DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

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Dontaskme
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Dontaskme »

Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:50 am
If you are going to ask a question like; "Is it better to have never been born?", then better in relation to what exactly?
Questions can only arise to the sense of separation, a self who believes it is born. In reality no such self exists. So in answer to the question: ''......better in relationship to what exactly.....'' the answer is to itself the one that believes it is born but wishes it hadn't been, because not having been born is better for that one.
Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:50 amYour question specifically asked; "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?" So, if I answer your question and "proclaim" that being born is better, then I proclaim it is better to become aware, then to have never been aware. The only way for a human being to become aware is to be born. So, to me, it is better to be born, then it is to have never been born.
To become aware is awareness aware of itself as being born. . in reality /awareness is unborn. The born is an idea within the mind that separates the unborn into space and time - the unborn becomes ( un born ) separated by space and time, aka the world of knowledge aka duality, where the mind splits reality into two, which is just a fictional idea born of conceptual knowledge aka stories, born of this same knowledge there are preferences arising of likes or dislikes even though it's all just a fictional story according to it's own taste, which is only ever one taste appearing as the many.
Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:50 amIf, however, we want to discuss thee True One and thee Real Self, then "your" question is just purely pointless. I was never born. I exist in the HERE and NOW, always.
The HERE and NOW is a pointless place where stupid questions DO arise apparently pointing to everywhere but to itself.
The here and now can never ask questions about itself because it doesn't have one.
No one becomes aware. But the belief that it does is in for a big shock, and more than likely would want to crawl back to it's unborn state in disgust shouting can this born awareness please leave this unborn awareness alone with their peace already.

To proclaim it is better to become aware, then to have never been aware is a fiction, awareness never becomes aware, nor do humans, the idea there is an aware human is just a fictional story born of knowledge which only informs the illusory nature of it's self serving reality to be a self defeating reality, in that awareness is not human nor is it any other concept. Although fictional concepts DO appear to be real, and that is why the idea of being born feels real too, but no mind in it's right mind would want this born feeling, not unless it really liked or loved what this conception of itself informed itself, then it's each to their own, it's their fantasy.



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Age
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pm
Age wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:05 pm
Being born HAS happened.
So, to question what one would think is better if they were not born, is just nonsensical. 'Idiotic' some might say.
Knowledge informs the human is it born. So now you are informed you are born, then you now have the knowledge not to impose a birth upon someone else.
Why would any one want to not want to give birth upon "someone else"?

I can very easily see why some one would not want to bring "someone else" into this "world", which exists when this is written. But this "world" can very quickly be turned around and changed for the better, so that there would be NO reason at all to give birth to "someone else".
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pmThe only reason you know being born is happening is because you are knowledgeable about that happening. And you also know a someone else can be born as well. So the question of whether it's better to have never been born is pretty valid in my logic, because if you know you can be born then you can also know that it's better to have never been born, especially if being born has been a very unpleasant experience.
Are you talking about the actual experience of birth itself as being a very unpleasant experience of the experience of just existing as being a very unpleasant experience?

My whole childhood, except for a dozen or so very short fleeting moments, was an extremely unpleasant experience. But I would not swap that for any thing in the Universe. The knowledge that I gained from those experiences is worth absolutely EVERY thing. So, I would never now say it is better to have never been born. In fact, I said and still say; 'Being born IS better than to never have been born'.

If you believe that it is better to have never been born, then why do you not kill yourself?

What are you waiting and hoping for exactly?
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pm Now because you have the knowledge that being born is possible, then it must also be true that you can have the knowledge of it being better never to have been born as well.
Just because a 'you' has the knowledge that being born is possible, then HOW do 'you' now jump to the conclusion; 'That 'it must also be true that you can have the knowledge of it being better never to have been born as well'.

I arrive at the exact opposite conclusion from the knowledge that being born is possible. I have explained HOW and WHY I arrived at my conclusion. So, HOW and WHY do 'you' arrive at the exact opposite conclusion?
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pmSo now that you know that a persons birth can be unpredictable in the sense it can be born with hideous disadvantages, disabilities that may subject it to a life time of suffering, which are numerous in the way they are delivered to that person..etc etc.., and that suffering and pain, mental and emotional torment and abuse, is an unbearable, horrible, unpleasant and an unavoidable part of living, why would any one with such knowledge continue to want that?
Because of what can become KNOWN and experienced.

Why did you bring more babies into Life, if this is how you really see things?

