Does the positive side of tribalism/racism outshine the negative side?

[Greatest I am]

Does the positive side of tribalism/racism outshine the negative side?

You will have to argue, soundly and validly, and thus prove that there is a, so called, "positive side" first before this could be answered, properly and correctly.

The moment we follow our selfish gene’s love bias of tribalism and racism for our own kind and color, we create a hate bias for all other kinds and colors.

Is there ANY actual EVIDENCE and PROOF that there is a, so called, "selfish gene's love bias of tribalism and racism for 'our' own kind and color", or is this just an attempt at "justifying" your ALREADY held beliefs and views?

Negative racism is born in us from our love of our own kind and color. It is natural and normal for the human species.

So, according to this "logic" EVERY human being is born with, so called, "negative racism", correct?

How does a new born baby differentiate between kind and color?

The more I look into what you say the MORE ABSURD it is Truly becoming. But, you MAYBE able to CLARIFY and answer my clarifying questions sufficiently. We will just have to wait and see.

We are born the fittest of our line.

When you say 'we' here, do you mean EVERY individual?

If no, then what do you mean?

It follows that nature would have it no other way for us as individual animals but to think of ourselves as the best.

Well 'i' MUST NOT BE a part of 'Nature', Itself. As i have it another way. i do NOT think of thy 'self' as the best at all. i think of thy 'self' as just an EQUAL one as EVERY other one IS.

Nature always creates for the best possible end and for each of us and our genetic line, something like us is the best.

Maybe so, 'us' as thee collective ONE maybe the, so called, 'best', BUT NO individual 'one' is better than another individual 'one'.

Tribalism/racism has a dual nature. Good parts and evil parts. Mostly good but it is hell when the uglier negative racist side is in play.

But WHY would be, so called, "hell"? Especially as you say this is Nature and that we are born this way.

Also, WHY would Nature create what is, so called, "ugly"?

What is 'ugly' to 'you' is NOT necessarily 'ugly' to "another".

We are racist because we know that reality favors the survival of the fittest.

I would say that 'you' are racist just because you were taught to hate "others" and/or see "others" as different races.

Also, you seem to have taken the term 'survival of the fittest' and twisted it around in a very particular way, which you BELIEVE "supports" your ALREADY held views and beliefs.

That is what we are in our genetic lines; even the most unfit of us, when compared to the average or above average.

But if you say EVERY individual is born the fittest, then how could there be any that are 'unfit'?

We mostly negatively express our tribalism/racism with violence, even to war and rebellion. The less profitable way to gain the upper hand as compared to trading. Check human history.

We are heading for violence in the U.S thanks to the oppression of too many groups.

"Heading", I think you are a bit LATE.

Blacks, natives, women, gays and all other groups that are oppressed unjustly are beginning to unite into a large group that will no longer be cowed.

Considering that you have just, ONCE AGAIN, shown your racist views, as though they are perfectly acceptable, then I do NOT see racism, in all forms ending very soon.

If nothing changes after peaceful means are tried, violence is bound to happen.

We must live in tribes as we are not in any way born free. That is the good part of tribalism, even as it holds the evil racism part within.

If you BELIEVE and SEE that we MUST "live in tribes", then you are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY MISSING the True and Right perspective of things here.

The evil part is using violence against those who are not in our own in groups.

Believing that there are SEPARATE groups is EVIL, in its MOST WRONG form.

That is of course what we whites have been doing to non-whites for a long time now in North America.

LOL You could NOT even begin to define 'white' in ANY true, right, nor correct way. As will be PROVEN by your INABILITY to even start doing this here now.

It is good to be tribal and loyal to our colors and tribes.

If you SEE 'tribes' and 'colors', then you are BLINDED to thee actual Truth of things.

It is foolish to not have the battle of the colors not shift to acceptance instead of hating others and bringing violence to all.

Placing human beings into colors and/or tribes is FOOLISH in the highest form.

Black to white, all our own genetic lines, have shown that they too are the fittest for their color.

This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now.

To kill or trade are the only ways to take advantage of each other in terms of control. Good competition without killing or oppressing each other is the ethical way forwards.

