Quote of the day

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Dontaskme
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by Dontaskme »

“Most people die at 25, but
Aren’t buried until 75.”

- Ben Franklin
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Sue Monk Kidd from The Secret Life of Bees

The body knows things a long time before the mind catches up to them. I was wondering what my body knew that I didn't.


He wondered what his body knew that he didn't.

I can't think of anything I'd rather have more than somebody lovin' me.

Now that takes me way, way back.

Nothing is fair in this world. You might as well get that straight right now.

Straight up, let's explain why.

Actually, you can be bad at something...but if you love doing it, that will be enough. --- August Boatwright

Posting here?

You think you want to know something, and then once you do, all you can think about is erasing it from your mind.

I'm thinking about that now in fact.

We can't think of changing our skin color. Change the world ---that's how we gotta think.

Uh, good luck with that?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by iambiguous »

Despair...

“What is the nature of the search? you ask. The search is what anyone would undertake if he were not sunk in the everydayness of his own life. To become aware of the search is to be onto something. Not to be onto something is to be in despair.” Walker Percy


Not counting the something that I search for, of course.

“In a world gushing blood day and night, you never stop mopping up pain.” Aberjhani

My guess: some more -- way, way, way more -- than others.

“Hope was an instinct only the reasoning human mind could kill. An animal never knew despair.” Graham Greene

Of course, we are animals, aren't we? But point taken.

“I wanted to tell her not to entertain despair like this. Despair wasn't a guest, you didn't play its favorite music, find it a comfortable chair. Despair was the enemy." Janet Fitch

Tell my despair that.

“To the extent that I had come to understand that despair does not necessarily result in annihilation, that one can go on as usual in spite of it, I had become hardened. Was this what it means to be an adult, to live with ugly ambiguities?” Banana Yoshimoto

Yep.

“Any man who retreats into a cave which has only one opening deserves to die.” Frank Herbert

Uh, whatever that means?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by iambiguous »

Umberto Eco from Foucault's Pendulum

“Here's a book about gnomes, undines, salamanders, elves, sylphs, fairies, but it, too, brings in the origins of Aryan civilization. The SS, apparently, are descended from the Seven Dwarfs.” Umberto Eco


Let's run that by these folks: https://knowthyself.forumotion.net/f6-agora

I didn't know how to define it -- hermetic skepticism? liturgical cynicism? -- this higher disbelief that led him to acknowledge the dignity of all the superstitions he scorned.

You define it for us.

The Massalians are not dualists but monarchians, and they have dealings with the infernal powers, and in fact some texts call them Borborites, from borboros, filth, because of the unspeakable things they do.
What do they do?
The usual unspeakable things. Men and women hold in the palm of their hand, and raise to heaven, their own ignominy, namely, sperm or menstruum, then eat it, calling it the Body of Christ. And if by chance a woman is made pregnant, at the opportune moment they stick a hand into her womb, pull out the embryo, throw it into a mortar, mix in some honey and pepper, and gobble it up.
How revolting, honey and pepper! Diotallevi said.


Any Massalians here?

Not that the incredulous person doesn't believe in anything. It's just that he doesn't believe in everything. Or he believes in one thing at a time. He believes a second thing only if it somehow follows from the first thing. He is nearsighted and methodical, avoiding wide horizons. If two things don't fit, but you believe both of them, thinking that somewhere, hidden, there must be a third thing that connects them, that's credulity.

Yo, Iwannabeplato! :wink:

The conspiracy theory of society . . . comes from abandoning God and then asking: “Who is in his place?” Karl Popper

Aside from the deep state?

Can you call yourself a coward simply because the courage of others seems to you out of proportion to the triviality of the occasion?

Better still call them fools.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by iambiguous »

Margaret Atwood from Oryx and Crake

Jimmy, look at it realistically. You can't couple a minimum access to food with an expanding population indefinitely. Homo sapiens doesn't seem to be able to cut himself off at the supply end. He's one of the few species that doesn't limit reproduction in the face of dwindling resources. In other words - and up to a point, of course - the less we eat, the more we fuck.
How to do you account for that? said Jimmy
Imagination, said Crake. Men can imagine their own deaths...human beings hope they can stick their souls into someone else...and live on forever.