Also, no child is born with "hideous disadvantages, disabilities that may subject them to a life time of suffering". Adult human beings, however, SEE "hideous disadvantages and disabilities, which are NOT there, and the adults are the ones who cause "others" to suffer.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pm the chances are the next person born will be knowledgable of such experiences as well, so why would an informed person want to pass that knowledge on to someone else when they know damn well the consequences of their own actions in their desire for sex is going to re-create more of that suffering on someone else?
Only the one's missing some thing desire sex. Only the uninformed make babies in their desire for sex only.

The Truly informed choose when to have babies, and then have sex accordingly.

The uninformed hope that will make a better and suffering free life their off-spring.

The informed KNOW how to make Life better, for EVERY one, including ALL new comers into Life.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:12 pmThat's the deep question I'm trying to get to here. That's basically what humans are doing all the time when they have sex, they are feeding their addiction to living.

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Does not EVERY species feed its addiction to living by procreating?

Is there not a thing with EVERY thing wanting to live, and keep surviving?

If human beings choose to use sex, and become addicted to that, to replace that they are some thing, then just add sex onto the growing long list of things human beings use, and become addicted to, to replace what they do not have and feel is missing.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:22 pm Being dead forever means being free from suffering forever and so that is one advantage over being alive
But 'who' is suffering being alive? And why are 'they' suffering?
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:22 pmOnce you are born you will experience suffering in some way and it may want you to wish you were dead
Did you mean this exactly how you wrote it?

If yes, then how could it even be possible and why would 'it' [suffering] want 'you' to wish 'you' were dead?

I KNOW of human beings who like to cause suffering to "others" and want those "others" to wish that they were dead. But suffering does not cause any thing. Suffering is just the result of some thing else, which is usually only caused by human beings by the way.
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:22 pmDeath is usually regarded as something negative even though it is unavoidable but I see the good it brings
But death is not unavoidable. Even you state; 'Existence is eternal', correct?

The so called "death" of some thing is just the so called "birth" of some thing "else", which some say is just an illusion as there really is only One thing evolving and changing and morphing into its Real and True Self. In other words, thee eternal Existence is just revealing Its True Self, through ALL of the comings and goings of the illusion of different and separate actors playing (or dancing) on the stage that they call Life.
Age
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pm
surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:22 pm Being dead forever means being free from suffering forever and so that is one advantage over being alive
Once you are born you will experience suffering in some way and it may want you to wish you were dead
Death is usually regarded as something negative even though it is unavoidable but I see the good it brings
I can see some point in that statement, but it still doesn't eradicate the problem of suffering.
Correct me if I have you wrong, 'you see a point to death, but no point to life?
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pmLook at it like this man...the character that is surreptitious57 by name, is in all actuality just this apparent sensation of being alive right? So who is to say that this sensation of being alive won't happen again and again and again..I mean if you are here now, then what's not to say you can't be here again just in some other body with a different name...
Because the 'you' is an individual as each body is.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pmyou see, when you look at it from that perspective, death just seems like a little sleep, the kind you get in the waking dream of life, the one you wake up from each morning. What if what you think is death, is just you having a sleep until you wake up to find yourself in a new body.
'you' can not be the same 'you'. It is because of what each body experiences WHY 'you' are who and what 'you' are.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pm If you are here now being you, then surely, it could happen again for ever?
The 'I' is always HERE NOW SEEING things through each and EVERY one of 'you'. So, that is why 'you', human beings, have these kinds of wonderings and questions, which are being proposed here now.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pmHow can you possibly know that you can be dead forever?
'you' can not.

'you' would have to KNOW who and what the 'you' is first.

After that is discovered, then the Answer IS KNOWN.
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:44 pmThat's how I see it anyway.

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That is one way of seeing things, and at the moment of when this is written, there is about seven billion "other" ways of seeing things.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Nick_A »

DaM
Life is a sick, murderous game. The universe is an incredibly sinister place, it's own laws of chemistry allowing the creation of these sentient, sensitive beings primed to suffer immensely on a moments notice. All for a pointless non-conscious process of getting this information into the next generation. There would be no inherent badness to life if consciousness wasn't possible. Technology and knowledge has enslaved the human even more, not made it easier or freer. The truth that we can never explain our conscious sentient feelings even though it is a fact of the universe that consciousness exists even if we cannot explain it, and that's what scares and exhilarates human being both at the same time, it's the realisation they known nothing of their sentient feeling being except what THEY themselves have MADE UP...in their desperate longing to belong to what is only a cold dark lonely pointless place, made to seem loving. They cannot accept that non-existence is always preferable to existence, that somehow even although suffering abounds the fact that it is possible to be alive makes it all worth it, it's all nonsense.

How can nature be good..Nature itself is the corruptor of all corruption and destruction. Even if humans went extinct the torture won't end, every predator dies horribly from starvation or disease, every prey animal dies horribly even if not caught and eaten, torn to shreds by teeth and Freddy Krueger type talons.
Plato called the Source of existence the Good. You see its results as evil. But suppose what you call evil is a universal necessity? Perfection is only the attribute of God. Whatever is created must be imperfect by definition since God doesn’t create itself. Is it better to emotionally condemn a universal necessity or to understand it so as to serve this necessity we are a part of? The problem becomes how to surrender the joys of suffering long enough to begin to understand? You prefer to condemn it as non existent. Simone Weil describes our situation.

“The sea is not less beautiful to our eye because we know that sometimes ships sink in it. On the contrary, it is more beautiful still. If the sea modified the movement of its waves to spare a boat, it would be a being possessing discernment and choice, and not this fluid that is perfectly obedient to all external pressures. It is this perfect obedience that is its beauty.”

“All the horrors that are produced in this world are like the folds imprinted on the waves by gravity. This is why they contain beauty. Sometimes a poem, like the Iliad, renders this beauty.”

“Man can never escape obedience to God. A creature cannot not obey. The only choice offered to man as an intelligent and free creature, is to desire obedience or not to desire it. If he does not desire it, he perpetually obeys nevertheless, as a thing subject to mechanical necessity. If he does desire obedience, he remains subject to mechanical necessity, but a new necessity is added on, a necessity constituted by the laws that are proper to supernatural things. Certain actions become impossible for him, while others happen through him, sometimes despite him.”
Excerpt from: Thoughts without order concerning the love of God, in an essay entitled L'amour de Dieu et le malheur (The Love of God and affliction). Simone Weil
The question isn’t if it is better to have been born since it isn’t our choice. We are here and live as a mechanical necessity. Serving the necessity is good. Can we become consciously able to do more than just serve as a mechanical animal necessity or can our being profit from consciously witnessing suffering for what it is rather than continually reacting to it and turning in circles as a mechanical necessity?
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:35 pm
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:25 pm
Even though the meaning and purpose of our universe including life within it has been explained numerous times at least theoretically, denial is such a strong motivation that many remain closed to conscious contemplation of the reality of the human condition.
So what is this theoretically explained meaning and purpose to this universe? so what's the actual plan of human existence?
Be honest, you don't want to know. Living with self justification made possible through denial is far more satisfying. It took me a while to admit this since it seems unnatural but unfortunately it is true. It is acquired human nature. Why not just admit that denial is far more attractive? That way we can avoid all the negativity that comes from efforts to understand and bask in denial.
The trouble with 'denial' IS, as you probably already KNOW, we Don't Even kNow 'I' AM Lying when we are in DENIAL.

It is like 'trying to' explain that God does exist to those who deny God exists OR 'trying to' explain that God does not exist to those who deny God does not exist. No matter how much actual prove and evidence is put before a person in DENIAL, they are totally incapable of seeing and/or hearing it.

If some one chooses to BELIEVE or DENY some thing, then, to them, that is the absolute Truth, which could not be refuted in any way, shape, nor form.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Nick_A »

Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:30 pm
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:35 pm
So what is this theoretically explained meaning and purpose to this universe? so what's the actual plan of human existence?
Be honest, you don't want to know. Living with self justification made possible through denial is far more satisfying. It took me a while to admit this since it seems unnatural but unfortunately it is true. It is acquired human nature. Why not just admit that denial is far more attractive? That way we can avoid all the negativity that comes from efforts to understand and bask in denial.
The trouble with 'denial' IS, as you probably already KNOW, we Don't Even kNow 'I' AM Lying when we are in DENIAL.

It is like 'trying to' explain that God does exist to those who deny God exists OR 'trying to' explain that God does not exist to those who deny God does not exist. No matter how much actual prove and evidence is put before a person in DENIAL, they are totally incapable of seeing and/or hearing it.

