Indoctrination necessitates the telling of lies. Lies sow the seeds of evil.henry quirk wrote: ↑Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:57 pm One of the purposes of 'education' is to indoctrinate.
Indoctrination has no place in a civilised school.
Indoctrination necessitates the telling of lies. Lies sow the seeds of evil.henry quirk wrote: ↑Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:57 pm One of the purposes of 'education' is to indoctrinate.
Henry, you weren't indoctrinating you were training your kid. Later on I suppose the kid is adult now, you will be influencing him or her, but that is not indoctrinating, because he/she is able to think and decide for him or her self.henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:18 pm As a 'libertarian/minarchist/anarchist/free enterpriser/whatever it is I am', I began indoctrinating my kid early, hammering home that he is self-directing and -responsible. Initially, there was no explanation of the philosophical underpinnings: I just told him how he was to view himself, and others. I was very much indoctrinating him (and I still do).
Did/do I lie to him? Have I commited an evil?
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"Indoctrination has no place in a civilised school."
If a school (as many do today) indoctrinates students with Marxist dogma, then, yeah: you're right.
In the rare case of a school indoctrinating students with notions of self-reliance and -responsibility, then, no, you're wrong.
I may be mistaken but the fact that you come here to debate in a thoughtful manner makes me think that you like your son to think about what you teach . Indoctrinating teacher does not want the child to think about what he is being taught but to think what he is told to think. At the age of twelve a child has a developed moral capability to think for himself."Indoctrinating is forcing belief on to someone such as a child who is unable to resist the authority."
Yep. That's what I did and, occasionally, still do.
The results of progressive secular education is to implant forgetfulness in the souls of the young. God bless the parents of the young with the love and courage to provide the necessary alternatives for their offspring so they can gradually remember what it means to be human and become able to put factual knowledge into a human perspective.“If men learn this, it will implant forgetfulness in their souls; they will cease to exercise memory because they rely on that which is written, calling things to remembrance no longer from within themselves, but by means of external marks. What you have discovered is a recipe not for memory, but for reminder. And it is no true wisdom that you offer your disciples, but only its semblance, for by telling them of many things without teaching them you will make them seem to know much, while for the most part they know nothing, and as men filled, not with wisdom, but with the conceit of wisdom, they will be a burden to their fellows.”
― Plato, Phaedrus
of course not, the nuns used rulers...henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:30 pm
I attended Catholic elementary and high schools. No body beat me up with a dogma stick. ...
Teaching writing is training a skill and is not education as teaching interpretation, critical judgement, and moral maturity are education.henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:30 pm "Indoctrinating teacher does not want the child to think about what he is being taught but to think what he is told to think.
Sure. When the teacher is instructing the younglings in longhand, I'm pretty sure that teacher doesn't wanna go into the history of writing, or why we use cursive. that teacher just wants the younglings to 'learn'.
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"At the age of twelve a child has a developed moral capability to think for himself."
HA! At twelve is when a kid most desperately needs to be told what to think, by an adult.
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"In the case of religious education there is training the child to attend a church or mosque and recite prayers and hymns and so on. Indoctrination occurs not by practicing those religious rituals but by identifying with the doctrine to the exclusion of any possibility of doubt."
I attended Catholic elementary and high schools. No body beat me up with a dogma stick. Questions were encouraged.
Life and freedom are more dangerous than not going out. Are you averse to risk?Impenitent wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:10 pm teaching someone how to think is far more dangerous than teaching what to think...
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freedom? far too risky for the secular state to allow religious thought...Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:12 pmLife and freedom are more dangerous than not going out. Are you averse to risk?Impenitent wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:10 pm teaching someone how to think is far more dangerous than teaching what to think...
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Ah, then you are averse to risk.Impenitent wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:17 pmfreedom? far too risky for the secular state to allow religious thought...Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:12 pmLife and freedom are more dangerous than not going out. Are you averse to risk?Impenitent wrote: ↑Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:10 pm teaching someone how to think is far more dangerous than teaching what to think...
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