On Marriage

Anything to do with gender and the status of women and men.

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Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Alexiev wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 8:54 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 12:47 pm Some people are just born to need their own space and independance all the time. Marriage for these people would be a mistake, it would be suffocating, uncomfortable, cause anxiety and stress to the solitude loving person. These people are quite happy in their own world and don't need others to complete or entertain them, or need approval from them, they are already comfortable in their own skin and need nothing from others.
All true. But parents, if they don't shirk their responsibilities, give up their independence more than married people do.
These two 'things' could NOT be ANY FURTHER APART.

'Being there' FOR 'children', and, 'being there' FOR 'an adult' could NOT be FURTHER APART here. Although, and OBVIOUSLY 'you', adult human beings, in the days when this was being written, were STILL CLEARLY NOT YET FULLY FORMED.
Alexiev wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 8:54 pm In fact, responsible co-parents commit to living near each other during their children's youth. So they lose independence both to their children and their children's other parent.
And would I be Wrong in SAYING that 'this' is EXACTLY what 'you' DID?

Considering your last post and this one here could there be some what is referred to as 'VIRTUE SIGNALLING' going on?
Last edited by Age on Fri Nov 17, 2023 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Philosphicalous
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Philosphicalous »

The so-called Family Court and the Legal Process surprised me. I'm not bitter towards my wife about any of this although some of the things she said about me in her affidavit were outright lies. Once she called a lawyer as did I, the process was out of both of our hands. If I could share one thing from the heart, if there are any men/women going through a divorce that has somehow involved losing access to their children, please don't waste your time on a lawyer. Hang in there. No one can take your children away from you forever THE FAMILY COURT understands and FULLY supports the value and need for a child to have his daddy. It hurts like hell, don't give up, and no, the world is not better off without you, your children need you, so DON'T YOU DARE. The best advice I can give is don't let yourself go, and Build Something.


Another big surprise was when the judge said to me she had never seen anyone jump through hoops as well as me before and asked me if I'd ever been in the Circus.
Philosphicalous
Posts: 131
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Philosphicalous »

Philosphicalous wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:36 am The so-called Family Court and the Legal Process surprised me. I'm not bitter towards my wife about any of this although some of the things she said about me in her affidavit were outright lies. Once she called a lawyer as did I, the process was out of both of our hands. If I could share one thing from the heart, if there are any men/women going through a divorce that has somehow involved losing access to their children, please don't waste your time on a lawyer. Hang in there. No one can take your children away from you forever THE FAMILY COURT understands and FULLY supports the value and need for a child to have his daddy. It hurts like hell, don't give up, and no, the world is not better off without you, your children need you, so DON'T YOU DARE. The best advice I can give is don't let yourself go, and Build Something. Oh, and I flushed thirty grand and countless tears and anguish down the phone to my lawyer. Everybody including my lawyer took a twisted satisfactiOn in advising me that my wife's lawyer waS know AS THE HARDEST ASS IN THE GAME. REAL MANHATER, I CONCLUDED FROM THAT REMARK.


Another big surprise was when the judge said to me she had never seen anyone jump through hoops as well as me before and asked me if I'd ever been in the Circus.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am
Alexiev wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 8:54 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 12:47 pm Some people are just born to need their own space and independance all the time. Marriage for these people would be a mistake, it would be suffocating, uncomfortable, cause anxiety and stress to the solitude loving person. These people are quite happy in their own world and don't need others to complete or entertain them, or need approval from them, they are already comfortable in their own skin and need nothing from others.
All true. But parents, if they don't shirk their responsibilities, give up their independence more than married people do. In fact, responsible co-parents commit to living near each other during their children's youth. So they lose independence both to their children and their children's other parent.
People automatically lose their personal freedom and independance when they have children, that's for sure, because it's the moral duty of anyone who chooses to bring life into the world to be responsible for them, and it can be for some parents a life long commitment.
VERY True.

The WHOLE PURPOSE of HAVING children, and BRINGING 'them' INTO this, (One and ONLY), Life IS TO 'be there' FOR 'them', ALWAYS, and UNCONDITIONALLY.

That is; OBVIOUSLY, UNTIL 'they' BECOME adults.

Then, and ONLY THEN, one can GO BACK TO 'their OWN self'.

