GRAVITY

How does science work? And what's all this about quantum mechanics?

Moderators: AMod, iMod

gaffo
Posts: 2480
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:15 am

Re: GRAVITY

Post by gaffo » Sat Mar 23, 2019 4:50 am

Scott Mayers wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:56 pm
I like the topic, but can't determine what you are asserting or asking?

Note the discussion of gravity also began earlier with Aristotle and Galileo, if you are referencing 'thought' experiments. Another significant player is Zeno and his paradoxes if you want to understand how these thought processes were derived. And, of course, even the Socratic dialogue style (from Plato) contributed as well.
Aristotle? welcome more on him in this regard.

gaffo
Posts: 2480
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:15 am

Re: GRAVITY

Post by gaffo » Sat Mar 23, 2019 4:57 am

socrat44 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:05 am
  My conclusion:
1 - gravity is the weakest ''force'' in nature
is it weaker than "dark energy"?


socrat44 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:05 am
4 - gravity is only a local effect in the  universe
no, gravity has effect accross the universe, and why Andromeda will collide with the Milky Way in 3 billion years, the two galaxies are pulling toward each other due to gravity.

as all the galaxies are with each other.

gravity's effect is not limited by distance and its effect is equal to the speed of light, so i assume the parts of our universe that is no longer visible due to dark energy expansion - the event horizon of universe/light (and gravity) if those galaxies now moving away faster than speed of light WRT us not longer have gravitaional effect on us either.

socrat44 wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:05 am
5 -  the concept ''Gravity'' cannot be used to the universe as whole
(for example:
Gravity cannot gather all matter of universe into ''singular point'' for
''big-bang'' as ''modern philosophy of science''  teach us today)
========
???

gaffo
Posts: 2480
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:15 am

Re: GRAVITY

Post by gaffo » Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:03 am

socrat44 wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:23 pm
If everything was started from ''singularity'' then we need
to pay more attention on concept  ''singularity''.
#
''Singularity'' is not only ''a point''.
''Singularity'' is also ''a place''.
not a place when Space (nor Time) did not exist prior to the BB.

socrat44 wrote:
Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:23 pm
''A place'' where  the mass is enormous, the volume is zero,
the density is infinite, and the time is zero.

space is zero also.

gaffo
Posts: 2480
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:15 am

Re: GRAVITY

Post by gaffo » Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:05 am

Cerveny wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:30 pm
I am omitting flipping reply;) but to consider that Universe is discrete, suffice studying of so called “Ultraviolet catastrophe” or realize that for more intensive light we need not “stronger” photons but more photons...
maybe Neutrinos would work better?

User avatar
Cerveny
Posts: 575
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:35 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GRAVITY

Post by Cerveny » Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:01 am

gaffo wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:05 am
Cerveny wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:30 pm
I am omitting flipping reply;) but to consider that Universe is discrete, suffice studying of so called “Ultraviolet catastrophe” or realize that for more intensive light we need not “stronger” photons but more photons...
maybe Neutrinos would work better?
I think that neutrino is certain form of chirality in structure of Universe...

socrat44
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm

Re: GRAVITY

Post by socrat44 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:36 am

Cerveny wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:01 am
gaffo wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:05 am
Cerveny wrote:
Sun Mar 17, 2019 5:30 pm
I am omitting flipping reply;) but to consider that Universe is discrete, suffice studying of so called “Ultraviolet catastrophe” or realize that for more intensive light we need not “stronger” photons but more photons...
maybe Neutrinos would work better?
I think that neutrino is certain form of chirality in structure of Universe...
Neutrino is a ghostly particle that travels through the Earth without interacting
Neutrino.jpg
Neutrino.jpg (8.43 KiB) Viewed 567 times
===

socrat44
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm

Re: GRAVITY

Post by socrat44 » Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:53 pm

Gravity: Spinning Galaxies and Dark Matter
==
Measurements showed that the galaxies were spinning
faster than was predicted by how many stars they contemned.
In other words, the stars should be flying off the edges of the
galaxies -- the gravity law should not be working.
In order to explain the high rotation speed (and save the gravity law
in each galaxy) astronomers needed to add a huge amount of
''dark matter'' to each galaxy in their calculation so all the stars
held together.
Dark matter helps normal matter clump together.
Dark matter saves gravity law in each galaxy.
Without dark matter gravity law doesn't work in galaxy.
#
Question remains: what is dark matter made of ?
Short answer: we have no idea.
=====
Galaxy.jpg
Galaxy.jpg (6.99 KiB) Viewed 553 times

User avatar
Cerveny
Posts: 575
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:35 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GRAVITY

Post by Cerveny » Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:30 pm

socrat44 wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:53 pm
Gravity: Spinning Galaxies and Dark Matter
==
Measurements showed that the galaxies were spinning
faster than was predicted by how many stars they contemned.
In other words, the stars should be flying off the edges of the
galaxies -- the gravity law should not be working.
In order to explain the high rotation speed (and save the gravity law
in each galaxy) astronomers needed to add a huge amount of
''dark matter'' to each galaxy in their calculation so all the stars
held together.
Dark matter helps normal matter clump together.
Dark matter saves gravity law in each galaxy.
Without dark matter gravity law doesn't work in galaxy.
#
Question remains: what is dark matter made of ?
Short answer: we have no idea.
=====
Galaxy.jpg
Are you willing to admit, that there is no “dark matter”, but there is only wrong theory of gravity? Can not you see that space is pulled by gravity too? It is apparently a reason why space keeps together...

