Here’s a question for anyone who believes in the existence of HELL:

[Dontaskme]

Why do 'you', people, in this forum, concern "yourselves" with my "most laughable load of totally pure baloney known to man"?

Why NOT just laugh at what I say, and just be happy with that?

Why is there the continual name calling, and attacking, of 'me'?

Why is there such a HATRED and RIDICULING of 'me' when I am just express my views?

If my views are absurd and laughable to 'you', then WHY not just stay focused on the views? Why is there the turning on the "person"?

Why NOT just laugh at what EVERYBODY else is saying, and just be happy with that?

Ooops, looks like you really do enjoy putting one foot in your mouth, and the other up your arse.

Bye the way, there is no 'me'

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[Dontaskme]

How do 'you' KNOW that 'I' have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self?

I don't know.

You've just assumed there is another one that does know. And now you have to ask this assumed other HOW that assumed knowing is known.

And also, you yourself have stated many times to other people that they have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self. You know, those other people you assume to exist.

And so when it is pointed out to you that you too have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self..you don't like that do you, and yet it's exactly what you say unto others.

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[Age]

I am a Christian. Where in the bible does it state you must first die to enter hell or heaven?

First, let’s look at what Wiki has to say about Hell (underlining mine):

In religion and folklore, Hell is an afterlife location in which evil souls are subjected to punitive suffering, often torture as eternal punishment after death. Religions with a linear divine history often depict hells as eternal destinations, the biggest examples of which are Christianity and Islam...

Now from the Biblical perspective, I think that the general idea of heaven and hell coming after death comes from verses like these...

BUT, EXACTLY as the clarifying question was posed, to you (underlining mine):
'Where in the bible does it state you must first die to enter hell or heaven?

As I have STATED earlier, the word 'afterlife' is NOT in reference to 'you', human beings. This is what has been MISCONSTRUED and MISINTERPRETED, as I was EXPLAINING earlier.

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God...

And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

...And from the assertion of an alleged “Final Judgment” that comes only after death:

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels...

Now just in case you are trying to make the point that some horrible situation one might experience while on earth can be described as hellish in nature, then we’re not talking about the same thing.

You are right in that 'we' are NOT talking about the same thing. This is because you WANT to believe some thing, which is OBVIOUSLY RIDICULOUS and ABSURD.

You have NOT produced absolutely ANY thing that is referencing absolutely ANY thing in regards to a human being dying, and after its death in relation to heaven and/or hell.

With that in mind, the question is: would you, Christian or Muslim,...

(or anyone else who believes in the existence of the heaven/hell scenario)

...be willing to relinquish your eternal life of bliss in heaven if - by reason of some kind of divine law - it would extricate a loved one from an eternity of torture in hell?

In other words,...

(at least in terms of this hypothetical situation)

...if you understood that your sacrifice would forever erase you and your loved one from the “Book Of Life,” would you be willing to do that if it would end the eternal suffering of someone dear to you?

Absolutely I would.

Good on you, atto, you have given the answer that I was hoping to see.

It is a simple, pure, and unhesitant response that (in my opinion) a truly loving person would give.

But a Truly LOVING person does not pick and choose ONLY 'some' to be a, so called, "loved one".

A Truly LOVING person LOVES EVERY one equally, OBVIOUSLY.

Thank you for courageously demonstrating precisely what all those who claim to be a “Christian” should be demonstrating.

This is one of the most idiotic and illogical ideas that I have heard of.

If a person who loves only "another" one, then they supposedly "should" 'sacrifice' them 'self' so that one dear to them could live eternally without suffering, then OBVIOUSLY if they loved the one that sacrificed for them, then they would now be 'suffering' severely, eternally, for knowing that the one that was dear to them, sacrificed them self and is now suffering eternally.

This WHOLE concept of one person being able to live eternally in peace or in suffering is just TOTALLY ABSURD. The WHOLE idea around 'heaven' and 'hell' has absolutely NOTHING WHATSOEVER AT ALL to do with the concept of a person living eternally in either peace or suffering. To even ASSUME that this is what is MEANT is just ABSURD ITSELF.