If some one chooses to BELIEVE or DENY some thing, then, to them, that is the absolute Truth, which could not be refuted in any way, shape, nor form.
Do we have any other options than choosing between blind belief or blind denial that seems to govern the world as we know it?
Age
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:32 pm
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm
Be honest, you don't want to know.
Know what? what do you know that you think I don't want to know?
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm Living with self justification made possible through denial is far more satisfying.
Denial of what?

Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm It took me a while to admit this since it seems unnatural but unfortunately it is true.
Admit what, and what seems unnatural but true. I really don't know what you are talking about Nick.
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pmIt is acquired human nature. Why not just admit that denial is far more attractive? That way we can avoid all the negativity that comes from efforts to understand and bask in denial.
Denial of what exactly? I'm really not getting a handle on what you are trying to tell me.

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I think "nick_a" is saying, and correct me if I am wrong "nick_a", that 'you', "dontaskme" is in denial that there is meaning and purpose to the Universe.

Although I would not put it as strongly as that, I would say; that 'you', "dontaskme' is in denial that there may well be or could be an actual meaning and/or purpose to the Universe. And correct me if I am wrong also "dontaskme".
Age
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

surreptitious57 wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 6:48 pm
Dontaskme wrote:
I mean if you are here now then what is not to say you cannot be here again just in some other body with a different name
There is no evidence for reincarnation but even if there was I would not want to come back in any form at all
When I die I want to stay dead forever never having to experience a single second of consciousness ever again
And especially if I had zero choice about the body and mind that I would be trapped inside of for all of its life
I am just curious as to why if any one feels and thinks this way that they continue to stay alive?

If 'you' NEVER want to experience consciousness again, then WHY stay experiencing consciousness now?

What is 'it' that is keeping 'you' here, now?
Age
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Nick_A wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:34 pm
Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:30 pm
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm

Be honest, you don't want to know. Living with self justification made possible through denial is far more satisfying. It took me a while to admit this since it seems unnatural but unfortunately it is true. It is acquired human nature. Why not just admit that denial is far more attractive? That way we can avoid all the negativity that comes from efforts to understand and bask in denial.
The trouble with 'denial' IS, as you probably already KNOW, we Don't Even kNow 'I' AM Lying when we are in DENIAL.

It is like 'trying to' explain that God does exist to those who deny God exists OR 'trying to' explain that God does not exist to those who deny God does not exist. No matter how much actual prove and evidence is put before a person in DENIAL, they are totally incapable of seeing and/or hearing it.

If some one chooses to BELIEVE or DENY some thing, then, to them, that is the absolute Truth, which could not be refuted in any way, shape, nor form.
Do we have any other options than choosing between blind belief or blind denial that seems to govern the world as we know it?
Yes. Just remain OPEN like a Truly curious, inquisitive, and wondering child does. Just like we ALL were and did when we were born and young.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Nick_A »

Age
Yes. Just remain OPEN like a Truly curious, inquisitive, and wondering child does. Just like we ALL were and did when we were born and young.
You've raised very large question. Why do we lose the ability and incentive to remain open rather than descend into blind belief or denial? When a person begins to realize what they lose by falling victim to this descent, what can they do if anything to recover what their psyche has lost?
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Nick_A »

Age wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:35 pm
Dontaskme wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:32 pm
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm
Be honest, you don't want to know.
Know what? what do you know that you think I don't want to know?
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm Living with self justification made possible through denial is far more satisfying.
Denial of what?

Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pm It took me a while to admit this since it seems unnatural but unfortunately it is true.
Admit what, and what seems unnatural but true. I really don't know what you are talking about Nick.
Nick_A wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:11 pmIt is acquired human nature. Why not just admit that denial is far more attractive? That way we can avoid all the negativity that comes from efforts to understand and bask in denial.
Denial of what exactly? I'm really not getting a handle on what you are trying to tell me.

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I think "nick_a" is saying, and correct me if I am wrong "nick_a", that 'you', "dontaskme" is in denial that there is meaning and purpose to the Universe.

Although I would not put it as strongly as that, I would say; that 'you', "dontaskme' is in denial that there may well be or could be an actual meaning and/or purpose to the Universe. And correct me if I am wrong also "dontaskme".
I agree. It is logical to ask if life is worth living if there is no universal purpose to it.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Lacewing »

Nick_A wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:49 pm I agree. It is logical to ask if life is worth living if there is no universal purpose to it.
Does a child ask if life is worth living if there is no universal purpose? Or... does a child stay open (as Age said) and full of wonderment at what is?

Without the influence of adults, would a child see a god in a church? Or might a child see and discover a fascinating connectedness naturally throughout all things, without anyone telling them about it?