What do you think 'you', human beings, are "competing" for, EXACTLY?

I see this as what being civilized is all about, and the best way for tribes, black to white, to co-exist in peace.

You?

Regards
DL

How does a 'tribe' COMPETE, peacefully?

Trade instead of kill. That is what history has taught us. No?

Traditionally, we compete for resources and women.

"This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now."

Do you not see yourself as the fittest of your line? Why not?

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

"You will have to argue, soundly and validly, and thus prove that there is a, so called, "positive side" first before this could be answered, properly and correctly."

Tribes are what we must have to reproduce. If you do not see fellowship and survival as a plus, that is your deficiency and not mine.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

"Is there ANY actual EVIDENCE and PROOF that there is a, so called, "selfish gene's love bias of tribalism and racism for 'our' own kind and color", or is this just an attempt at "justifying" your ALREADY held beliefs and views?"

There is tons of evidence for this and yes, I use it to justify my position.

Try this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LIb22-5Lwg

"So, according to this "logic" EVERY human being is born with, so called, "negative racism", correct?

How does a new born baby differentiate between kind and color?"

They have eyes and instincts, although the color thing likely has a learned component. We are not sure how strong the color preference is as we seen to connect actions closely to our selfish needs. A white baby, for instance, does not seem to care if it has a black wet nurse.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

"But if you say EVERY individual is born the fittest, then how could there be any that are 'unfit'?"

The fittest of his line does not make him the fittest of the species.

Even a down baby, for instance, if the newest of his line, will be the best possible downs baby possible.

It is demonstrable that nature always does the best it can with the DNA at hand.

Regards
DL

[nothing]

Regardless of the natures you think we should have, nature has her own ideas and they have made you the best of your line. You cannot deny your selfish gene.

Nature does not have "ideas", it has laws upon which ideas are conceived/possible.

I do not know what you mean by "best of your line". If you are implying heretical lineage,
I do not identify with/as any physical ancestry (body) preceding my own.

Would you give up the gene that makes your family and friends important to you?

Would you that baby out with the bath water?

My family and friends are not important to me, that is:
no more or less important than anyone else. I do not see
individual lives, as no such things actually exists. This idea
of "individuals" due to having distinct physical bodies is like
a shared cancer this planet has. It leads to mindsets such as
us vs. them viz. "believer vs. unbeliever". That which is physical
is always in state of change (ie. motion): birth, growth, death.
What a human being (ie. conscious being) is, is not that
unless one "believes" themselves to be something they are not.

I agree that the god religions, be they Islam, Christianity or Judaic, are all garbage except for their esoteric or mystical branches who put humans above the gods we have invented. You only mentioned Islam while ignoring the other fascist parts of the Jewish god's immoral religions.

Regards
DL

Worshiping a single book is what makes the jew.
Muhammadans are themselves book-worshiping "jews".

Muslims collectively can not account for the book-worshiping "jew" that lives inside of themselves.
This is why they use "Jews" (ie. Torah Jews) as their scapegoat: to hide their own crimes against humanity
conducted in the "cause of Allah" (that is: in accordance to/with their DIVISION of BELIEVER vs. UNBELIEVER).

It is a great deception they have going on: that the problems of the world are due to "the Jews!" meanwhile
the House of Islam is composed of the real book-worshiping "jews" who plot to "kill the unbelievers" (ie. murderous).

[nothing]

interesting, i feel a conspiracy theory coming on - include the Elders of Zion if you wish - interested in what you are talking about here, though have no idea - yet...

...oh wow, i feel myself falling into the rabbit hole of nuttery here.

do enlighten me. interested.

'Conspiracy theory' is a device used to immediately shut down topics that do not reify the "mainstream narrative".
The "Elders of Zion" is a similar device used to distract people from who is actually trying to dominate the planet.

There is no rabbit hole, there is only real motives/will/intentions which have real roots in ideological hatred.
This hatred is reflected in as any "us vs. them" mentality viz. "believer vs. unbeliever". As it takes a "believer"
to "believe" themselves superior to others and/or others are inferior to themselves, the Nazis/supremacists
can only occupy the side of the "believers" in any such division (as perpetuated by the House of Islam).