Who do you stick it in?

I'll make you mine, lovers said in old books. They never said, I'll make you me.

The fools!

Falling in love, although it resulted in altered body chemistry and was therefore real, was a hormonally induced delusional state, according to him. In addition it was humiliating, because it put you at a disadvantage, it gave the love object too much power. As for sex per se, it lacked both challenge and novelty, and was on the whole a deeply imperfect solution to the problem of intergenerational genetic transfer.

No, really, what if that's true?

Anyway, maybe there weren't any solutions. Human society, corpses and rubble. It never learned, it made the same cretinous mistakes over and over, trading short-term gain for long-term pain.

Being optimistic?

Why is it he feels some line has been crossed, some boundary transgressed? How much is too much, how far is too far?

And then, of course: our lines or theirs?

He’d developed a strangely tender feeling towards such words, as if they were children abandoned in the woods and it was his duty to rescue them.

For example: https://youtu.be/xUM7B07K9fE?si=fUz9em54f4P-GKoq
FrankGSterleJr
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by FrankGSterleJr »

I believe Sigmund Freud postulated that due to the general stressful nature of human existence, i.e. anxiety (“stimuli”, I believe he called it), the ultimate aim/goal of our brain/mind is blissful death. Indeed, the Sigmund Freud character in the 2011 film A Dangerous Method, muttered upon having a near-death-experience heart attack, “How sweet it must be to die.”

Quite unfortunately, some people genuinely feel the greatest gift life offers them is that someday they get to die. Perhaps worsening matters is when suicide is simply not an option, meaning there’s little hope of receiving an early reprieve from their literal life sentence.

_____

I awoke from another very bad dream, a reincarnation nightmare / where having died I’m yet again being forced to be reborn back into human form / despite my pleas I be allowed to rest in permanent peace. //

My bed wet from sweat, I futilely try to convince my own autistic brain / I want to live, the same traumatized dysthymic brain displacing me from the functional world. //

Within my nightmare a mob encircles me and insists that life’s a blessing, including mine. //

I ask them for the blessed purpose of my continuance. I insist upon a practical purpose. //

Give me a real purpose, I cry out, and it’s not enough simply to live / nor that it’s a beautiful sunny day with colorful fragrant flowers! //

I’m tormented hourly by my desire for emotional, material and creative gain / that ultimately matters naught, I explain. My own mind brutalizes me like it has / a sadistic mind of its own. I must have a progressive reason for this harsh endurance! //

Bewildered they warn that one day on my death bed I’ll regret my ingratitude / and that I’m about to lose my life. //

I counter that I cannot mourn the loss of something I never really had / so I’m unlikely to dread parting from it. //

Frustrated they say that moments from death I’ll clamour and claw for life / like a bridge-jumper instinctively flailing his limbs as though to grasp at something / anything that may delay his imminent thrust into the eternal abyss. //

How can I in good conscience morosely hate my life / while many who love theirs lose it so soon? they ask. //

Angry I reply that people bewail the ‘unfair’ untimely deaths of the young who’ve received early reprieve / from their life sentence, people who must remain behind corporeally confined / yet do their utmost to complete their entire life sentence—even more, if they could! //

The vexed mob then curse me with envy for rejecting what they’d kill for—continued life through unending rebirth. //

“Then why don’t you just kill yourself?” they yell, to which I retort “I would if I could. //

My life sentence is made all the more oppressive by my inability to take my own life.” //

“Then we’ll do it for you.” As their circle closes on me, I wake up. //

Could there be people who immensely suffer yet convince themselves they sincerely want to live when in / fact they don’t want to die, so greatly they fear Death’s unknown? //

No one should ever have to repeat and suffer again a single second that passes. //

Nay, leave me be to engage the dying of my blight!
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Suicide...

