WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

For all things philosophical.

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seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:10 pm

Ferdi wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 1:57 am
Yes melancocky “life” is the key. Any who found themselves indoctrinated to believe that some “god’ or whatever is the creator can hold such god responsible for good and evil, not us. Live and let live, run for cover when it rains.
melancocky wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:42 am
Hmmm well, if there is a grand designer and he gave us free will, then he is not responsible for good and evil in ACTION. We are. He is responsible only for creating the POTENTIAL for good and evil. What do you think of that?
I think that the “grand designer” accepts full responsibility for all of our evil appearing actions.

And that’s because in order for the Grand Design to actually work as a viable (soul creating) dimension of reality, the designer had to put a limit on our level of consciousness – a limit that allows us to somnambulistically accept our strange situation of riding (topsy-turvy) on a spinning ball of reality while flying through the ether of space.

Unfortunately, it is this necessary (designed) limit to our level of consciousness that causes us to act in ways that seem evil (hence the designer’s culpability).
_______
Last edited by seeds on Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:11 pm

Davyboi wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:50 am
I know this is a basic question! But why our we here, most people go through there lives not questioning the reason why? People like us have ideas, views an urge to understand what this is all about? Do you think we are ever going to find the answer?
We are here because here represents the physiological (nuts and bolts) conditions that made it possible for us to receive the gift of life.

If someone can imagine a better way of awakening completely new souls into existence...

(a way other than through the perfect setting and workings of these flying orbs)

...then describe it.
_______

melancocky
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by melancocky » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:21 am

seeds wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:11 pm
Davyboi wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:50 am
I know this is a basic question! But why our we here, most people go through there lives not questioning the reason why? People like us have ideas, views an urge to understand what this is all about? Do you think we are ever going to find the answer?
We are here because here represents the physiological (nuts and bolts) conditions that made it possible for us to receive the gift of life.

If someone can imagine a better way of awakening completely new souls into existence...

(a way other than through the perfect setting and workings of these flying orbs)

...then describe it.
_______
Are you saying that the evolution of the universe and life are self-evidently the work of a creator?

Dimebag
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Dimebag » Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:26 am

Your goal in life should be to find reasons to be alive, and if you live life well, you will find reasons to be alive. Not cosmic reasons, more personal and related to responsibility, burden, etc. Other reason can be related to what you are good at and what you enjoy, what you feel you were made to do. What allows you to enter into that way of being which is without time, where all that exists is the task at hand, and pure focus.

Logik
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Logik » Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:28 am

Dimebag wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:26 am
Your goal in life should be to find reasons to be alive
Some people spend so much time looking for reasons to be alive that they forget to live.

The purpose of life is to live it while making sure those who come after us share the same privilege.
Leave the world a little (or if opportunity and skill present themselves - a lot!) better than you found it...

Love and work, work and love. That's all there is to it.

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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by attofishpi » Wed Feb 20, 2019 3:37 pm

Logik wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:28 am
Dimebag wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:26 am
Your goal in life should be to find reasons to be alive
Some people spend so much time looking for reasons to be alive that they forget to live.

The purpose of life is to live it while making sure those who come after us share the same privilege.
Leave the world a little (or if opportunity and skill present themselves - a lot!) better than you found it...

Love and work, work and love. That's all there is to it.
Well said. If I am to believe my sage, and certainly I would be unwise to doubt him, we inherit what we thought we would leave behind - by way of reincarnating back upon this very Earth.
So it is not just a matter of ethics to leave it a better place.

seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:21 pm

seeds wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:11 pm
Davyboi wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:50 am
I know this is a basic question! But why our we here, most people go through there lives not questioning the reason why? People like us have ideas, views an urge to understand what this is all about? Do you think we are ever going to find the answer?
We are here because here represents the physiological (nuts and bolts) conditions that made it possible for us to receive the gift of life.

If someone can imagine a better way of awakening completely new souls into existence...

(a way other than through the perfect setting and workings of these flying orbs)

...then describe it.
melancocky wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:21 am
Are you saying that the evolution of the universe and life are self-evidently the work of a creator?
What I am saying (asking) is that if the doubters of intelligent design were asked to design a context of reality that was meant to awaken new souls into existence, then what would they do differently?

As one simple example of what I am getting at: would they, or would they not use flying spheres to do the job?

And if not the surface of spheres as a logical setting for the creation of sentient entities, then what other context could they use? Describe it.

What I am trying to point out is that if a higher form of living intelligence (a Creator/Designer) literally had an infinite amount of time to come up with a physiologically structured means for awakening our souls into existence, then I doubt if there could be anything better than these flying orbs.