Worshiping a single book is what makes a "jew", and Muhammadans are no less "jew" than any other "jew"
on the face of this planet. The 1400-year deception (ie. the only real "conspiracy theory") is "it's the JEWS!"
The (Torah) Jews are the default scapegoat of the House of Islam, the latter requiring
scapegoats for their own crimes against humanity, including "supremacism" which is an ideological
(ie. "belief"-based, Islamic) problem, not a racial one. The hatred for whites is being generated by Islam
because they need a scapegoat for their own supremacism.

[RCSaunders]

...EVERY human being is born with, so called, "negative racism", correct?

Absurdly wrong!

A white baby, for instance, does not seem to care if it has a black wet nurse.

...or a black mother, or black sister, and a black child does not care what color his parents and sibling are. One of the few good things going on today is the increasing number of marriages between individuals others try to put into racial or ethnic boxes. The sooner the world becomes a mongrel world, the better.

The ignorant hateful racism expressed on this thread is positively revolting and one of the worst aspects of all collective views.
[/quote]

[commonsense]

One of the few good things going on today is the increasing number of marriages between individuals others try to put into racial or ethnic boxes. The sooner the world becomes a mongrel world, the better.

Agree.

I believe it was interbreeding among species of humans that brought us to where we are now. Wouldn’t it be normal to expect this kind of thing to continue?

[RCSaunders]

One of the few good things going on today is the increasing number of marriages between individuals others try to put into racial or ethnic boxes. The sooner the world becomes a mongrel world, the better.

Agree.

I believe it was interbreeding among species of humans that brought us to where we are now. Wouldn’t it be normal to expect this kind of thing to continue?

I certainly expect the more rational of human beings to be more interested in essentials, like what another human being does and is than non-essentials like what another human being looks like, and from my purely selfish view, I find differences in others much more interesting than similarities, especially to myself. I certainly hope that attitude grows. Unfortunately, I'm afraid the great mass of people will continue to hold irrational prejudices, especially against those who they think are different form themselves or whatever ethnicity they identify with.

I'm not an evolutionist so I really don't know how much a mixture of genes in the past contributed to human nature. I suppose it could be and it certainly cannot hurt.

[Just as an aside, because it's usually misunderstood, I just do not accept any of the evolutionary explanations currently put forth. I don't reject them, they just don't answer the questions they claim to. I'm certainly not a creationist.]

[gaffo]

interesting, i feel a conspiracy theory coming on - include the Elders of Zion if you wish - interested in what you are talking about here, though have no idea - yet...

...oh wow, i feel myself falling into the rabbit hole of nuttery here.

do enlighten me. interested.

'Conspiracy theory' is a device used to immediately shut down topics that do not reify the "mainstream narrative".

that may be the usual, but i stated i wished to discuss your views (and yes most conpiracy theories are bullshit IMO - but there have been actual legit ones too - assasination of Lincoln, Kennedy, and maybe his little brother, and King Jr)

we know there was a conpiracy to kidnap FDR, it failed, but the investigation failed to prosecute also.

96 percent of conpiracies are fiction.

The "Elders of Zion" is a similar device used to distract people from who is actually trying to dominate the planet.

NO!

Elders of Zion is an actual book written in 1916? in Russia, and my reference to it was not claim it is not an actual work, but that it has been disscredited as actual history, and so i equated that books work with your mindset.

which to me seems equal.

There is no rabbit hole,

there is always a rabbit hole, whether you can see it or not.

there is only real motives/will/intentions which have real roots in ideological hatred.
This hatred is reflected in as any "us vs. them" mentality viz. "believer vs. unbeliever". As it takes a "believer"
to "believe" themselves superior to others and/or others are inferior to themselves, the Nazis/supremacists
can only occupy the side of the "believers" in any such division (as perpetuated by the House of Islam).

Worshiping a single book is what makes a "jew", and Muhammadans are no less "jew" than any other "jew"
on the face of this planet. The 1400-year deception (ie. the only real "conspiracy theory") is "it's the JEWS!"
The (Torah) Jews are the default scapegoat of the House of Islam, the latter requiring
scapegoats for their own crimes against humanity, including "supremacism" which is an ideological
(ie. "belief"-based, Islamic) problem, not a racial one.

ok tell me more, though i think you fell into said rabbit hole long ago, tell me more so i can understand your mindset.

