Is proper spelling important?

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commonsense
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by commonsense » Sat Mar 23, 2019 1:18 pm

gaffo wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:14 am
Ghost wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:59 am
My greatest friend spells words phonetically. I realized if I had discarded him as easily as I have others online who can't spell properly I would have missed out on my best friend. I used to see other's spelling mistakes as their lack of intelligence just as I see 'text speak' as laziness/stupidity. Other people may see my own poor grammar or sentence structure as the same.
I have become more forgiving over many years now. I recognize that languages will change as words fall into history and new words are created or change definition. Some people will have dyslexia, some will only be able to spell words phonetically, etc. How important is proper spelling anyways?
There is a quote that is often attributed to both Mark Twain and Thomas Jefferson that is about lacking imagination if only spelling a word one way.
I have Dyslexia - mild thankfully, i loathe English because though it claims to be phonetic, it really is not.

it could! be - and i made a "System" years ago to make it phonetic, but being a no-body, its just a mental fantasy (wish) on my part. If Englsih were re-writen in my "System" English would be truly phonetic. my self made mental fantasy rules for English is quite simple.

1. no silent letters - remove all of them in words that have them.
2. remove the letter "K", it was imported by the Romans from the Greeks and is a foreign letter- identical to "C" in all ways - so remove it, all words with "k" in them shall be respelled with the letter "C"
3. no double consonents! - and so no silly rules about long sounding/short sounding prior vowel letters (the whole "vowel phonetics depends upon a LATTER letter/double letter is dumb! - it breaks "real time phonetics" - one has to see the latter letters in the word in real time in reading the damn word!
4. limit the less used letters to their sole sound - so "Y" only in words with "yu" - not in words where it is used instead of "i" (each letter should have it own sound, so all uses of "y" in cases of words where it is used instead of "i" should be respelled with "i" (etc for all letters! - no duplication allowed).
5. short form phonetics of vowels should be ONE vowel letter, long form should always be Double Vowels! (thus removing the double consonate bullshit, silent letter "e" at end of word bullcrap too.

those five rules fix all spellings.
.................
in will rewrite the above in proper phonetic English now.

I hav dislexea - mild thancfule, i louth English becus tho it claams to be funetic, it reely is not.

it cud be - and i maad a "sistem" yeers ago to maac it fonetic, but beeing a no-bodi, its just a mental fantasi (wish) on mi part. if English wur ree-ritin in my "sistem" English wud be truuli fonetic. my self maad mental fantasi ruuls for English is quiit simpl.

1. no silent letrs - reemoov al of them in words that hav them.
2. reemoov the letr "K", it wus imported bii the Romans from the Greecs and is a foren letr - indentical to "c" in al wais - so remoov it, al words with "K" in them shal bee respeled with the letr "C"
3. no dubl consunats! - and so no sili ruuls about long sounding/short sounding prior voul letrs (the hool "voul fonetics depends upon a LATR letr/dubl letr is dum! - it braacs "reel tiim fonetics" - won has to see the latr letrs in the words in reel tiim in reeding the dam word!
4. limit the les usd letrs to thair sol sound - so "Y" onli in words with "yu' - not in words whar it is usd insted of "i" (eech letr shud hav it oun sound, so al uses of "Y" in cases of words whar it is usd insted of "I" shud be respeled with "i' (ect for al letrs!) - no duplicashum aloud!
5.short form fonetics of vouls shud be WUN voul letr, long form shud alwais be Dubl Vouls! (thus remooving the dubl consonat boolshit, silent letr "e" at end of word boolcrap too.

.................

simple example of rule 5:

Kite............Ciit
Kit............Cit
Cat.............Cat

Kate...........Caat

Like...............Liic

Lick...........Lic

Sick............Sic

Bite............Biit

Blight..............Bliit

Sight..............Siit

Hate..............Haat

Hat..........Hat

Fake...........Faac

Fat............Fat

etc..........
Cuul!

TheSageOfMainStreet
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I'd Rather Be Called a "Grammar Nazi" Than Not See Grammar

Post by TheSageOfMainStreet » Fri May 03, 2019 9:42 pm

commonsense wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm
Spelling and grammar checks, voice recognition and auto correct solve many problems. Abbreviations and texting languages can be found in online dictionaries.

In view of these tools, and because there are so many other subjects vying for the students’ attention, it is no longer feasible to teach spelling and grammar.
All excuses for lazy ignorance prove that our educational system intentionally dumbs us down. The teachers' negligence about spelling has ulterior motives. to prepare us for irrational rulers and their laws, including what is expected to be obeyed in the private sector. I still remember being told about grammar, "Just listen to the way educated people speak and you can learn it that way."

First, learning passively is not effective. Second, college graduates get by with temporary knowledge from cramming for exams; their grammar is at a 6th Grade level. Third, an English major is actually a Literature major.

commonsense
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Re: I'd Rather Be Called a "Grammar Nazi" Than Not See Grammar

Post by commonsense » Wed May 22, 2019 8:47 pm

TheSageOfMainStreet wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 9:42 pm
commonsense wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm
Spelling and grammar checks, voice recognition and auto correct solve many problems. Abbreviations and texting languages can be found in online dictionaries.

In view of these tools, and because there are so many other subjects vying for the students’ attention, it is no longer feasible to teach spelling and grammar.
All excuses for lazy ignorance prove that our educational system intentionally dumbs us down. The teachers' negligence about spelling has ulterior motives. to prepare us for irrational rulers and their laws, including what is expected to be obeyed in the private sector. I still remember being told about grammar, "Just listen to the way educated people speak and you can learn it that way."

First, learning passively is not effective. Second, college graduates get by with temporary knowledge from cramming for exams; their grammar is at a 6th Grade level. Third, an English major is actually a Literature major.
In my post above, I excused poor language skills based on the premise that there are just too many important things to learn in the allotted time. I also proposed that technology can be of some value in correcting grammar & spelling errors. I stand by these observations.

However, and very importantly, I, deeply and despairingly, mourn the passing of American English from the lips and fingertips of so many today.

Worse than the death of educated communication, I foresee ours as a language that will decay over time as misspellings eventually come to be acceptable usage of the English language.

I blame it all, rightfully or wrongly,—this cultural degradation—on the dumbing down of America. Of course, I cannot endorse a complete return to days of yore, but sadly, in many instances we’ve thrown out the baby with the bath water.

BTW, I was an English major who thrived on grammar and etymology while tolerating English lit.

gaffo
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Re: I'd Rather Be Called a "Grammar Nazi" Than Not See Grammar

Post by gaffo » Wed May 22, 2019 11:43 pm

commonsense wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 8:47 pm
TheSageOfMainStreet wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 9:42 pm
commonsense wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm
Spelling and grammar checks, voice recognition and auto correct solve many problems. Abbreviations and texting languages can be found in online dictionaries.

In view of these tools, and because there are so many other subjects vying for the students’ attention, it is no longer feasible to teach spelling and grammar.
All excuses for lazy ignorance prove that our educational system intentionally dumbs us down. The teachers' negligence about spelling has ulterior motives. to prepare us for irrational rulers and their laws, including what is expected to be obeyed in the private sector. I still remember being told about grammar, "Just listen to the way educated people speak and you can learn it that way."

First, learning passively is not effective. Second, college graduates get by with temporary knowledge from cramming for exams; their grammar is at a 6th Grade level. Third, an English major is actually a Literature major.
In my post above, I excused poor language skills based on the premise that there are just too many important things to learn in the allotted time. I also proposed that technology can be of some value in correcting grammar & spelling errors. I stand by these observations.

However, and very importantly, I, deeply and despairingly, mourn the passing of American English from the lips and fingertips of so many today.

Worse than the death of educated communication, I foresee ours as a language that will decay over time as misspellings eventually come to be acceptable usage of the English language.

I blame it all, rightfully or wrongly,—this cultural degradation—on the dumbing down of America. Of course, I cannot endorse a complete return to days of yore, but sadly, in many instances we’ve thrown out the baby with the bath water.
BTW, I was an English major who thrived on grammar and etymology while tolerating English lit.
English is the universal language - thank god for that - it units (globally) folks in lands where at least some speak it as a second language.

so Ya English!

only wish it were -reformed - into my concept of logical phonetics - and so allow faster and better adoption for all the folks out there.

i'm nobody. so will not happen - but still think my concept of "proper" english is the correct form of it.

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doolhoofd
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by doolhoofd » Thu May 30, 2019 10:07 pm

What's the difference between a cat and a comma? One has claws at the end of its paws, the other's a pause at the end of a clause.
Grammar: the difference between knowing your shit, and knowing you're shit.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Thu May 30, 2019 11:34 pm

Obviously not to Americans.

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Re: I'd Rather Be Called a "Grammar Nazi" Than Not See Grammar

Post by -1- » Fri May 31, 2019 9:38 pm

TheSageOfMainStreet wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 9:42 pm
commonsense wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm
Spelling and grammar checks, voice recognition and auto correct solve many problems. Abbreviations and texting languages can be found in online dictionaries.

In view of these tools, and because there are so many other subjects vying for the students’ attention, it is no longer feasible to teach spelling and grammar.
All excuses for lazy ignorance prove that our educational system intentionally dumbs us down. The teachers' negligence about spelling has ulterior motives. to prepare us for irrational rulers and their laws, including what is expected to be obeyed in the private sector. I still remember being told about grammar, "Just listen to the way educated people speak and you can learn it that way."

First, learning passively is not effective. Second, college graduates get by with temporary knowledge from cramming for exams; their grammar is at a 6th Grade level. Third, an English major is actually a Literature major.
And silly me, I thought that an English major was in rank above a left tenant, and below a general.

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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by -1- » Fri May 31, 2019 9:42 pm

Impenitent wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:05 pm
the majority of language users on the planet use language other than English...

speeling isn't as important as the transfer (sharing) of meaning ...

then again, it depends on the audience

-Imp
Precision of meaning relies on the precision of the language. Both in syntax and choosing the right words for the right meaning.

A grocer can get away with using a grocer's comma, but a philosopher can only stay ambiguous or else nonsensical or else misunderstood, if she does not use proper grammar.

My good friend Gaffo is an exception to this rule, with his extreme dislexia.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: I'd Rather Be Called a "Grammar Nazi" Than Not See Grammar

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Fri May 31, 2019 11:12 pm

-1- wrote:
Fri May 31, 2019 9:38 pm
TheSageOfMainStreet wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 9:42 pm
commonsense wrote:
Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:54 pm
Spelling and grammar checks, voice recognition and auto correct solve many problems. Abbreviations and texting languages can be found in online dictionaries.

In view of these tools, and because there are so many other subjects vying for the students’ attention, it is no longer feasible to teach spelling and grammar.
All excuses for lazy ignorance prove that our educational system intentionally dumbs us down. The teachers' negligence about spelling has ulterior motives. to prepare us for irrational rulers and their laws, including what is expected to be obeyed in the private sector. I still remember being told about grammar, "Just listen to the way educated people speak and you can learn it that way."

First, learning passively is not effective. Second, college graduates get by with temporary knowledge from cramming for exams; their grammar is at a 6th Grade level. Third, an English major is actually a Literature major.
And silly me, I thought that an English major was in rank above a left tenant, and below a general.
'Left tenant'?

commonsense
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by commonsense » Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:33 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:34 pm
Obviously not to Americans.
This American recognizes a sentence fragment when he sees one.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:37 am

commonsense wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:33 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:34 pm
Obviously not to Americans.
This American recognizes a sentence fragment when he sees one.
This non-American recognises informal, semi-spoken English rather than formal English.

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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by -1- » Sat Jun 01, 2019 3:54 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:37 am
commonsense wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:33 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:34 pm
Obviously not to Americans.
This American recognizes a sentence fragment when he sees one.
This non-American recognises informal, semi-spoken English rather than formal English.
This Hungaro-Canadian recognizes semi-spoken, semi-written, semi-inarticulated, and almost entirely semi-gesticulated, szemi-language.

commonsense
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by commonsense » Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:24 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:37 am
commonsense wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:33 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:34 pm
Obviously not to Americans.
This American recognizes a sentence fragment when he sees one.
This non-American recognises informal, semi-spoken English rather than formal English.
You are saying that, like the Americans you demean, grammar is unimportant to you when you semi-speak informal English.

Who are you, I ask, to admonish those who use informal English?

It seems to me that you might be one who feels superior to (all?) Americans, and who cannot stand missing an opportunity to disparage them under any circumstance.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:05 pm

commonsense wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:24 pm
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:37 am
commonsense wrote:
Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:33 am


This American recognizes a sentence fragment when he sees one.
This non-American recognises informal, semi-spoken English rather than formal English.
You are saying that, like the Americans you demean, grammar is unimportant to you when you semi-speak informal English.

Who are you, I ask, to admonish those who use informal English?

It seems to me that you might be one who feels superior to (all?) Americans, and who cannot stand missing an opportunity to disparage them under any circumstance.
Typically moronic yank post. Not worth answering when you clearly don't have a clue about the subtleties of language usage. Just look at your deliberate bad spelling, something yanks are even proud of. And if you knew anything about me you would know that I'm anything but a 'grammar nazi' on here. What I have a beef with is the deliberate American destruction of the English language--even Americans know this because they arrogantly refuse to call it 'English', calling it 'American English' or 'American'. Why would you care what I think anyway? Americans loathe the idea of being thought of as 'intellectual'. Calling them idiots is the greatest compliment you can pay them.

commonsense
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Re: Is proper spelling important?

Post by commonsense » Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:12 pm

Please accept my apology, vegetariantaxidermy, for engaging in an ad hominem exchange. It’s your right to believe as you do, and my responsibility to apply curiosity, not animosity, when reading your posts. I hope that others throughout the forum will refrain from this nonsense, as I hope to do so going forward.

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