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am So we have to think very carefully before choosing to have children whether we want to give up our independance and be responsible for an other human being for the rest of it's life.
VERY True, AGAIN.

The REASON the 'marriage' word WAS CHOSEN in 'religious texts' had, and has, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH 'certificates, states, governments, churches, signatures NOR approvals' FROM "others", but when 'two' WANT TO BECOME 'one', like when 'marrying' DIFFERENT 'colors of paint' TOGETHER as One, or when JOINING 'two' DIFFERENT 'pieces of wood' TOGETHER, as One, and they FEEL 'responsible' or 'grown up' ENOUGH, and feel READY ENOUGH, TO raise, or rear, 'their' OWN children. THEN 'they' will COME-TOGETHER and, literally, MAKE LOVE, that is; A child.

NO paper NOR signatures are NEEDED for 'this'. NEVER has been and NEVER will be.
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am It's the risk we take, when choosing to make new life, knowing that the person they have brought into the world, might not like being alive,
A human being ONLY does NOT like 'being alive' ONLY IF and ONLY WHEN 'they' have NOT been RAISED, nor REARED, PROPERLY AND Correctly.
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am and may feel no obligation to be thankful for being born, or may feel they have any responsibilty to their parents well being as they age and get older and older, when they too are of an age where they are needing the care from somebody else to help them survive.
1. If ANY one feels NO OBLIGATION AT ALL to be THANKFUL for 'being alive', then that IS a PUREST SIGN that 'that one' has NOT been 'brought up' PROPERLY, AND Correctly.

2. If ANY child feels ANY 'responsibility' to 'their parents', then that is ANOTHER PURE SIGN of NOT being 'brought up' PROPERLY, AND Correctly.

3. If ANY one does NOT feel ANY 'responsibility' to 'their parents', then that is ALSO A PURE SIGN of NOT being 'brought up' PROPERLY, AND Correctly.

For SURELY if ANY adult human being is NOT caring for "another human being" who has reached an age where 'they' are needing care from "someone else" to help 'them' survive, then 'that adult human being' has NOT been 'brought up' PROPERLY, and Correctly. AND, if ANY parent human being who has reached an age and is NEEDING care and 'their' previous children do NOT care ABOUT 'them' or are NOT CARING FOR 'them', then 'those children' WERE OBVIOUSLY NOT 'brought up' PROPERLY, and Correctly.
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am All just my opinions of course.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Alexiev wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:16 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am


People automatically lose their personal freedom and independance when they have children, that's for sure, because it's the moral duty of anyone who chooses to bring life into the world to be responsible for them, and it can be for some parents a life long commitment. So we have to think very carefully before choosing to have children whether we want to give up our independance and be responsible for an other human being for the rest of it's life.
"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose" as Kris Kristofferson might say. We give it up in all our moral and responsible interactions. All our human rights are nothing more than responsibilities on yhe part of others. Of course you are right that parents (whether they "choose" to have children or not) have more responsibilities rhan most others.
So, TO 'you', when one is RAPED, and impregnated, then 'they' AUTOMATICALLY TAKE ON 'more responsibilities, than most others', right?

Either way, I would suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" takes ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". Unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm
Alexiev wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:16 pm "Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose" as Kris Kristofferson might say.
I agree, we have nothing left to lose in a life no one asked for in the first place, so what is there to lose, but our life?
BUT 'you' NEVER 'lose' 'a, nor your, life'. That is because of WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS AFTER 'the body' STOPS breathing and STOPS pumping blood.
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm And that's why we take responsibilty for our lives and our children's because what other choice do we have,
The CHOICE to NOT 'take responsibility' FOR 'one's life' and/or FOR 'children's lives'.
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm now we are here alive and making other people alive, we don't seem to want our life or their life to come to an end, that's why we choose to have offspring.
SO, there MUST BE some sort of being THANKFULNESS involved here FOR 'being here', and 'alive', IN Life?
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm
Alexiev wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:16 pm We give it up in all our moral and responsible interactions. All our human rights are nothing more than responsibilities on yhe part of others. Of course you are right that parents (whether they "choose" to have children or not) have more responsibilities rhan most others.
We give up our freedom once we have children or choose to be in relationship with anyone.
WHAT 'freedom' are 'you', people, here even talking ABOUT?