“I suddenly felt that it was all the same to me whether the world existed or whether there had never been anything at all: I began to feel with all my being that there was nothing existing. At first I fancied that many things had existed in the past, but afterwards I guessed that there never had been anything in the past either, but that it had only seemed so for some reason. Little by little I guessed that there would be nothing in the future either. Then I left off being angry with people and almost ceased to notice them. Indeed this showed itself even in the pettiest trifles: I used, for instance, to knock against people in the street. And not so much from being lost in thought: what had I to think about? I had almost given up thinking by that time; nothing mattered to me. If at least I had solved my problems! Oh, I had not settled one of them, and how many there were! But I gave up caring about anything, and all the problems disappeared.” Fyodor Dostoyevsky


Some problems maybe, but not the bills.

“Tell me, where in life is there a value that would make us consider suicide uncalled for on principle! Love? Or friendship? I guarantee that friendship is not a bit less fickle than love and it is impossible to build anything on it. Self-love? I wish it were possible.” Milan Kundera

Sure, but is this cynical enough?

“There isn't so much to be afraid of, out there. I can remember thinking it was funny to find that out, on the last night of my life; I'd spent the rest of it being afraid of everything.” Nick Hornby

Indeed, why take chances.

“I simply wondered about the dead because their days had ended and I did not know how I would get through mine.” James Baldwin

You know, being practical.

“When you're in an extreme situation you tend to avoid facing it by getting caught up in little details. Like a guy who's decided to commit suicide and boards a train only to become obsessed with whether he remembered to lock the door when he left home.” Ryū Murakami

And the equivalent of that here, of course.

“There is a very popular opinion that choosing life is inherently superior to choosing death. This belief that life is inherently preferable to death is one of the most widespread superstitions. This bias constitutes one of the most obstinate mythologies of the human species.” Mitchell Heisman

Hear! Hear!
You know, on the bad days.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

Post by iambiguous »

Isaac Asimov from Foundation

Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right.


I'll bet that can get tricky.

Now any dogma, based primarily on faith and emotionalism, is a dangerous weapon to use on others, since it is almost impossible to guarantee that the weapon will never be turned on the user.

I'll bet that can get tricky.

It pays to be obvious, especially if you have a reputation for subtlety.

Not that this ever works here, of course. Well, not my obvious, anyway.

Scientific truth is beyond loyalty and disloyalty.

Tell that to the capitalists.

A horse having a wolf as a powerful and dangerous enemy lived in constant fear of his life. Being driven to desperation, it occurred to him to seek a strong ally. Whereupon he approached a man, and offered an alliance, pointing out that the wolf was likewise an enemy of the man. The man accepted the partnership at once and offered to kill the wolf immediately, if his new partner would only co-operate by placing his greater speed at the man’s disposal. The horse was willing, and allowed the man to place bridle and saddle upon him. The man mounted, hunted down the wolf, and killed him. “The horse, joyful and relieved, thanked the man, and said: ‘Now that our enemy is dead, remove your bridle and saddle and restore my freedom.’ “Whereupon the man laughed loudly and replied, ‘Never!’ and applied the spurs with a will.

Lesson learned?

They were scientists enough to admit that they were wrong.

They were philosophers enough to admit...you tell me.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Nihilism...

“Some kind of philosophical mission, something that would push back, if only for a moment, against the inescapable nihilism of this place.” Marie Brennan


Go ahead, give it your best shot.

"Dostoyevsky has become a teenager’s writer, the issue of nihilism a teenage issue.” Karl Ove Knausgaard

Right, keep telling yourself that.

“These, too [ideologies], have disappeared. And we survive only by a reflex action of collective credulity, which consists not only in absorbing everything put about under the heading of news or information, but in believing in the principle and transcendence of information. While, at the same time, remaining deeply incredulous and resistant to that kind of knee-jerk consensus. We no more believe in information by divine right than serfs ever believed they were serfs by divine right, but we act as though we do. Behind this façade, a gigantic principle of incredulity is growing up, a principle of secret disaffection and the denial of any social bond." Jean Baudrillard.

Ah, of course: the "principle of incredulity".
Cue Iwannabeplato? You know among others.


“All of humanity’s inventions will fade into dust with time. The rats and cockroaches will remain.” Simon Brass

And Chatbots, of course.

