Feel free to agree or disagree
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Feel free to agree or disagree
If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it fall, does the tree make a sound?
My answer is: "No"
My answer is: "No"
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
My budgie said it was quite loud.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 12:32 pm If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it fall, does the tree make a sound?
My answer is: "No"
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Disambiguate what the word "sound" means and the answer becomes clear. It's only a riddle because "sound" can mean multiple things at once
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Well said. When I use the word sound, I use it to refer to the experience I perceive when air molecules hit my ear drum in such a way as air molecules do when a tree falls in the forest. I'm assuming that what my ear drums send to my brain and what the brain experiences from it are not part of or identical with the air molecules themselves. And therefore if I am not present, then no such "experience" exists or is happening within range of the air molecules that tree makes.Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:05 pm Disambiguate what the word "sound" means and the answer becomes clear. It's only a riddle because "sound" can mean multiple things at once
Of course, it may ultimately be an assumption on my part, I'll acknowledge that.
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
If sound means the experience, and there's no one around to have the experience, then the experience isn't happening. Easy one.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:15 pmWell said. When I use the word sound, I use it to refer to the experienceFlannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:05 pm Disambiguate what the word "sound" means and the answer becomes clear. It's only a riddle because "sound" can mean multiple things at once
If sound instead means the waves of air pressure, then the answer would be different.
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
That's the way I see it as well.Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:24 pmIf sound means the experience, and there's no one around to have the experience, then the experience isn't happening. Easy one.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:15 pmWell said. When I use the word sound, I use it to refer to the experienceFlannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:05 pm Disambiguate what the word "sound" means and the answer becomes clear. It's only a riddle because "sound" can mean multiple things at once
If sound instead means the waves of air pressure, then the answer would be different.
Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
If you were to put a video and sound recording device in the forest when no one was around and a tree did fall close enough to the recording device, then would you be able to better answer your question here, or at least answer it more efficiently or more effectively?
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
if you fell in the forest, would you make a sound?
the tree was screaming at the squirrels upon which he landed...
that was the last thing the squirrels heard...
-Imp
the tree was screaming at the squirrels upon which he landed...
that was the last thing the squirrels heard...
-Imp
Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Re: "Feel free to agree or disagree"
If you feel free, are you really free?
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
That's an interesting question. If no one was around to hear the recording, would that still be "sound" that the recording is making? And do other living beings also translate particles colliding with each other as "sound" in the same way I do? So for example if an insect were there when the tree fell, would the tree falling make a sound as perceived by the insect?Age wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:51 pm If you were to put a video and sound recording device in the forest when no one was around and a tree did fall close enough to the recording device, then would you be able to better answer your question here, or at least answer it more efficiently or more effectively?
Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Would there still be sound if the absent human thought that the O on the power toggle switch meant "Off" rather than "On"?Age wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:51 pm If you were to put a video and sound recording device in the forest when no one was around and a tree did fall close enough to the recording device, then would you be able to better answer your question here, or at least answer it more efficiently or more effectively?
Such human devices are merely extensions of the human senses, which are suspect in ways yet discovered, now that AI has a say.
In other words, what if the video and sound recording device were not functioning? Would there still be sound?
Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Would 'what' still be sound?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 12:00 amThat's an interesting question. If no one was around to hear the recording, would that still be "sound" that the recording is making?Age wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:51 pm If you were to put a video and sound recording device in the forest when no one was around and a tree did fall close enough to the recording device, then would you be able to better answer your question here, or at least answer it more efficiently or more effectively?
What is the first 'that' word referring to, exactly?
Does the ability of other beings 'to know' what you are talking about and referring to when you use the 'sound' word, answer your question here, sufficiently enough, for you?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 12:00 am And do other living beings also translate particles colliding with each other as "sound" in the same way I do?
If a tree falling makes a sound, as perceived as a tree falling sound by an insect, then yes the tree falling would make a sound, well to that insect anyway, and to all the other tree falling sound sensing beings who are close enough to sense 'that sound'.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 12:00 am So for example if an insect were there when the tree fell, would the tree falling make a sound as perceived by the insect?
Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Would there still be a sound to who or what, exactly?Walker wrote: ↑Thu May 23, 2024 12:16 amWould there still be sound if the absent human thought that the O on the power toggle switch meant "Off" rather than "On"?Age wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2024 2:51 pm If you were to put a video and sound recording device in the forest when no one was around and a tree did fall close enough to the recording device, then would you be able to better answer your question here, or at least answer it more efficiently or more effectively?
Who cares?
It could be said and argued that human senses, themselves, might be suspect anyway, right?
Then the video and sound recording device were just not working.
Is it possible to find, or make, a video and sound recording device that does work?
If yes, then just use that one.
But, if no, then are you sure?
Last edited by Age on Thu May 23, 2024 9:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Feel free to agree or disagree
Very true.
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