socrat44
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm

Re: GRAVITY

Post by socrat44 » Fri Mar 29, 2019 11:58 am

socrat44 wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:53 pm
Gravity: Spinning Galaxies and Dark Matter
==
Measurements showed that the galaxies were spinning
faster than was predicted by how many stars they contemned.
In other words, the stars should be flying off the edges of the
galaxies -- the gravity law should not be working.
In order to explain the high rotation speed (and save the gravity law
in each galaxy) astronomers needed to add a huge amount of
''dark matter'' to each galaxy in their calculation so all the stars
held together.
Dark matter helps normal matter clump together.
Dark matter saves gravity law in each galaxy.
Without dark matter gravity law doesn't work in galaxy.
#
Question remains: what is dark matter made of ?
Short answer: we have no idea.
=====
Galaxy.jpg
Dark matter is needed to add so all the stars held together.
Dark matter helps normal matter clump together.
Dark matter saves gravity law in each galaxy.
Without dark matter gravity law doesn't work in galaxy.
#
In other words, there are two kinds of gravity in each galaxy:
a) normal (Newton - Einstein ) matter gravity and
b) dark matter gravity.
Dark matter gravity supports to keep balance of matter in
each gravity system.
=====

User avatar
Cerveny
Posts: 575
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:35 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GRAVITY

Post by Cerveny » Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:39 am

socrat44 wrote:
Fri Mar 29, 2019 11:58 am
socrat44 wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:53 pm
Gravity: Spinning Galaxies and Dark Matter
==
...
Dark matter is needed to add so all the stars held together.
Dark matter helps normal matter clump together.
Dark matter saves gravity law in each galaxy.
Without dark matter gravity law doesn't work in galaxy.

In other words, there are two kinds of gravity in each galaxy:
a) normal (Newton - Einstein ) matter gravity and
b) dark matter gravity.
Dark matter gravity supports to keep balance of matter in
each gravity system.
=====
I understand, what leads you to a dark matter quite well, but Einstein’s/yours gravity lead us for eighty years only to the ...., because the space is not continuous, but it has a discrete structure...

socrat44
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm

Re: GRAVITY

Post by socrat44 » Sun Apr 07, 2019 3:38 pm

Gravity: Dark matter + Antimatter
=
1 - dark matter is 27% in universe
2 - normal matter is 5% in universe,
it means anti-matter must be also 5%.
So, dark-matter cannot be anti-matter
#
1 - dark matter has stuff and therefore
must feel gravity (takes part in gravity process)
But it doesn't reflect light or give off light
It means dark matter doesn't have electromagnetic
force (doesn't have electric charge)
2- we don't know what kind of particles it is made of
3 - anti-matter is made of anti-particles
Anti-particles have their own pure electric charge.
So, dark-matter cannot be anti-matter
#
1 - if dark matter doesn't have electric charge (neither normal,
nor anti-normal) then it is passive stuff
2 - the gravity-matter is the weakest force
(it is about 10^36 times weaker than the EM force)
3 - antimatter force is also 10^36 stronger than dark-matter
It means, anti-force has enough power to manipulate
with passive dark-matter to create black - gravity effect
#
To create ''normal-gravity'' is needed energy and matter
Antimatter is source of energy and dark-matter is source of mass
Their interaction can (with logW of probability) create black- gravity effect
With time black-gravity evolves into normal-gravity effect
===
Gravity.jpg
Gravity.jpg (11.94 KiB) Viewed 488 times

User avatar
Cerveny
Posts: 575
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:35 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GRAVITY

Post by Cerveny » Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:30 am

One of the most problematic moment of mainstream physics is supposing that antimatter has the same gravitational properties as matter has..

socrat44
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm

Re: GRAVITY

Post by socrat44 » Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:23 am

  Cosmology: two ideas

The  ''big bang'' idea explains how hot singularity
created billions hot stars when the rest of the universe
is extremely cold
Big bang says nothing about where did ordinary matter
come from (it says: chickens come from eggs and eggs
come  from chickens:  singularity <---------> big bang )

This idea contradict ''dark matter - antimatter'' idea
#
To save gravity as universal  law for galaxies the dark matter
was invented
Dark matter is extremely cold stuff
Dark matter is passive / neutral stuff (doesn't have electric charge)
This cold stuff is much more in universe than normal matter
Dark matter is seed of normal matter and of formation of stars.
#
To create gravity (stars) needs not only matter but also energy.
Quantum antiparticles ( antimatter) are cold stuff that carry itself
enormous pure energy (according to Dirac: -E=Mc^2)
Each antiparticle 10^36 times stronger than dark matter particle
(graviton) and therefore each antiparticle can manipulate with
huge stuff of dark matter
Antiparticles (through so called ''quantum fluctuations'' ) involve
dark matter in process which was ended by creation of all visual
stars, galaxies  . . . etc
/ my opinion /
======
Attachments
Big Questions.jpg
Big Questions.jpg (9.3 KiB) Viewed 456 times

User avatar
Cerveny
Posts: 575
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:35 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GRAVITY

Post by Cerveny » Fri Apr 12, 2019 12:06 am

Suppose that empty (physical) space/aether is the most compact, most densely configuration of the reality and elementary particles (matter) are some kind of dilution/porous of such physical space. In similar consideration the “black hole” should be as a real cavity/emptiness in the space. This is the way to avoid BH singularities. (We have to ommit antiparticles, in this respect, that should make the space even more thick)...

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests