Yes, I am real. And I don't have to believe I am real. So beliefs, to me are just fictional things within the real me. For example: I would never have known what is a tree, or that a tree is a tree until I believed it was a tree. To know the trees existence existed at all, I would have to believe it did, after being informed by someone else that a tree was indeed a tree. When I was shown the image of the tree, then i could believe in the trees existence, but prior to being informed about a tree, I had no concept of a tree.
Why should we be blamed?
Re: Why should we be blamed?
Last edited by Dontaskme on Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- henry quirk
- Posts: 14706
- Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 8:07 pm
- Location: Right here, a little less busy.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
I can't second guess god, so I don't try...got my hands full livin'bahman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:09 pmThat is your interpretation which is fine. But do you think that God thinks the same?henry quirk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:04 pmmental illness, disease, blunts the free will...can't blame the psychopath (you can only restrain him) anymore that you can blame the tornado
I get the desire to lay blame, but -- sometimes -- there's simply no just place to lay it, no person to assign guilt to
Re: Why should we be blamed?
How do you know?
Are you talking about learning?Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:24 pm And I don't have to believe I am real. So beliefs, to me are just fictional things within the real me. For example: I would never have known what is a tree, or that a tree is a tree until I believed it was a tree. To know the trees existence existed at all, I would have to believe it did, after being informed by someone else that a tree was indeed a tree. When I was shown the image of the tree, then i could believe in the trees existence, but prior to being informed about a tree, I had no concept of a tree.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
It is all cool.henry quirk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:47 pmI can't second guess god, so I don't try...got my hands full livin'bahman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:09 pmThat is your interpretation which is fine. But do you think that God thinks the same?henry quirk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:04 pm
mental illness, disease, blunts the free will...can't blame the psychopath (you can only restrain him) anymore that you can blame the tornado
I get the desire to lay blame, but -- sometimes -- there's simply no just place to lay it, no person to assign guilt to
Re: Why should we be blamed?
It's experiencial, it's self evident, you are your own proof.
Yes, learning is all about knowing knowledge, which is just langauge, so our knowledge is all a fictional narrative within ourself, that we weave into a story from our own perception according to how we interpret the meaning of our language.
The problem with the God idea, is that we cannot pin an image to God and say that is God or there is God, because concepts are fixed, they cannot be anything other than what they are known for via their actual image seen. So knowledge is all about learning, which is all about creating stories, that build a picture of a reality that makes sense to us according to how we accept what makes sense to us personally.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
What is "you"? How do you experience it?
I agree with what you said.Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:11 pmYes, learning is all about knowing knowledge, which is just langauge, so our knowledge is all a fictional narrative within ourself, that we weave into a story from our own perception according to how we interpret the meaning of our language.
The problem with the God idea, is that we cannot pin an image to God and say that is God or there is God, because concepts are fixed, they cannot be anything other than what they are known for via their actual image seen. So knowledge is all about learning, which is all about creating stories, that build a picture of a reality that makes sense to us according to how we accept what makes sense to us personally.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
There is a sense of being alive. It is that sense alone that is the experience of being. I do not know any more than just the sense of being.
I know I am some sort of awareness because I can experience and know pain and other sensation. I do not know how I am happening.
- Hermit Philosopher
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:50 pm
- Location: By the seaside
- Contact:
Re: Why should we be blamed?
An omniscient God, yes, many religions believe in this.
Bear in mind however, that those who also ascribe omnipresence to God may not consider time (i.e. the “future” that you mentioned above) to be something that exists, except for in the human mind. And, if it does not exist, would a real God need to know of it...?
Humbly
Hermit
Re: Why should we be blamed?
Catholics for example think that God not only creates things but also sustains them (things cannot simply be existence since otherwise, they are God). Things however on the motion. Therefore God should know the future in order to sustain things.Hermit Philosopher wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:20 pm
An omniscient God, yes, many religions believe in this.
Bear in mind however, that those who also ascribe omnipresence to God may not consider time (i.e. the “future” that you mentioned above) to be something that exists, except for in the human mind. And, if it does not exist, would a real God need to know of it...?
Humbly
Hermit
Re: Why should we be blamed?
You are not happening. You experience, decide and cause. Does this sentence make sense to you?Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:20 pmThere is a sense of being alive. It is that sense alone that is the experience of being. I do not know any more than just the sense of being.
I know I am some sort of awareness because I can experience and know pain and other sensation. I do not know how I am happening.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
Yes it does.bahman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:29 pmYou are not happening. You experience, decide and cause. Does this sentence make sense to you?Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:20 pmThere is a sense of being alive. It is that sense alone that is the experience of being. I do not know any more than just the sense of being.
I know I am some sort of awareness because I can experience and know pain and other sensation. I do not know how I am happening.
In the sense of I am not living, I am being lived.
Re: Why should we be blamed?
So it is you who make things to happen.Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:33 pmYes it does.bahman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:29 pmYou are not happening. You experience, decide and cause. Does this sentence make sense to you?Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:20 pm
There is a sense of being alive. It is that sense alone that is the experience of being. I do not know any more than just the sense of being.
I know I am some sort of awareness because I can experience and know pain and other sensation. I do not know how I am happening.
What do you mean?
Re: Why should we be blamed?
Re: Why should we be blamed?
If God knew the future then why would God bother putting the free will idea into it's creation, knowing that free will could change God's will at any time. So God can't be all knowing, or know what's going to happen before it happens. The free will concept wouldn't make sense.
- Hermit Philosopher
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:50 pm
- Location: By the seaside
- Contact:
Re: Why should we be blamed?
bahman wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:27 pmCatholics for example think that God not only creates things but also sustains them (things cannot simply be existence since otherwise, they are God). Things however on the motion. Therefore God should know the future in order to sustain things.Hermit Philosopher wrote: ↑Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:20 pm
An omniscient God, yes, many religions believe in this.
Bear in mind however, that those who also ascribe omnipresence to God may not consider time (i.e. the “future” that you mentioned above) to be something that exists, except for in the human mind. And, if it does not exist, would a real God need to know of it...?
Humbly
Hermit
The funny thing is, that if you require that the problem presented in OP only be answered from one particular view of God (e.g. the one you’ve given here above) and your last question is “ how God could be highest [...?] if He does not know the future?” then, can there be other reasonings that your own...?