Do we need consciousness?

Is the mind the same as the body? What is consciousness? Can machines have it?

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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

commonsense wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:21 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:29 am
There is a difference between being optimally functional and able to survive. Technically we can get by without legs, but you don’t see many people opting to amputate. Eyebrows serve an important function of expression and communication. Sure, we can text each other, but you wouldn’t go ripping out your voice box in a hurry.
I’m just saying we don’t need whatever we have. Thank you for correcting me about eyebrows.
You quoted the wrong person!
commonsense
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by commonsense »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:41 pm
commonsense wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:21 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:29 am
There is a difference between being optimally functional and able to survive. Technically we can get by without legs, but you don’t see many people opting to amputate. Eyebrows serve an important function of expression and communication. Sure, we can text each other, but you wouldn’t go ripping out your voice box in a hurry.
I’m just saying we don’t need whatever we have. Thank you for correcting me about eyebrows.
You quoted the wrong person!
My apologies to SOB and Dimebag.
commonsense
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by commonsense »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:40 pm
commonsense wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 5:09 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:29 am
We need what ever it is that we have, else we wouldn’t have it.
The appendix is obsolete. Eyebrows are not necessary. 1 kidney can do the work of 2.
To deny evolution, thus time is ridiculous.
Yes. Evolution is the reason why the appendix is obsolete, but renal functionality does not have anything to do with evolution (this has been unchanged by time).
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:49 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:40 pm
commonsense wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 5:09 pm

The appendix is obsolete. Eyebrows are not necessary. 1 kidney can do the work of 2.
To deny evolution, thus time is ridiculous.
Yes. Evolution is the reason why the appendix is obsolete, but renal functionality does not have anything to do with evolution (this has been unchanged by time).
What measure of time do you consider enough?
Are you the one that has the final say in such matters?
Both had/have to do with the excretion/elimination of toxins, how long has it been that we're more knowledgeable about what we should and should not eat/drink?
Have you studied biochemistry at all, such to know that much of what we still consume is hazardous to our health?
How many people suffer from CKD and why is it the case?
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:45 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:41 pm
commonsense wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:21 pm

I’m just saying we don’t need whatever we have. Thank you for correcting me about eyebrows.
You quoted the wrong person!
My apologies to SOB and Dimebag.
No worries, I was really just trying to be informative for all the passersby.
commonsense
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by commonsense »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:05 pm
commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:49 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:40 pm
To deny evolution, thus time is ridiculous.
Yes. Evolution is the reason why the appendix is obsolete, but renal functionality does not have anything to do with evolution (this has been unchanged by time).
What measure of time do you consider enough?
Are you the one that has the final say in such matters?
Both had/have to do with the excretion/elimination of toxins, how long has it been that we're more knowledgeable about what we should and should not eat/drink?
Have you studied biochemistry at all, such to know that much of what we still consume is hazardous to our health?
How many people suffer from CKD and why is it the case?
Yes. Biochemistry & physiology relate that GFR with 1 kidney is sufficient for homeostasis and function WNL.
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:13 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:05 pm
commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:49 pm

Yes. Evolution is the reason why the appendix is obsolete, but renal functionality does not have anything to do with evolution (this has been unchanged by time).
What measure of time do you consider enough?
Are you the one that has the final say in such matters?
Both had/have to do with the excretion/elimination of toxins, how long has it been that we're more knowledgeable about what we should and should not eat/drink?
Have you studied biochemistry at all, such to know that much of what we still consume is hazardous to our health?
How many people suffer from CKD and why is it the case?
Yes. Biochemistry & physiology relate that GFR with 1 kidney is sufficient for homeostasis and function WNL.
You missed my point, my rhetorical questions were all about Evolution, and it's timescale relative to toxins in our diet. Whom is to say how long it takes for mutations to occur relative to the animals senses?
commonsense
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by commonsense »

SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:34 pm
commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:13 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:05 pm
What measure of time do you consider enough?
Are you the one that has the final say in such matters?
Both had/have to do with the excretion/elimination of toxins, how long has it been that we're more knowledgeable about what we should and should not eat/drink?
Have you studied biochemistry at all, such to know that much of what we still consume is hazardous to our health?
How many people suffer from CKD and why is it the case?
Yes. Biochemistry & physiology relate that GFR with 1 kidney is sufficient for homeostasis and function WNL.
You missed my point, my rhetorical questions were all about Evolution, and it's timescale relative to toxins in our diet. Whom is to say how long it takes for mutations to occur relative to the animals senses?
Do you suppose that evolution continues and the appendix hasn’t gone away yet but it will? Or is it that evolution continues but the appendix is still necessary?

Did you want to move the discussion to something other than consciousness? Evolution? Time? Toxins?
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SpheresOfBalance
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Re: Do we need consciousness?

Post by SpheresOfBalance »

commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 7:10 pm
SpheresOfBalance wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:34 pm
commonsense wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:13 pm

Yes. Biochemistry & physiology relate that GFR with 1 kidney is sufficient for homeostasis and function WNL.
You missed my point, my rhetorical questions were all about Evolution, and it's timescale relative to toxins in our diet. Whom is to say how long it takes for mutations to occur relative to the animals senses?
Do you suppose that evolution continues and the appendix hasn’t gone away yet but it will? Or is it that evolution continues but the appendix is still necessary?
My point is that all evolutionary changes depend on environment, it's not due to random mutations, such that if an animal eats or drinks from sources containing toxins, those viscera responsible for filtering such toxins may remain for some time, especially if it's only the instances or concentrations of ingestion that has been reduced. Even once removed completely from the diet, it may take a considerable amount of time for the viscera to be eliminated. That there is no necessary timetable for such to occur, that we may currently understand.

So as with your point about kindey's, I think one has to consider the levels of CKD in the populous when asking why there are two? Remember that life wants to survive at all costs. With only one kidney surely the instances of CKD might increase.



Did you want to move the discussion to something other than consciousness? Evolution? Time? Toxins?
No, I'm not one that tries to compartmentalize the truths of human understanding. In fact I see that it's foolish to do so. While humankind seems to need to draw arbitrary lines so as to delineate, the universal perspective does not. Everything is related no matter how some humans have a need to draw arbitrary lines.

As far as consciousness is concerned, I'm not so sure I believe in such a nondescript concept. So when I see one talking of it I use my understanding of what they mean, which is the computational products of sensory information. And I see that it happens on a very minute scale, that the cells in our bodies communicate to the brain via the CNS and vice versa, so as to put into place those changes required to maintain this multicellular organisms survival. So I see that what we're currently contributing is on topic in a more truer/broader sense.

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