For example;

WHAT 'freedom' do 'you', supposedly, 'give up' once 'you' 'have children'?

WHAT 'freedom' do 'you', supposedly, 'give up' once 'you' CHOOSE to be in a relationship with ANY one?
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm Freedom is such a meaningless word now because as long as we are alive, we are never free,
As an fully grown, or fully fledged, adult human being, 'you' ARE ABSOLUTELY FREE, and ALWAYS ABSOLUTELY FREE.

WHY do 'you' CONSIDER that 'you' ARE NOT FREE, and worse still NEVER FREE, "dontaskme"?
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm we are bound to being alive,
There is ABSOLUTE NO 'bounding' to 'being alive', whatsoever, AT ALL.

What do 'you' IMAGINE 'it' IS, EXACTLY, which is, supposedly, 'bounding you' to 'being alive'?
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:04 pm and there is no escape from it as long as we continue to procreate.
I have YET TO SEE ABSOLUTELY ANY 'thing' that is BOUNDING 'you', HOLDING 'you' BACK, and/or KEEPING 'you' FROM BEING ABSOLUTELY FREE.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Philosphicalous wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:36 am The so-called Family Court and the Legal Process surprised me. I'm not bitter towards my wife about any of this although some of the things she said about me in her affidavit were outright lies. Once she called a lawyer as did I, the process was out of both of our hands. If I could share one thing from the heart, if there are any men/women going through a divorce that has somehow involved losing access to their children, please don't waste your time on a lawyer. Hang in there. No one can take your children away from you forever THE FAMILY COURT understands and FULLY supports the value and need for a child to have his daddy. It hurts like hell, don't give up, and no, the world is not better off without you, your children need you, so DON'T YOU DARE. The best advice I can give is don't let yourself go, and Build Something.


Another big surprise was when the judge said to me she had never seen anyone jump through hoops as well as me before and asked me if I'd ever been in the Circus.
Which could be taken in at least TWO different ways.

By the way, if you would like to ADD more to an already submitted response, there is an 'edit' button you can use.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Philosphicalous wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:36 am The so-called Family Court and the Legal Process surprised me. I'm not bitter towards my wife about any of this although some of the things she said about me in her affidavit were outright lies. Once she called a lawyer as did I, the process was out of both of our hands. If I could share one thing from the heart, if there are any men/women going through a divorce that has somehow involved losing access to their children, please don't waste your time on a lawyer. Hang in there. No one can take your children away from you forever THE FAMILY COURT understands and FULLY supports the value and need for a child to have his daddy. It hurts like hell, don't give up, and no, the world is not better off without you, your children need you, so DON'T YOU DARE. The best advice I can give is don't let yourself go, and Build Something. Oh, and I flushed thirty grand and countless tears and anguish down the phone to my lawyer. Everybody including my lawyer took a twisted satisfactiOn in advising me that my wife's lawyer waS know AS THE HARDEST ASS IN THE GAME. REAL MANHATER, I CONCLUDED FROM THAT REMARK.
Have you ever considered that 'your lawyer' and 'your wife's lawyer' could have been conspiring together over 'paid for' lunches, and/or dinners, on what to each tell 'their clients', which would produce the most HATRED in 'both of you', which would then lead to MORE TIME spent in court, and thus MORE MONEY going 'into their pockets'?
Philosphicalous wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:39 am Another big surprise was when the judge said to me she had never seen anyone jump through hoops as well as me before and asked me if I'd ever been in the Circus.
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Lacewing
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Lacewing »

Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:34 am
Lacewing wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 4:55 pm In fact, responsible co-parents commit to living near each other during their children's youth. So they lose independence both to their children and their children's other parent.
And would I be Wrong in SAYING that 'this' is EXACTLY what 'you' DID?

