Sculptor wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 10:55 am
gaffo wrote: ↑Mon May 18, 2020 2:16 am
Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:17 am
Of course. Dog like sausage. God like Sosej.
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jesus was an Essene Jew! a rural man that had the gift of thought and speaking and so gain a rep as a wise speaker/prophet.
He never claimed he was God nor the son of!!!!!!!
what he said survives via 50 yr later Gospels via the serman on the mount/etc..........but his nature at more than a man was created decade after his death! and is utter heresy per Judaism - and Jesus is spining in his grave for 2 millian for folks placing him equal/as the God he worshiped!
he's still spining, and Christianity -is heresy per the man Jesus - who was of course dead and not able to protest and corrupt his nature when that newer religion was created.
Let's face it. If there was a rabbi called Jesus who was crucified, then it is highly doubtful that much in the NT give a reliable account of his life.
Agreed! and thanks for reply sir.
a question for you though, in the above i note the "if" - i personally believe there was a person (probably name joshua (jesus) - just due to a record from disparate accounts - Mark/Matt/Luke (from "Q") - and Gospel of thomas, which may b from "Q", but not related to M/M/L in any way. I note the common sayings attributed to the man Joshua ..the fact that Gosp. Thomas has similar saying to the synopics though nor related historicially, to me is enough for me to believe the man "jesus" (Joshua) existed.
IMO its most likely "jesus" was not literate and so left no record of his own (literacy in the ancient world was around 10 percent - at best).
But he must have had much personality and wisdom, for others to write down what he had to say.
and they did.
Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:17 am
And I think we can be pretty sure that all the mystical stuff about resurrection, god, and miracles is total bunkum.
yes absolutely.
Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:17 am
Humans claiming to be the son of God were, in ancient times ten a penny. Whether serious thinkers at the time took any heed of it was highly unlikely. "Son of God " as about as clear a title as "Star" is in today's tabloid media.
Not knowledgeble enough per Hinduism to know if a mortal prophet claiming to be the son of God/gods is heresy, but per Judiasm (and we are talking about the Near East here - not the Far East) - I know more about Judaism than either Christianity and of course Hinduism (which i know little of). Greek Theology allows for such claims, and I'm sure there were many Greek nuts that proclaimed themsleves as the son of zeus/some other of the hellenite gods/etc...............now lost to history of course.
Montanus anyone? - just a name i know of, not particulars, welcome education about him from anyone that knows more than me about him.
No Jewish human - including Jesus - would claim to be the Son of God!!!!!!!!!!! - this is HERESY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and Jesus was an Essene Jew! - so the last to claim to be the Son of his God!
Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:17 am
Little Susej was not the messiah; he was a very naughty boy, who left his village, got mixed up with the wrong people, and left him mum to fend for herself.
Note, i think you may misuderstand the nature of a Messiah Sir.
IMO -from reading Gosp of Mark and understanding Ego, i think Jesus at first thought his station in prophesy was the same as John the Baptist (his mentor) (to be the messinger of the Messiah to come) - but sometime over the 3 yrs of Jesus' mission and after John's beheading, began to think that rather than being the messenger, he was in fact the messiah!!!!!! - i think his ego to the better of him IMO.
per the Messiah, such a person is not devine, not the Son of God (such a concept is heresy per Judiasm), just a fellow that was born via intercourse by a regular man and regular woman, who YHWH decided deserved to be anointed as a messiah to lead the Jews out of bondage.
IMO, Abraham was a messiah, as was Moses, and King David, and lastly Jesus.
...............
as you say there were many self proclaimed messiahs when the romans rulled over Judea - I'd say probably one every decade - add the math up - (Roman rule over Judea from 60? BC - to 130 AD (Barcokba was the last Messiah - 100? self proclaimed Messiahs - "the Egytian" is but one) - Rome ruled over Judea for another millinia, but the Jewish religion and hope for a messiah was broken 800 yrs earlier when Barkoba failed to free the Jews from roman rule, and Judiasm itself reformed from a Prophetic Nationalistic Religion - to an insular Rabbinic one - in order to survived under Pagan Roman rule and later Christian Roman rule.