The hatred for whites is being generated by Islam
because they need a scapegoat for their own supremacism.

thats just wrong, as i stated weeks ago, Islam allows lilly white Nords like me to convert to its faith and no Arab will think i'm not a true Muslim due to my white skin.

[gaffo]

One of the few good things going on today is the increasing number of marriages between individuals others try to put into racial or ethnic boxes. The sooner the world becomes a mongrel world, the better.

Agree.

I believe it was interbreeding among species of humans that brought us to where we are now. Wouldn’t it be normal to expect this kind of thing to continue?

as you prob know my GF is black - and to clarify your above post, humans interbred with other human species (neanderthal/Denszovan/ and an African equivalent) - 40,000 yrs ago (several times in fact - from 80k to 20 k ago) - in partial populations of Home Sapians (so not all and to a low degree so that the result is the usual 1-2 percent on ave of most Joe Ave have today) - those archaic humans separated from Homo Sapians 700,000 yrs ago.

the most distant relative of modern man is 1/10 th that, and on ave bet interacial folks probably 1/20th of that.

so that means 50,000 yrs of separation - a drop in the eye of evolution, and so not enough to actually matter per being human.

we are all human.

so no big deal.

[gaffo]

I find differences in others much more interesting than similarities, especially to myself.

this is where we differ, i value the commonality of man as a universal humanist, and ignore any minor and irrelivant differences.

I certainly hope that attitude grows.

I fervently hope it does not!!!!!!!! i loathe indentity politics!

[Age]

Does the positive side of tribalism/racism outshine the negative side?

You will have to argue, soundly and validly, and thus prove that there is a, so called, "positive side" first before this could be answered, properly and correctly.

The moment we follow our selfish gene’s love bias of tribalism and racism for our own kind and color, we create a hate bias for all other kinds and colors.

Is there ANY actual EVIDENCE and PROOF that there is a, so called, "selfish gene's love bias of tribalism and racism for 'our' own kind and color", or is this just an attempt at "justifying" your ALREADY held beliefs and views?

Negative racism is born in us from our love of our own kind and color. It is natural and normal for the human species.

So, according to this "logic" EVERY human being is born with, so called, "negative racism", correct?

How does a new born baby differentiate between kind and color?

The more I look into what you say the MORE ABSURD it is Truly becoming. But, you MAYBE able to CLARIFY and answer my clarifying questions sufficiently. We will just have to wait and see.

We are born the fittest of our line.

When you say 'we' here, do you mean EVERY individual?

If no, then what do you mean?

It follows that nature would have it no other way for us as individual animals but to think of ourselves as the best.

Well 'i' MUST NOT BE a part of 'Nature', Itself. As i have it another way. i do NOT think of thy 'self' as the best at all. i think of thy 'self' as just an EQUAL one as EVERY other one IS.

Nature always creates for the best possible end and for each of us and our genetic line, something like us is the best.

Maybe so, 'us' as thee collective ONE maybe the, so called, 'best', BUT NO individual 'one' is better than another individual 'one'.

Tribalism/racism has a dual nature. Good parts and evil parts. Mostly good but it is hell when the uglier negative racist side is in play.

But WHY would be, so called, "hell"? Especially as you say this is Nature and that we are born this way.

Also, WHY would Nature create what is, so called, "ugly"?

What is 'ugly' to 'you' is NOT necessarily 'ugly' to "another".

We are racist because we know that reality favors the survival of the fittest.

I would say that 'you' are racist just because you were taught to hate "others" and/or see "others" as different races.

Also, you seem to have taken the term 'survival of the fittest' and twisted it around in a very particular way, which you BELIEVE "supports" your ALREADY held views and beliefs.

That is what we are in our genetic lines; even the most unfit of us, when compared to the average or above average.

But if you say EVERY individual is born the fittest, then how could there be any that are 'unfit'?