And if anyone questions that assertion, then I challenge them to describe a plausible alternative.
_______

melancocky
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by melancocky » Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:45 pm

seeds wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:21 pm
seeds wrote:
Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:11 pm
Davyboi wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:50 am
I know this is a basic question! But why our we here, most people go through there lives not questioning the reason why? People like us have ideas, views an urge to understand what this is all about? Do you think we are ever going to find the answer?
We are here because here represents the physiological (nuts and bolts) conditions that made it possible for us to receive the gift of life.

If someone can imagine a better way of awakening completely new souls into existence...

(a way other than through the perfect setting and workings of these flying orbs)

...then describe it.
melancocky wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:21 am
Are you saying that the evolution of the universe and life are self-evidently the work of a creator?
What I am saying (asking) is that if the doubters of intelligent design were asked to design a context of reality that was meant to awaken new souls into existence, then what would they do differently?

As one simple example of what I am getting at: would they, or would they not use flying spheres to do the job?

And if not the surface of spheres as a logical setting for the creation of sentient entities, then what other context could they use? Describe it.

What I am trying to point out is that if a higher form of living intelligence (a Creator/Designer) literally had an infinite amount of time to come up with a physiologically structured means for awakening our souls into existence, then I doubt if there could be anything better than these flying orbs.

And if anyone questions that assertion, then I challenge them to describe a plausible alternative.
_______
I see your point now. I think about that a lot. I accept your challenge. I can easily imagine alternative realities for "souls" to inhabit, and I will describe them to you. But before I do, let me ask first: what do you find so special about these "flying orbs"?

seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:44 am

melancocky wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:45 pm
I see your point now. I think about that a lot. I accept your challenge. I can easily imagine alternative realities for "souls" to inhabit, and I will describe them to you.
Keep in mind that I’m not looking for descriptions of realities for souls to “inhabit” (but I wouldn’t mind hearing your ideas in that regard).

No, I am looking for descriptions of physiologically constructed realities that are capable of awakening new souls into existence - (please note the distinction).
melancocky wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:45 pm
But before I do, let me ask first: what do you find so special about these "flying orbs"?
They are special because most humans are completely oblivious of how strange they truly are.

As one example of what I mean, here we are, magnetically adhered to the surface of a sphere that spins gigantic oceans and vast human metropolises around and around - (upside-down) - in a never ending “rotisserie cycle” that only takes a mere 24 hours to complete.

Yet it all feels as if we are functioning on an utterly stable and horizontal plateau without the slightest sensation that it is all moving through space (both laterally and axially) at incredible speeds (never mind the unfathomable precision).

Now the fact that most humans (especially materialists) don’t find that to be strange and will try to explain it away with science, is testament of the issue I pointed out earlier regarding the (sleep-walking) level of consciousness that humans are designed to function at in order to make it all seem so natural to us.

But, again, feel free to offer your ideas on these matters.
_______

Ferdi
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Ferdi » Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:46 am

Why those hints about a designer? My mere human brain tells me that “if” there were a designer of our Universe, such designer’s capability would be beyond our imagination, beyond our ideas of time, purpose and quality.
If I had a swimming pool in my backyard, I would NOT just throw my child in it. Although I only have a mere human intelligence, I would know that drowning is to be expected. The point is: I and my backyard are of fallible design, I know it and act accordingly. If there were a designer of the Universe, such designer would inherently know everything, is responsible for whatever Universe.
Why assume to have a designer? The Universe exists! We know that rain-fall is not caused by a God pulling the plug. We find ourselves placed in whichever surroundings. We learn as we grow- up. We make our decisions, we run the show. It is up to us to help or hinder. We have a conscience, which may judge ourselves at the instant of death when time ceases to apply. We cannot know if any dimensions exist at all beyond death; why invent a god?
The answer for “Why we are here?” is anyone’s guess. My answer: universal chaos brought us here into its chain of events. We are in the universe from where ”Life” is inserted to start a fight for survival, under constant threat by a never ending stream of events. Experience (science) makes some events predictable but eventually all lives end, death makes us depart. The answer for “What is life/death?” is inherently beyond our intelligence because it is intangible. But we know that life deserves respect, we must live and let live, in peace and, help each other through the vagaries of Mother Nature.

Logik
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Logik » Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:57 am

seeds wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:21 pm
What I am saying (asking) is that if the doubters of intelligent design were asked to design a context of reality that was meant to awaken new souls into existence, then what would they do differently?
For starters?

Forget the flying orbs. I would definitely not integrate the reproductive with excretory organs!

But then again. Budget cuts and technical debt are par for the course for any engineering project...

seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:04 am

seeds wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:21 pm
What I am saying (asking) is that if the doubters of intelligent design were asked to design a context of reality that was meant to awaken new souls into existence, then what would they do differently?
Logik wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:57 am
For starters?

