duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
It seems to me that most of what we say if full of unproven assumptions.
The sentence I have just written does not assume anything because of the introduction unit "it seems to me".
The second sentence I have just written does not assume anything either, because it is purely analytical.
Or do you see any assumption in it of any kind ?
Please be as intransigant as Descartes.
I think not.
"It seems to me" is almost directly identical in meaning to an assumption.
An assumption is a state where what "seems to be the case" is applied unchallenged.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
It seems to me that most of what we say if full of unproven assumptions.
It depends whether we have a self-consistent system of thought or not. We don't have it yet. So there are some unproven assumptions.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
The sentence I have just written does not assume anything because of the introduction unit "it seems to me".
No, that is not correct since what is reality is a matter of proof rather than what it seems to us. You are assuming that what seems to you is true.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
The second sentence I have just written does not assume anything either, because it is purely analytical.
Or do you see any assumption in it of any kind ?
Please be as intransigant as Descartes.
We have to rely on heuristics because it is too burdensome to deal with the information to "prove" unstated assumptions, and it is rational only because we take for granted what works and demonize what does not despite it coming from the same methodology. Axioms exist because they are useful. Without them, we would not have been able to proceed as far as we have. Wrong axioms that are too grave usually end up correcting themselves and end up becoming a growing pain, analogous to man being a teenager growing up.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
It seems to me that most of what we say if full of unproven assumptions.
The sentence I have just written does not assume anything because of the introduction unit "it seems to me".
The second sentence I have just written does not assume anything either, because it is purely analytical.
Or do you see any assumption in it of any kind ?
Please be as intransigant as Descartes.
The second sentence you have written above assumes that you are the one who wrote it. You may know this to be true, but I must assume so.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
It seems to me that most of what we say if full of unproven assumptions.
The sentence I have just written does not assume anything because of the introduction unit "it seems to me".
The second sentence I have just written does not assume anything either, because it is purely analytical.
Or do you see any assumption in it of any kind ?
Please be as intransigant as Descartes.
You're assuming lots. You assume that some person can read this in your language. You assume someone to respond to your question. ...etc.
You are wrong to state that adding "it seems to me" as some get out-of-jail card on the potential accusation of your assumption too. Anything you EXPECT others to 'trust' of your claims or statements at all is an "assumption" that you expect others to at least presume 'true', even if just for the sake of argument.
As you say, the author assumes much. However, the question was about what the sentence assumes.
duszek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm
It seems to me that most of what we say if full of unproven assumptions.
The sentence I have just written does not assume anything because of the introduction unit "it seems to me".
The second sentence I have just written does not assume anything either, because it is purely analytical.
Or do you see any assumption in it of any kind ?
Please be as intransigant as Descartes.
You are assuming that statements can be something more than communications.
duszek wrote: ↑Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:00 pm
Perhaps there is a misunderstanding.
I don´t quite see a difference between an assumption and a presumption.
In a syllogism it is an unproven premise.
What we assume to be true is only visible in our utterances. We cannot be sure what other people assume just like this, by intuition or whatever. We can guess, of course, but a guess is only a guess.
What I wanted to discuss were unproven assumptions as they appear in our utterances.
On this forum our written statements in posts.
If you don´t wish to continue this because you are disappointed, Seagull, then it´s o.k.
I believe that I understand all of your post, because I believe that my interpretation of your utterance is sufficiently close to your intended meanings.
I think that we make those guesses based on heuristics formed from our social experiences. For example, if everyone runs away when I shout, “Fire!” then I guess that my utterance means, at least nearly if not exactly, the same thing to those people. Of course, in this case the meaning of the word is assisted by my tone of voice.
Last edited by commonsense on Sat Sep 14, 2019 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.