American election.

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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: American election.

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:23 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:20 pm The electoral system is not part of a true democracy.
How do you have "true democracy" with no "electoral system"? :shock:
Obviously I made a mistake and meant the Electoral College, Obviously! But then you responded as you did, predictably!
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

Lacewing wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:30 pm Terrorism has been coming from all directions. You should know that if you're alive and aware.
Great! Then you can point me to the videos of those Right Wing "terror" groups doing their villainous deeds...and you should be able to do that very easily indeed.

I would appreciate the favour. I do want the facts.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:36 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:23 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:20 pm The electoral system is not part of a true democracy.
How do you have "true democracy" with no "electoral system"? :shock:
Obviously I made a mistake and meant the Electoral College, Obviously! But then you responded as you did, predictably!
Yeah. :D It would be a bit odd to speak of consulting democracy without consulting the people.

So you're not into the smaller States having a voice? You want the large states to control every debate, every decision and every election, no matter what little places like Vermont or unpopulous states like Montana might think?

Just asking.
commonsense
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Re: American election.

Post by commonsense »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:39 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:36 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:23 pm
How do you have "true democracy" with no "electoral system"? :shock:
Obviously I made a mistake and meant the Electoral College, Obviously! But then you responded as you did, predictably!
Yeah. :D It would be a bit odd to speak of consulting democracy without consulting the people.

So you're not into the smaller States having a voice? You want the large states to control every debate, every decision and every election, no matter what little places like Vermont or unpopulous states like Montana might think?

Just asking.
It’s the voice of the people, not the voice of the States.
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: American election.

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:39 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:36 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:23 pm
How do you have "true democracy" with no "electoral system"? :shock:
Obviously I made a mistake and meant the Electoral College, Obviously! But then you responded as you did, predictably!
Yeah. :D It would be a bit odd to speak of consulting democracy without consulting the people.

So you're not into the smaller States having a voice? You want the large states to control every debate, every decision and every election, no matter what little places like Vermont or unpopulous states like Montana might think?

Just asking.
You're a fool that believes in arbitrary lines drawn in the sand, and apparently don't understand the EC's effects in the first place, as it doesn't address small states, as you indicate.

This is the "UNITED STATES" my friend, and elections should represent the popular vote of these "UNITED STATES." If you don't like Vermont's small part, move to California, you're 'free' to move to the largest populated state! Life is full of choices my friend, can you say, "prioritize"? Or is that beyond small minds?
Nick_A
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Re: American election.

Post by Nick_A »

Lacewing wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:09 am
Nick_A wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 3:20 am
Lacewing wrote: There are many paths to the same "places". And not every destination is at it seems. So it would be a lot more truthful for you to question all of it, rather than making up your one-sided stories of good and bad, which unsurprisingly position you on the side of good.
"By Any means possible"

"The ends justify the means."

These are slogans resulting inevitably in collective statist slavery There are many paths leading to statist slavery but just one that can lead to sustaining liberty. Do you know what that is?
What do these slogans have to do with me? I said nothing like that.
I meant that your support of wokism includes the necessity for these slogans. Otherwise you will lose out to the great unwashed or the deplorbles who with their demand for liberty interfere with the superior intellect of wokism. It is the intellectual superiority of wokism which justifies the destruction of private property, the corruption of the young, and a fraudalent election.

Do the believers in liberty have anything similar to the glorious goals of wokism

It does but secularism has destroyed its potential.
1954
“We will be destroyed unless we create a cosmic conscience. And we have to begin to do that on an individual level, with the youth that are the politicians of tomorrow…. But no one, and certainly no state, can take over the responsibility that the individual has to his conscience.” Albert Einstein, in Einstein and the Poet – In Search of the Cosmic Man by William Hermanns (Branden Press, 1983, p. 141. Conversation in Summer of 1954)

"Create a community which develops the highest of man's qualities based on conscience. You must warn people not to make their in­tellect their god. The intellect knows methods but it seldom knows values, and they come from feeling. If one doesn't play a part in the creative whole, he is not worth being called human. He has betrayed his true purpose." Albert Einstein, in Einstein and the Poet – In Search of the Cosmic Man by William Hermanns (Branden Press, 1983, p. 135.)
Now that the goals of wokism in many have surpassed the goals of understanding giving way to the goals of indoctrination, the country is losing its youth who have no idea of what objective conscience is. So they move to what in reality leads to psychological slavery rather than liberty.