Forget the flying orbs.
And replace them with what?

In other words, describe a plausible alternative.
Logik wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:57 am
I would definitely not integrate the reproductive with excretory organs!
Ah, but orbs such as the earth are indeed excretory organs.

They excrete (effloresce) the essence of life from the fabric of their being – an efflorescence that coats their surfaces.
_______

Logik
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Logik » Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:11 am

seeds wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:04 am
seeds wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:21 pm
What I am saying (asking) is that if the doubters of intelligent design were asked to design a context of reality that was meant to awaken new souls into existence, then what would they do differently?
Logik wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:57 am
For starters?

Forget the flying orbs.
And replace them with what?

In other words, describe a plausible alternative.
Logik wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:57 am
I would definitely not integrate the reproductive with excretory organs!
Ah, but orbs such as the earth are indeed excretory organs.

They excrete (effloresce) the essence of life from the fabric of their being – an efflorescence that coats their surfaces.
_______
I don’t understand your criteria for plausibility?

In the hands of a creator plausibility is not a concern. Imagination is the only limit.

I could put a penis on your forehead. As far from your urethra as possible.

You want a flat Earth?
It disagrees with the laws of physics? Change the laws of physics!

You cave total creative freedom.

seeds
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by seeds » Fri Feb 22, 2019 12:32 am

Ferdi wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:46 am
Why those hints about a designer? My mere human brain tells me that “if” there were a designer of our Universe, such designer’s capability would be beyond our imagination, beyond our ideas of time, purpose and quality.
Right, the proposed designer’s capabilities are way beyond our ability to understand.

And I suggest that they are beyond us in precisely the same way that our own capabilities are beyond an amoeba’s ability to understand.

Yet, here we are - the designers and creators of cars, computers, skyscrapers, and space shuttles.

You just need to be open to the idea that the designer and creator of suns, planets, cells, and DNA could be as far above us in scope and consciousness as we are above the amoeba, as is represented in one of my fanciful illustrations:

Image

The illustration is my own personal rendition of what I call “The Ascending Ladder of Consciousness.”

And the point is that humans need to stop assuming that we are the occupiers of the top rung.
Ferdi wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:46 am
If I had a swimming pool in my backyard, I would NOT just throw my child in it. Although I only have a mere human intelligence, I would know that drowning is to be expected. The point is: I and my backyard are of fallible design, I know it and act accordingly. If there were a designer of the Universe, such designer would inherently know everything, is responsible for whatever Universe.
Right again, Ferdi.

However, if your momentary existence within the universe was, in fact, a necessary prelude to your awakening into eternal life in a higher context of reality...

(similar to how your momentary existence within the darkness of your mother’s womb was a necessary prelude to your earthly existence)

...would you still consider it (the universe) to be a fallible design?
Ferdi wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 3:46 am
Why assume to have a designer?
Because the alternative - (chance) - is just too ridiculous to hold as a plausible explanation.

To understand what I mean, read this post here - viewtopic.php?f=12&t=23943&start=45#p357784
_______

Ferdi
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Re: WHY DO YOU THINK WE ARE HERE? WHY DO WE EXIST?

Post by Ferdi » Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:44 am

Re seeds.
I glanced through the post you attached, thank you, but will comment on only one point: I grew into a completed baby’s body in my mother’s womb was an unborn baby, alive and kicking in the womb . . . . from that I note the crucial point: the growing foetus is driven by the life of the mother i.e. it does not have its own life; similar to my arm being alive now, but it does not have its own life. A new baby’s own life may or may not enter that body until after its birth. My heart is alive, driven by my life in me but the moment I die, .i.e. when my life departs, my body becomes a corpse, to be disposed of. However, medical observations discovered organ transplanting: while life has departed, the cells in the fresh corpse remain alive for a while and slowly change from their life “maintenance” phase into ”start the decomposition” phase. Thus fresh alive, but LIFE-less organs when transplanted and connected to LIFE in another body, can literally be brought back to life to serve in a foreign body.
Back to the concept of the universe. IMO we and all celestial matter just evolved from whatever, may be from to-us invisible, non particulate matter. Think of gravity i.e. it is there but we can’t see it, and LIFE, there one moment, gone the next, no idea where it went. I sense from everyone having a free-will and from being aware of a difference between good acts and bad acts, that there must be an ultimate measuring device, a “slate”, revealing at the instant of one’s death, one’s own ”good and bad” to judge oneself with UNIVERSAL wisdom. Our earthly concepts of reward and punishment would be irrelevant in the UNIVERSAL wisdom phase of infinity.

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