I had proven God is an impossibility to be real. As such the question of God is a non-starter.Nick_A wrote: ↑Fri Jan 04, 2019 12:52 am V A
We begin with different premises. You write that God doesn’t exist and I write that God IS. Isness is the eternal unchanging. All that serves the process of existence takes place within Isness.What is ultimate truth is the truth that all truths ultimately is co-dependent with the human condition.
There are no standalone truths, like there is a God that exists independently by itself and for most theists, God created the Universe which is a very problematic proposition.
You have not provided any proofs to justify God exists.
Note "is" or "existence" is never a predicate.
The proper presentation is Z[subject] is Y[predicate].
"is" is merely a copula, i.e. a connector.
Yet again you did not bother to research on what is an altered states of consciousness, in relation to spirituality.Again, you don’t seem to accept the difference between a direct conscious experience and an experience of an altered state of consciousness which is largely imagination. Regardless if you refer to spirituality, religion, mysticism, hallucinogens, or whatever, these experiences differ in objective quality. Any article failing to recognize this distinction will lack meaning.That is your problem.
You pick merely on one article as the full representation of the subject.
I suggest you focus more on altered states of consciousness in relation to spirituality, religion, mysticism, hallucinogens in the spiritual context and other related areas.
Your 'direct conscious experience' is nothing special. If I eat an apple, I have a direct conscious experience of its taste, solidness, smell, etc.
In a spiritual altered state of consciousness, the mystics with mysticism claimed to have a direct union with God which is different from the waking conscious state.
Simone's experiences of direct conscious attention via prayers are kindergarten stuff within mysticism.The attributes and means by which Christian mysticism is studied and practiced are varied. They range from ecstatic visions of the soul's mystical union with God to simple prayerful contemplation of Holy Scripture (i.e., Lectio Divina).
What Simone wrote about is kindergarten stuff within Christian Mysticism.Do you understand what she is describing and why absolute attention is prayer. Is any child taught this?
Simone Weil was not interested in escapism but rather in acquiring the understanding and conscious perspective only a few possess in order to become human. She didn’t want to teach; she wanted to learn. I learn from the quality of her search and experiences. She wrote:
………….. I did not mind having no visible successes, but what did grieve me was the idea of being excluded from that transcendent kingdom to which only the truly great have access and wherein truth abides. I preferred to die rather than live without that truth……………………Anyone with a sincere interest in the objective meaning and purpose of our universe and Man’s place within it must begin with a foundation for contemplation. If you deny universal purpose and an objective purpose for Man, then we have a basic disagreement. It is no put down to admit it.The problem with you in this discussion is, unaware of your position you keep insisting your approach is 'superior' to others and kept inventing straw man to put others down.
Without humanity in general acquiring a realistic perspective uniting the living wholeness of creation with the fragmentation of its parts, our species will become consumed by technology and Man’s collective conscious evolution will be prevented by imgintion.
Admitting the struggle between our higher and lower natures and the resulting inner slavery to imagination is too insulting for secularism to tolerate. That is why Jesus and Socrates had to die. Their awareness of reality could not be tolerated. I side with the minority who strive to keep the great ideas alive in the world regardless of the secular growls they inspire for the sake of awakening to a human perspective.
Path Of The Christian Mystic
Elizabeth Clare Prophet explores the world of the Christian mystics—those who seek a direct experience of the presence of God. They yearn to know God, to see God, and to be one with God now!