We mostly negatively express our tribalism/racism with violence, even to war and rebellion. The less profitable way to gain the upper hand as compared to trading. Check human history.

We are heading for violence in the U.S thanks to the oppression of too many groups.

"Heading", I think you are a bit LATE.

Blacks, natives, women, gays and all other groups that are oppressed unjustly are beginning to unite into a large group that will no longer be cowed.

Considering that you have just, ONCE AGAIN, shown your racist views, as though they are perfectly acceptable, then I do NOT see racism, in all forms ending very soon.

If nothing changes after peaceful means are tried, violence is bound to happen.

We must live in tribes as we are not in any way born free. That is the good part of tribalism, even as it holds the evil racism part within.

If you BELIEVE and SEE that we MUST "live in tribes", then you are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY MISSING the True and Right perspective of things here.

The evil part is using violence against those who are not in our own in groups.

Believing that there are SEPARATE groups is EVIL, in its MOST WRONG form.

That is of course what we whites have been doing to non-whites for a long time now in North America.

LOL You could NOT even begin to define 'white' in ANY true, right, nor correct way. As will be PROVEN by your INABILITY to even start doing this here now.

It is good to be tribal and loyal to our colors and tribes.

If you SEE 'tribes' and 'colors', then you are BLINDED to thee actual Truth of things.

It is foolish to not have the battle of the colors not shift to acceptance instead of hating others and bringing violence to all.

Placing human beings into colors and/or tribes is FOOLISH in the highest form.

Black to white, all our own genetic lines, have shown that they too are the fittest for their color.

This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now.

To kill or trade are the only ways to take advantage of each other in terms of control. Good competition without killing or oppressing each other is the ethical way forwards.

What do you think 'you', human beings, are "competing" for, EXACTLY?

I see this as what being civilized is all about, and the best way for tribes, black to white, to co-exist in peace.

You?

Regards
DL

How does a 'tribe' COMPETE, peacefully?

Trade instead of kill.

But HOW is this 'competing'?

What, exactly, is being 'competed' for, when one 'trades'?

That is what history has taught us. No?

But this, OBVIOUSLY, has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL to do with what I asked.

Traditionally, we compete for resources and women.

Why ONLY 'women'? WHY do you look at this from only one perspective?

And, if you compete for the resources that "others" NEED, to keep living, then this will eventually lead to NOT being peaceful at all. As actually evidenced by history, correct?

"This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now."

Do you not see yourself as the fittest of your line? Why not?

Because you have NOT YET explained what "your line" could actually mean?

What is "your line"?

AND, your 'attempts' at twisting and distorting what I ACTUALLY say and mean, and 'trying to' deflect away from that as though to mean something else does NOT work on me.

Regards
DL

[RCSaunders]

I find differences in others much more interesting than similarities, especially to myself.

this is where we differ, i value the commonality of man as a universal humanist, and ignore any minor and irrelivant differences.

I certainly hope that attitude grows.

I fervently hope it does not!!!!!!!! i loathe indentity politics!

It has nothing to do with politics, it has only to do with a love of human nature and the knowledge that every human being is unique and a potential source of enjoyment and value not matter how different they are. It does not mean the all, "matter," only that they all can if they choose to.

The only commonality among human being is that they are human, each with his own mind, who must do his own learning, thinking, and choosing and is responsible for their own life. Within the scope of human nature, every individual human being is different from ever other human being. No two human beings have exactly the same physical features or abilities. No two human beings have exactly the same tastes. No two human beings enjoy exactly the same things. No two human beings have exactly the same mental ability.

Every human being must eat, that's a necessity of his physiological nature, but no two human beings must eat or even wants to eat exactly the same things and there is no limit to the variety of human diet. Everyhuman being must learn, that's a necessity of his psychological nature. But there is no limit to the variety of degree of learning each individual's abilities and interests will make necessary or possible.

The similarities or commonalities among human beings is only the potential, what each individual chooses to do with that potential is what matters. To emphasize the commonality is to ignore what is truly significant about human beings, their unlimited ability to be creative and original, not a bunch of little robots all marching to the same beat.