Considering your last post and this one here could there be some what is referred to as 'VIRTUE SIGNALLING' going on?
I did not write that quote. Age, if you can't get the quote function correct, such that you keep attributing things to people which they didn't say, perhaps this posting process is too difficult for you. It's bad enough that you continually misinterpret what people are saying... blabbing on and on with your mistaken assumptions which people rarely care to wade through or correct... but now you are falsely and repeatedly attributing statements to people.
Walker
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Walker »

Lacewing wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:25 pm
Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:34 am
Lacewing wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 4:55 pm In fact, responsible co-parents commit to living near each other during their children's youth. So they lose independence both to their children and their children's other parent.
And would I be Wrong in SAYING that 'this' is EXACTLY what 'you' DID?

Considering your last post and this one here could there be some what is referred to as 'VIRTUE SIGNALLING' going on?
I did not write that quote. Age, if you can't get the quote function correct, such that you keep attributing things to people which they didn't say, perhaps this posting process is too difficult for you. It's bad enough that you continually misinterpret what people are saying... blabbing on and on with your mistaken assumptions which people rarely care to wade through or correct... but now you are falsely and repeatedly attributing statements to people.
If Walker had said what Lacewing just said when Age misquoted Walker as Lacewing in other discussions, then Lacewing might not have had to make this posting now, and Age would be further along the path of practicing EXACTNESS in thought, word, and indeed, deed. But should I hang my head in shame at this personal negligence to the betterment of Age's transmissions? Nay, I say. It led to this emphasis on the error, and perhaps rather than make a request that will be immediately countermanded by Age's action of more misquotes as assertion of independence from conventional attributions, this here indirect approach may have more of the intended effect, along with the EXACTNESS attention grabber of capitalization.
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Lacewing wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:25 pm
Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:34 am
Alexiev wrote: Sat Sep 16, 2023 8:54 pm In fact, responsible co-parents commit to living near each other during their children's youth. So they lose independence both to their children and their children's other parent.
And would I be Wrong in SAYING that 'this' is EXACTLY what 'you' DID?

Considering your last post and this one here could there be some what is referred to as 'VIRTUE SIGNALLING' going on?
I did not write that quote.
Okay. My MISTAKE. I APOLOGIZE.
Lacewing wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:25 pm Age, if you can't get the quote function correct, such that you keep attributing things to people which they didn't say, perhaps this posting process is too difficult for you. It's bad enough that you continually misinterpret what people are saying...
If I EVER MISINTERPRET ANY 'thing' someone says, then I just suggest that 'they' INFORM 'me' and the 'readers' of WHAT I MISINTERPRETED and WHAT the Correction IS, EXACTLY. you KNOW like how what you just did here when 'you' INFORMED 'me', and the 'readers', of when I quoted you Incorrectly.

It REALLY IS NOT that hard.

After all Correcting False, Wrong, Inaccurate, and/or Incorrect WORDING is EXACTLY PART OF what TAKES PLACE in philosophical discussions, and in philosophy forums.
Lacewing wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:25 pm blabbing on and on with your mistaken assumptions which people rarely care to wade through or correct...
AGAIN, I suggest that if there is a MISTAKE and/or a MISTAKEN ASSUMPTION absolutely ANYWHERE, and you KNOW of 'it', then just Correct 'it'.

Doing so BENEFITS ALL involved.

After all, the standard, or mess, that 'you walk past', as some would say, is the standard, and mess, that 'you accept'.
Lacewing wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 3:25 pm but now you are falsely and repeatedly attributing statements to people.
Do you SEE my MISTAKE here as being the 'end of the world', or some 'thing' else?

THANK you for BRINGING-TO-LIGHT my MISTAKE. I have Corrected 'it' now ALREADY.

I was NOT purposely falsely attributing statements to people, I JUST MADE A MISTAKE.

Also, just out of curiosity I am wondering HOW you even got to see this post of mine if I am on your ignore list?
Alexiev
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Alexiev »

Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:59 am
Alexiev wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:16 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:21 am


People automatically lose their personal freedom and independance when they have children, that's for sure, because it's the moral duty of anyone who chooses to bring life into the world to be responsible for them, and it can be for some parents a life long commitment. So we have to think very carefully before choosing to have children whether we want to give up our independance and be responsible for an other human being for the rest of it's life.
"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose" as Kris Kristofferson might say. We give it up in all our moral and responsible interactions. All our human rights are nothing more than responsibilities on yhe part of others. Of course you are right that parents (whether they "choose" to have children or not) have more responsibilities rhan most others.
So, TO 'you', when one is RAPED, and impregnated, then 'they' AUTOMATICALLY TAKE ON 'more responsibilities, than most others', right?