“We are always awaiting the Messiah that never arrives. I long for bygone days where every dawn brought a new eschatology and an interminable queue of prophets preached humanity’s impending salvation as if it were syndicated. It must have been joyous to receive a fresh messiah weekly, and to be regaled with inspiring tales of the glory that lay ahead. When those false idols were smashed others took their place, from progress to the realization of History." Simon Brass

Let's see if He arrives today though.

“She couldn't get any further at that point. The sky full of stars seemed dead and cold, everything in it the result of the mechanical, indifferent interactions of molecules and particles that would continue for the rest of time whether Lyra lived or died, whether human beings were conscious or unconscious: a vast silent empty indifference, all quite meaningless. Reason had brought her to this state. She had exalted reason over every other faculty. The result had been -- was now -- the deepest unhappiness she had ever felt.” Philip Pullman

Of course, you get a lot further, don't you?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Cave Man from Modern Human's Handbook

Being yourself is hard and often disappointing.


The bad news? Only all the way to the grave.

Time to time you will fail some of your responsibilities. Sometimes they can crush you. In those difficult times, you have to remind yourself that it is better for everybody around you and the world to have a person who is truly trying but failing than doing nothing at all.

Well, that's bullshit...right?

We don’t look at ourselves to see if we are inadequate, we don’t ask ourselves if we are enjoying life. What we do instead is we look at other people and what they do then decide if our life is worth living.

Well, that's bullshit...right?

When you suffer for things that are yet to happen, you suffer only in your imagination.

Uh, what a relief that is?

We do things we don’t want to do in order to avoid doing the things we actually want to do.

Of course, it may well be the other way around.

The thing is writing is torturing me every second while I’m writing. But not writing is torturing every second when I’m not writing. If you are looking for any meaning in life it is this; being tortured for the right reason.

And that would be...?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Tom Perrotta

Within a couple of weeks of starting the Ph.D. program, though, she discovered that she'd booked passage on a sinking ship. There aren't any jobs, the other students informed her; the profession's glutted with tenured old men who won't step aside for the next generation. While the university's busy exploiting you for cheap labor, you somehow have to produce a boring thesis that no one will read, and find someone willing to publish it as a book. And then, if you're unsually talented and extraordinarily lucky, you just might be able to secure a one-year, nonrenewable appointment teaching remedial composition to football players in Oklahoma. Meanwhile, the Internet's booming, and the kids we gave C pluses to are waltzing out of college and getting rich on stock options while we bust our asses for a pathetic stipend that doesn't even cover the rent.


Wow, that's not fair!

When your words are futile, you’re better off keeping them to yourself, or never even thinking them in the first place.

So, how futile are mine, here?

It felt good, the whole family together on a sunny morning in a wholesome environment. If it hadn't been for the worshiping God part, he would have happily attended church on a regular basis.

God makes note of that.

He'd never had to make the adjustments and compromises other people accepted early in their romantic careers; never had a chance to learn the lesson that Sarah taught him everyday--that beauty was only a part of it, and not even the most important part, that there were transactions between people that occurred on some mysterious level beneath the skin, or maybe even beyond the body.

Getting divorced, for example.

Next time she’d have to ask him to keep the light on while he did it, so she could watch his face. That was the best part of the whole thing as far as she was concerned, the way a guy’s face contorted so violently and then relaxed, as if some terrible mystery had just been solved.

How about you...light on or off?

Apparently even the most awful tragedies, and the people they'd ruined, got a little stale after a while.

Thank God for new ones.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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God...

“The glory of Christianity is to conquer by forgiveness.” William Blake


They forgive you, Adolph.

Experts in ancient Greek culture say that people back then didn't see their thoughts as belonging to them. When ancient Greeks had a thought, it occurred to them as a god or goddess giving an order. Apollo was telling them to be brave. Athena was telling them to fall in love.
Now people hear a commercial for sour cream potato chips and rush out to buy, but now they call this free will.


Let's discuss.

“The word 'God' is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation, no matter how subtle, can (for me) change this.” Albert Einstein

And now, Al?

“We fear men so much, because we fear God so little. One fear cures another. When man's terror scares you, turn your thoughts to the wrath of God.” G.K. Chesterton

Banal enough for you?

“I believe in the fundamental truth of all great religions of the world.” Mahatma Gandhi

Maybe, but God's not fooled.