Wokism or opening to conscience? The intellectuals have spoken and who can oppose the intellectuals? "Give us Barabbas."
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:46 pm It’s the voice of the people, not the voice of the States.
Well, the people in Vermont and Montana will be surprised to realize they've lost their voice. From then on, the people in California or Texas will dictate everything to them. Will they be thrilled? Maybe not.
commonsense
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Re: American election.

Post by commonsense »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:08 pm
commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:46 pm It’s the voice of the people, not the voice of the States.
Well, the people in Vermont and Montana will be surprised to realize they've lost their voice. From then on, the people in California or Texas will dictate everything to them. Will they be thrilled? Maybe not.
If we are first of all Americans, then state residents, then county residents, then city residents and then neighborhood residents, the states’ boundaries do not apply to national issues.

The majority of people will dictate to the minority. Some of the people in Vermont and Montana will be thrilled to be part of the majority.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:19 pm If we are first of all Americans
That's not what the Left believes, though.

They believe that first, you're white or black, second you're male or female, third you're gay or straight or trans or whatever...and way down the list you are American...though they tell you you should be ashamed of that fact, because they allege America is oppressive, capitalist, imperialist, racist and generally bad. For Leftists, minorities -- especially allegedly "oppressed" minorities -- are good...and the majority of America, and America as a country, and as a concept, is evil.

In point of fact, though, America is not a direct democracy, but a republic. And as a "union," it also exists as a voluntary association of states, not as a huge mass of undifferentiated individuals with the majority free to tyrannize minorities. One of the better things about the US is its respect for minorities, actually. And Vermont and Montana are such minorities, that depend on being respected for their contributions to the Union.
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: American election.

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:08 pm
commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:46 pm It’s the voice of the people, not the voice of the States.
Well, the people in Vermont and Montana will be surprised to realize they've lost their voice. From then on, the people in California or Texas will dictate everything to them. Will they be thrilled? Maybe not.
Dumbass, it's we the people, not we the states.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 9:06 pm it's we the people, not we the states.
It's the United States. :lol:
commonsense
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Re: American election.

Post by commonsense »

Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:33 pm
commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:19 pm If we are first of all Americans
That's not what the Left believes, though.

They believe that first, you're white or black, second you're male or female, third you're gay or straight or trans or whatever...and way down the list you are American...though they tell you you should be ashamed of that fact, because they allege America is oppressive, capitalist, imperialist, racist and generally bad. For Leftists, minorities -- especially allegedly "oppressed" minorities -- are good...and the majority of America, and America as a country, and as a concept, is evil.
That’s odd. The left wing believes that the blacks, whites, males, females, gays, straights etc are equally American. Being anything else before being American is irrelevant to the principle of majority rule.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: American election.

Post by Immanuel Can »

commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:52 pm Being anything else before being American is irrelevant to the principle of majority rule.
It is. And that's why the Left is also inevitably totalitarian. That's why they want Socialism, in fact: not for equality, but for the opportunity it affords to control the majority.
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Re: American election.

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:52 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:33 pm
commonsense wrote: Mon Nov 30, 2020 8:19 pm If we are first of all Americans
That's not what the Left believes, though.

They believe that first, you're white or black, second you're male or female, third you're gay or straight or trans or whatever...and way down the list you are American...though they tell you you should be ashamed of that fact, because they allege America is oppressive, capitalist, imperialist, racist and generally bad. For Leftists, minorities -- especially allegedly "oppressed" minorities -- are good...and the majority of America, and America as a country, and as a concept, is evil.
That’s odd. The left wing believes that the blacks, whites, males, females, gays, straights etc are equally American. Being anything else before being American is irrelevant to the principle of majority rule.
That's odd. Why are black Americans always referred to by 'the left' as 'African Americans'? At what point do they become simply 'Americans'?? I mean, after 400 odd years surely they can be considered Americans. The African bit is bloody ridiclous. We are ALL African if you go back far enough. Plus, many 'black' Americans probably don't even come from 'Africa' (and Africa is a mighty big continent').
Impenitent
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Re: American election.

Post by Impenitent »

Egyptians are Africans too

-Imp
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