While we are on hypothetical mode, would ANYONE, atheists included - that found themselves faced with the same quandary?

Needless to say, atheists/materialists would no doubt exempt themselves from this hypothetical situation.

Philosophically speaking, can heaven truly exist for ANYONE in consideration that so much suffering remains - not even including 'hell'?

I don’t quite understand that question. Can you please clarify it?
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WHY do "others" get asked to clarify, yet I rarely do, if ever?

WHY does what I say get instantly ASSUMED to mean one thing?

[Age]

Why do 'you', people, in this forum, concern "yourselves" with my "most laughable load of totally pure baloney known to man"?

Why NOT just laugh at what I say, and just be happy with that?

Why is there the continual name calling, and attacking, of 'me'?

Why is there such a HATRED and RIDICULING of 'me' when I am just express my views?

If my views are absurd and laughable to 'you', then WHY not just stay focused on the views? Why is there the turning on the "person"?

Why NOT just laugh at what EVERYBODY else is saying, and just be happy with that?

Ooops, looks like you really do enjoy putting one foot in your mouth, and the other up your arse.

Bye the way, there is no 'me'

.

You appear to have MISSED the WHOLE POINT.

The POINT IS; I stay focused on the view/position, and do NOT turn onto the person, the 'self'.

By the way, I am NOT unhappy, NOR happy.

I just discuss the views/positions taken.

[Age]

How do 'you' KNOW that 'I' have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self?

I don't know.

Okay.

You've just assumed there is another one that does know.

No I have NOT. As I ALREADY KNOW that there is ONLY One that KNOWS.

And now you have to ask this assumed other HOW that assumed knowing is known.

I do NOT have to ask any such thing.

I ALREADY KNOW.

And also, you yourself have stated many times to other people that they have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self.

Will you PLEASE stay with One view ONLY and STOP switching and changing your views to suit whatever way you want to LOOK AT things.

Sure, you are free to change your views to opposing views once, or at the most a few times only, over a life time. But, changing your views to opposite views from post to post is NOT helping 'you' at all.

Is there "other people" or is there not?

You know, those other people you assume to exist.

But I do NOT assume this.

And so when it is pointed out to you that you too have NOT YET uncovered thy True Self..you don't like that do you, and yet it's exactly what you say unto others.

.

I REALLY do NOT care.

This is because I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Also, who and/or what are these "others", which 'you' are referring to here?

[Dontaskme]

The POINT IS; I stay focused on the view/position, and do NOT turn onto the person, the 'self'.

By the way, I am NOT unhappy, NOR happy.

I just discuss the views/positions taken.

Then you are NOT for TURNING.

SO, why make a fuss about it.

[Dontaskme]

This is because I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Then why ask for clarification for what you already KNOW is actual truth here.

Are there two of you? One that knows and One that does not know?

This is because I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Also, who and/or what are these "others", which 'you' are referring to here?

But why ask who and or what are these others - when you've already claimed here > I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Did you forget what you already know?

[Age]

The POINT IS; I stay focused on the view/position, and do NOT turn onto the person, the 'self'.

By the way, I am NOT unhappy, NOR happy.

I just discuss the views/positions taken.

Then you are NOT for TURNING.

SO, why make a fuss about it.

But I am NOT making a "fuss". I am expressing the views I have.

Just because 'you' perceive "another" is making a "fuss", this does NOT make 'it' a 'fuss' to the "other".

[Age]

This is because I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Then why ask for clarification for what you already KNOW is actual truth here.

Are there two of you? One that knows and One that does not know?

Yes. 'I' KNOW, whereas 'you' do NOT YET KNOW.

This is because I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Also, who and/or what are these "others", which 'you' are referring to here?

But why ask who and or what are these others - when you've already claimed here > I ALREADY KNOW what thee actual Truth IS, here.

Did you forget what you already know?

BECAUSE 'I' was asking 'you' what 'your' view IS, in regards to what you said.

See, I just do NOT accept what is said and written by ANY one. I like to see if they can actually explain what they are saying. If they can do this is a sound, logically reasoned way or with a sound, valid argument, then I WILL accept and agree with what they are saying. Until then I like to CLARIFY FIRST what the "other" is ACTUALLY saying, and thus ACTUALLY MEANING.