If there was a God. I would spit in his face for subjecting me to this. If there was a Devil, I would sell my soul to make it end. If there was something Higher that controlled out fucking fates, I would tell it to take my fate and shove it up its fucking ass. Shove it hard and far, you motherfucker. Please end. Please end. Please end.” James Frey

A million fucking pieces indeed.
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Existentialism...

“When we are dealing with human beings, no truth has reality by itself; it is always dependent upon the reality of the immediate relationship.” Rollo May


Then going all the way back to...

“It is man's unique privilege, among all other organisms. By pursuing falsehood you will arrive at the truth!” Fyodor Dostoyevsky

How's that working out for you?

“If the immediate and direct purpose of our life is not suffering then our existence is the most ill-adapted to its purpose in the world.” Arthur Schopenhauer

Praise the Lord?

“Thus it amounts to the same thing whether one gets drunk alone or is a leader of nations.” Jean-Paul Sartre

Tell that to God?

“I can always choose, but I ought to know that if I do not choose, I am still choosing.” Jean-Paul Sartre

So, to post or not to post?

"How did I picture the life after the grave?
I Fairly bawled out at him: A life in which I can remember this life on earth. That's all I want of it." Albert Camus


And now?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Paul Murray from Skippy Dies

Life makes fools of all of us sooner or later. But keep your sense of humor and you'll at least be able to take your humiliations with some measure of grace. In the end, you know, its our own expectations that crush us.


Har Har Harr?

History, in the end, is only another kind of story, and stories are different from the truth. The truth is messy and chaotic and all over the place. Often it just doesn’t make sense. Stories make things make sense, but the way they do that is to leave out anything that doesn’t fit. And often that is quite a lot.

Need a story yourself?
Pick one:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... traditions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... ideologies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... philosophy

Maybe instead of strings it's stories things are made of, an infinite number of tiny vibrating stories; once upon a time they all were part of one big giant superstory, except it got broken up into a jillion different pieces, that's why no story on its own makes any sense, and so what you have to do in a life is try and weave it back together, my story into your story, our stories into all the other people's we know, until you've got something that to God or whoever might look like a letter, or even a whole word....

Need a story yourself?
Pick one:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... traditions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... ideologies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... philosophy

Gradually the awful truth dawns on you: that Santa Claus was just the tip of the iceberg - that your future will not be the rollercoaster ride you'd imagined, that the world occupied by your parents, the world of washing the dishes, going to the dentist, weekend trips to the DIY superstore to buy floor tiles, is actually largely what people mean when they speak of 'life'.

Your awful truth...or mine?

Ignoring is what you are supposed to do with bullies, so they get bored and leave you alone. But the problem in school is that they don't get bored, because whatever else there is to do is more boring still.

Next up: the bullies here?

The achievement of maturity, psychologically speaking, might be said to be the realization and acceptance that we simply cannot live independently from the world, and so we must live within it, with whatever compromises that might entail.

What, even virtually?
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iambiguous
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Re: Quote of the day

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Sue Monk Kidd from The Secret Life of Bees

Honeybees depend not only on physical contact with the colony, but also require it's social companionship and support. Isolate a honeybee from her sisters and she will soon die.


And [of course] the equivalent of that here.

...women made the best beekeepers 'cause they have a special ability built into them to love creatures that sting.

Hint, hint.

Up until then I'd thought that white people and colored people getting along was the big aim, but after that I decided everybody being colorless together was a better plan. I thought of that policeman, Eddie Hazelwurst, saying I'd lowered myself to be in this house of colored women, and for the very life of me I couldn't understand how it had turned out this way, how colored women had become the lowest ones on the totem pole. You only had to look at them to see how special they were, like hidden royalty among us. Eddie Hazelwurst. What a shitbucket.

And then the shitbuckets here.

People can start out one way, and by the time life gets through with them they end up completely different.

Not counting the shitbuckets who stay exactly the same.

People who think dying is the worst thing don't know a thing about life.

Let's explain that.

Look, I know you meant well creating the world and all, but how could you let it get away from you like this? How come you couldn't stick with your original idea of paradise?

Yeah, what about that, Mr. Loving, Just and Merciful?
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