point home.

Herod was king of the Jews - they were monotheists.

Hobbes' Choice wrote:Herod was king of the Jews - they were monotheists.

Well yes; are you making a point?

uwot wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:Herod was king of the Jews - they were monotheists.

Well yes; are you making a point?

Yes exactly the same point I made above. Rome was religiously liberal and allowed all cults to thrive, with the single proviso I mentioned that monotheists felt unable to comply with.
In other words, what you said did not diminish the point I'd made already.