Would you really want to live in a world where everyone was Gaffo? where everyone looked like you, did the same things you do, thought the same things you think, wore the same things, ate the same things, and no one ever did anything original or different? Nineteen Eighty Four, must have described Utopia for you.

[Greatest I am]

You will have to argue, soundly and validly, and thus prove that there is a, so called, "positive side" first before this could be answered, properly and correctly.



Is there ANY actual EVIDENCE and PROOF that there is a, so called, "selfish gene's love bias of tribalism and racism for 'our' own kind and color", or is this just an attempt at "justifying" your ALREADY held beliefs and views?



So, according to this "logic" EVERY human being is born with, so called, "negative racism", correct?

How does a new born baby differentiate between kind and color?

The more I look into what you say the MORE ABSURD it is Truly becoming. But, you MAYBE able to CLARIFY and answer my clarifying questions sufficiently. We will just have to wait and see.



When you say 'we' here, do you mean EVERY individual?

If no, then what do you mean?



Well 'i' MUST NOT BE a part of 'Nature', Itself. As i have it another way. i do NOT think of thy 'self' as the best at all. i think of thy 'self' as just an EQUAL one as EVERY other one IS.



Maybe so, 'us' as thee collective ONE maybe the, so called, 'best', BUT NO individual 'one' is better than another individual 'one'.



But WHY would be, so called, "hell"? Especially as you say this is Nature and that we are born this way.

Also, WHY would Nature create what is, so called, "ugly"?

What is 'ugly' to 'you' is NOT necessarily 'ugly' to "another".



I would say that 'you' are racist just because you were taught to hate "others" and/or see "others" as different races.

Also, you seem to have taken the term 'survival of the fittest' and twisted it around in a very particular way, which you BELIEVE "supports" your ALREADY held views and beliefs.



But if you say EVERY individual is born the fittest, then how could there be any that are 'unfit'?



"Heading", I think you are a bit LATE.



Considering that you have just, ONCE AGAIN, shown your racist views, as though they are perfectly acceptable, then I do NOT see racism, in all forms ending very soon.



If you BELIEVE and SEE that we MUST "live in tribes", then you are COMPLETELY and UTTERLY MISSING the True and Right perspective of things here.



Believing that there are SEPARATE groups is EVIL, in its MOST WRONG form.



LOL You could NOT even begin to define 'white' in ANY true, right, nor correct way. As will be PROVEN by your INABILITY to even start doing this here now.



If you SEE 'tribes' and 'colors', then you are BLINDED to thee actual Truth of things.



Placing human beings into colors and/or tribes is FOOLISH in the highest form.



This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now.



What do you think 'you', human beings, are "competing" for, EXACTLY?



How does a 'tribe' COMPETE, peacefully?

Trade instead of kill.

But HOW is this 'competing'?

What, exactly, is being 'competed' for, when one 'trades'?

That is what history has taught us. No?

But this, OBVIOUSLY, has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AT ALL to do with what I asked.

Traditionally, we compete for resources and women.

Why ONLY 'women'? WHY do you look at this from only one perspective?

And, if you compete for the resources that "others" NEED, to keep living, then this will eventually lead to NOT being peaceful at all. As actually evidenced by history, correct?

"This is so DISTORTED it is getting beyond complete ridiculousness now."

Do you not see yourself as the fittest of your line? Why not?

Because you have NOT YET explained what "your line" could actually mean?

What is "your line"?

AND, your 'attempts' at twisting and distorting what I ACTUALLY say and mean, and 'trying to' deflect away from that as though to mean something else does NOT work on me.

Regards
DL

It seems we are both distorting things. I am being generous.

Let's see if we can communicate.

If you need proof of the selfish gene. I will let you do the research what the evolutionists are saying.

If your selfish gene is not dominant, then which gene do you seed as dominant?

If you cannot see it at work in these babies, I doubt that my answering all your questions would help you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LIb22-5Lwg

As to all of us being the fittest when born, if you cannot picture your family tree and see that the youngest are the fittest nature can produce, including the flaws you see in the less fortunate, then you do not seem to be accepting that nature creates for our best possible end, even as you seem to have acknowledge it above.

Regards
DL