Are children just foolish in their natural state, or have adults generally become intoxicated and controlling?

I remember watching my parents on the stage of life, before I learned how to get on the stage myself. I also remember how I felt when my mom first started taking me to church -- the people and all of it seemed crazy. I think concepts of god and universal purpose and meaning and worth are part of the stage.

So actually I think we're asking: Is life worth living on the stage if there is no universal purpose to it. Well, that all depends on what YOU DO ON THE STAGE and what STORIES YOU TELL YOURSELF about universal purpose. It's all made up... and it seems pointless and unfortunate to drive oneself mad with it. Remember the open and free qualities of a child within a vast world that they are part of. Compare that to the way adults often define the world and themselves to death -- removing all joy and acceptance.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by Age »

Nick_A wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:43 pm Age
Yes. Just remain OPEN like a Truly curious, inquisitive, and wondering child does. Just like we ALL were and did when we were born and young.
You've raised very large question. Why do we lose the ability and incentive to remain open rather than descend into blind belief or denial?
There is an innate drive within us to BELIEVE. This drive is to believe in one's Self and Its capabilities, but from as early as christ's time we are taught to believe in "other" things.

Through an education system we are also taught to take sides of a particular issue (debating) and fight for it as though we believe it is 100% absolutely True, Right, and Correct.

We are also even told; "You MUST believe in some thing", which can to easily translate to believe in some thing else other than your own Self.

There is One need for BELIEF, and that is in 'your' True Self and Its abilities. All other BELIEFS are totally unnecessary and in fact do far more harm than they do any good.

We have gotten to a stage where we BELIEVE that we MUST believe things, but we have lost what it is that would be best believed IN, and have turned to believing THINGS instead.

There would be other ways we lose the ability and incentive to remain open, but I just can not think of them at this very instant.
Nick_A wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:43 pmWhen a person begins to realize what they lose by falling victim to this descent, what can they do if anything to recover what their psyche has lost?
One word - Honesty.

That is; Absolute full Honesty. This is what brings full OPENNESS back.

Absolute full Honesty is NOT the "honesty" that we are taught, like; "It is okay to tell white lies" honesty, "I do not want to hurt their feelings" honesty, and "There are some things we are not meant to know or will never know" honesty, as well as there are those times as children when we hear our parents and other adults tell countless lies, which inevitably teaches us that it is okay to not be absolutely and fully Honest all of the time, which is WHY ALL adults now are "continually" being dishonest, are in DENIAL of this fact, and even 'try to' "justify" or minimize their dishonest words and behaviors, without even knowing that they are doing this.

Absolute Full Honesty starts by admitting (or just being Truly Honest) about the wrong we each and ALL do.

Overcoming this "hurdle" is the hardest of all. This is because of all of the prejudice thinking, judging, punishing, and ridiculing that continually goes on from "others", IF and when we are Honest with them. This "battle" even goes on within our self, as we do not like to even be Truly Honest with our own selves, so we can fall into this descent even further, and are thus trapped in being in complete DENIAL of things.

And as the old saying goes; 'No one can help you if you do not want to help your own self', and, "Before you can help "others" you need to help yourself first". But, no one can really help them self if they do not believe that they have a problem. If a person is in DENIAL that they have a problem, then really, to them, there is nothing to fix. The Truth, however, IS if a person does not have any problems, then they would be perfect, and how many people are there REALLY, who are perfect?

IF the answer is none, then that MEANS we ALL have problems that we NEED to fix.

Oh, I just remembered another and sure way we lose the ability and incentive to remain open is because we are NOT being Honest. As children we quickly learn NOT to be FULLY Honest when we are misjudged, ridiculed, and/or punished when we are trying to be FULLY Honest.

We can only be FULLY OPEN when we are being Truly and FULLY Honest, so If and when we are NOT being Truly and Fully Honest always, then we are NOT remaining Truly and FULLY OPEN always as well.
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Re: DAM asked: "Is being born worth it - or is it better to have never been born?"

Post by bahman »

Dontaskme wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:20 am
bahman wrote: Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:28 pm Spiritual reality to me is other dimensions of reality which we don't have access to it right now. There are other creatures, concepts, things there. To me, the most fruitful thing is finding the meaning.
Pure dreamscape dreamt up by nothing.
Well, we live because we want to live. The other side is death. We are all free to end our lives if the meaning is not worth waiting.
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