Either way, I would suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" takes ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". Unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.
Even by your low standards, AGE, this post is looney. Why don't we just hand over all children to rapists? Maybe -- just maybe -- children are better off being raised by non-rapists. Or don't you care about the welfare of children?
Age
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Age »

Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am
Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:59 am
Alexiev wrote: Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:16 pm

"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose" as Kris Kristofferson might say. We give it up in all our moral and responsible interactions. All our human rights are nothing more than responsibilities on yhe part of others. Of course you are right that parents (whether they "choose" to have children or not) have more responsibilities rhan most others.
So, TO 'you', when one is RAPED, and impregnated, then 'they' AUTOMATICALLY TAKE ON 'more responsibilities, than most others', right?

Either way, I would suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" takes ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". Unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.
Even by your low standards, AGE, this post is looney.
WHY, EXACTLY?

you, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT ANSWER the previous OPEN CLARIFYING QUESTION I posed, and ASKED you. So, WHAT you are REFERRING TO here NO one KNOWS.

Do you STILL want to CLAIM that one who has NOT CHOSEN to have children but has been RAPED, and has BECOME a parent has MORE 'responsibilities' than most "others"?

If yes, then I STILL suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" TAKES ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". AGAIN, unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.

If you DISAGREE WITH 'this', then I would suggest that it IS 'you', "alexiev", who is Truly LOONEY, and APATHETIC.
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Why don't we just hand over all children to rapists?
For OBVIOUS reasons.
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Maybe -- just maybe -- children are better off being raised by non-rapists.
WHY did you even SAY and WRITE 'this'?
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Or don't you care about the welfare of children?
If you had read EVERY thing I have SAID and WRITTEN here, then you would ALREADY KNOW the ANSWER to this QUESTION.

By the way, what, EXACTLY, made 'you' go down this line of QUESTIONING anyway "alexiev"?
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bahman
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Re: On Marriage

Post by bahman »

Traditional marriage, living together forever, is a serious commitment. Some people don't know what they are committing to!
Alexiev
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Re: On Marriage

Post by Alexiev »

Age wrote: Sat Nov 25, 2023 4:09 am
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am
Age wrote: Fri Nov 17, 2023 8:59 am

So, TO 'you', when one is RAPED, and impregnated, then 'they' AUTOMATICALLY TAKE ON 'more responsibilities, than most others', right?

Either way, I would suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" takes ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". Unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.
Even by your low standards, AGE, this post is looney.
WHY, EXACTLY?

you, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT ANSWER the previous OPEN CLARIFYING QUESTION I posed, and ASKED you. So, WHAT you are REFERRING TO here NO one KNOWS.

Do you STILL want to CLAIM that one who has NOT CHOSEN to have children but has been RAPED, and has BECOME a parent has MORE 'responsibilities' than most "others"?

If yes, then I STILL suggest that 'the adult one' who RAPED "the other" TAKES ON 'ALL responsibilities', and RELINQUISHES ALL 'following responsibilities' of "the other". AGAIN, unless, OF COURSE, "the other" CHOOSES otherwise.

If you DISAGREE WITH 'this', then I would suggest that it IS 'you', "alexiev", who is Truly LOONEY, and APATHETIC.
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Why don't we just hand over all children to rapists?
For OBVIOUS reasons.
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Maybe -- just maybe -- children are better off being raised by non-rapists.
WHY did you even SAY and WRITE 'this'?
Alexiev wrote: Sat Nov 18, 2023 2:00 am Or don't you care about the welfare of children?
If you had read EVERY thing I have SAID and WRITTEN here, then you would ALREADY KNOW the ANSWER to this QUESTION.

By the way, what, EXACTLY, made 'you' go down this line of QUESTIONING anyway "alexiev"?
Thank goodness I haven't read everything you've "SAID and WRITTEN". A more disagreeable task would be difficult to imagine.

However, just to humor you (and any lurkers unfortunate enough to have read your post), "TAKES ON ALL responsibilities" includes feeding, educating, and caring for children. Do you really think rapists are the best people to do this? If you don't think they are, why did you write what you wrote?
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