But, if they can NOT explain NOR clarify what they are actually saying and meaning, then so be it. There is nothing lost, well for me anyway.

[Dontaskme]

Then you are NOT for TURNING.

SO, why make a fuss about it.

But I am NOT making a "fuss". I am expressing the views I have.

Just because 'you' perceive "another" is making a "fuss", this does NOT make 'it' a 'fuss' to the "other".

Why is there the continual name calling, and attacking, of 'me'?

Why is there such a HATRED and RIDICULING of 'me' when I am just express my views?

Just because 'you' perceive "another" is making out to be hating, ridculing, name calling and attacking on 'you' - this does NOT make 'it' a making out to be hating, ridculing,name calling and attacking to the "other". I am simply expressing the views I have.


.

[Dontaskme]

Are there two of you? One that knows and One that does not know?

Yes. 'I' KNOW, whereas 'you' do NOT YET KNOW.

Oh I see, I get what you are saying...you are saying ..The I there know, but the I here does not yet know until it does know.

Oh kaaaay!

'I' was asking 'you' what 'your' view IS, in regards to what you said.

But the 'you' do NOT YET KNOW... So why bother asking this 'you' do NOT YET KNOW what it's view IS?

[Dontaskme]

See, I just do NOT accept what is said and written by ANY one. I like to see if they can actually explain what they are saying. If they can do this is a sound, logically reasoned way or with a sound, valid argument, then I WILL accept and agree with what they are saying. Until then I like to CLARIFY FIRST what the "other" is ACTUALLY saying, and thus ACTUALLY MEANING.

But, if they can NOT explain NOR clarify what they are actually saying and meaning, then so be it. There is nothing lost, well for me anyway.

But nobody actually gives a fuck whether 'you' there accepts what this 'you' do NOT YET KNOW here ..is saying.

And since this 'you' there doesn't give a flying fuck either when no clarification comes from the 'you' do NOT YET KNOW here ...then nothing lost, well for 'you' there AND for 'you' do NOT YET KNOW here... anyway. So what was the actual point of this pointless conversation anyway, I forgot?

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[seeds]

Thank you, Sculptor.

And other than creating a lot of wind while exhibiting the depth and degree of one’s insanity, it’s highly unlikely that any of us in this forum (this asylum rec room) ever achieves anything that we set out to achieve.

I suppose so.
I'm happy with a longer post I made yesterday about the difference between "amoral" and "immoral"; and between Darwin's concepts of Domestic Selection against Natural Selection.
Sadly the target was Skeptic who lost no time attacking from a position of ignorance and accused me of "special pleading".

Yes, you made some good points there.

However, your main mistake was in assuming that Skepdick is capable of being reasoned with.
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[seeds]

It seems that only in a philosophy forum do some people address others as "you human beings". There must be space aliens or something among us.

Not “space aliens,” Gary; channeled entities.

(Although I’m not ruling out some kind of new and insidious conquering method being used by the Borg. )
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[seeds]

Philosophically speaking, can heaven truly exist for ANYONE in consideration that so much suffering remains - not even including 'hell'?

I don’t quite understand that question. Can you please clarify it?

Sure. My sage/God informed me some time ago I am in heaven. I recently had shitloads of money deposited into my bank, my house is paid off...i never have to work again. They occasionally state - 'do art'. Indeed, who ARTS in HEAVEN - me apparently.

When I just awoke this morning, they started on me as they do every night/morning - (something really nice, pretty awesome actually.) But I told them to fuck off...
Fuck heaven fuck everything. I called God and Christ a pair of betraying jew ***s. How can I be in heaven when my mother has been betrayed by them, who has late stage Parkinsons, indeed is in great pain for most of the day & night.

Hope that clarifies.

Yes, atto, it clarifies for me that not only do you not resemble any kind of Christian that I am familiar with (and that’s okay, so try not to have a cow),...

...but also that you did not seem to understand (or simply chose to ignore) this:

Now just in case you are trying to make the point that some horrible situation one might experience while on earth can be described as hellish in nature, then we’re not talking about the same thing.

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