A philosophy for arguing with wives

Anything to do with gender and the status of women and men.

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Duncan Butlin
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A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Duncan Butlin »

Gentlemen, please stand down -- I must first speak to my lady readers. Forgive me, ladies, but I am not going to be paying much attention to you. I am more than delighted to have you as my readers, and you may very well be the key to my success, but you know most of what I am going to say already. Anyway, as you know, it is all men’s fault. Please do not feel too smug as I reveal the full horror of what men have been up to. I suspect that far more of you women than men will read me to the end, for men will be feeling very uncomfortable. Nevertheless, it is to men I must address myself. It is they who must change if things are to be put right. There is a summary for you at the end. Until then please stand back as I try to clear their minds.

Right, gentlemen, put your minds into gear. We men have far too high an opinion of philosophy and rational discourse. Women know better. A husband cannot use reason to confront his wife. If he fails to win a rational argument within ten seconds he is lost. He may argue forever, but he is never going to win. If he gets angry that is another matter, but that is no solution for a reasonable man. Not only is she far better than he at presenting arguments that appear logical, but at any point in the proceedings she is prepared to up the ante. Suddenly, if she is losing, he will find they are no longer going to have dinner together. If the tone of her voice rises, they are not going to have sex that night.

Philosophers in the past realised this and steered clear of the subject. A man’s most important argument is with his wife, and yet the arbiters of argument techniques shunned it. It is perhaps ten percent of all the arguments he will ever have. Surely one or two philosophers could have assigned ten percent of their time to the subject? A goodly proportion of that ten percent should have been ways to help the husband win. They could have listed argument techniques that proved successful in the past, counter arguments she might deploy, warnings of her tricks, and ways of coping with the inevitable defeat.

So how do our philosophers measure up? They are a total disaster. Not one single one in the whole wide world has ever written anything to help a man win arguments with his wife. Ways to ignore her, ways to criticise her, ways to demean her, yes -- but never, ever how to persuade her. Considering our philosophers’ hubris (and their sex), this is nothing short of treachery. From a man’s point-of-view. We will come to the women’s point-of-view in the end.

Unfortunately, as history progressed, philosophy’s performance in this regard deteriorated. True, some philosophers did boost men, but wives pay little attention to self-important husbands. Aristotle, who knew men should rule the world, had a special name for strong leaders: Megalopsychos -- proud, magnanimous man. This did not impress their wives. As a result, poor old Megalopsychos has been consigned to the scrapheap of history.

Cato the Elder in 213 bc made a splendid attempt to warn men: "Suffer woman once to be your equal, and from that day forth she will be your master". But, because he did not mention wives specifically, men missed the point. Unfortunately women did not: equality is now their key strategy for bringing men down. Quintus Tertullianus, Thomas Aquinas, Thomas Carlyle -- all damned men with faint praise.

Having thus far failed to rescue men, philosophers retreated. Instead of boosting men, they decided to criticise women instead. This, of course, is a total disaster for our benighted husband. It will only make her angry. Arthur Schopenhauer, Friedrich Nietzsche, Otto Weininger -- all failed to recognise women’s strengths, all made half-hearted attempts to criticise them, and all completely failed to confront them.

Arthur Schopenhauer, the most perceptive critic, shot himself in the foot. In the middle of his great diatribe against women (’On Women’), he advises that, in matters of difficulty, men should consult women. “To consult women in matters of difficulty, as the Germans used to do in old times, is by no means a matter to be overlooked; for their way of grasping a thing is quite different from ours, chiefly because they like the shortest way to the point, and usually keep their attention fixed upon what lies nearest … “. Traitor.

Friedrich Nietzsche, the most self-inflated critic, boosted men and criticised women, it is true, but then he directed men against the ‘slave mentality’ instead. That is no way to win a war. He did talk about the lowly status of women: “[Man] must always look on woman from the oriental standpoint:- as a possession, as private property, as something born to serve and be dependent on him.” But how to stop her rising up again? Nietzsche was silent.

Otto Weininger, the most unhinged critic, wanted to liberate women by changing them into men and stopping everyone having sex. Not a practical recipe for the future. Anyway, liberate women? Our poor husband will not even have an argument, let alone win it. She does not have to consult him when she is free to do as she pleases. “Man must free himself of sex, for in that way, and that way alone, can he free woman. In his purity, not, as she believes, in his impurity, lies her salvation. She must certainly be destroyed, as woman; but only to be raised again from the ashes - new, restored to youth - as a real human being.” Cato must have been turning in his grave.

Most ignominiously of all, having completely failed to engage women in any meaningful way, modern philosophers decided to appease women instead. I know it sounds crazy, but yes, they joined women in their fight against men. The husband is completely betrayed. His wife now has a plethora of male-generated arguments with which to berate him. Gilles Deleuze, Jacques Lacan, and Michel Foucault … and finally Jacques Derrida. The leader of the feminists until he died. His ‘deconstructionism’ was simply the destruction of men. His terms ‘phallocentric dogmatism’ and ‘phallocrat’ became key weapons in the feminist arsenal.

In 1997 I confronted him with this over the phone, and he agreed to read my diatribe. Over the phone again one week later, I asked if he had received it: “Yes, Mr. Butlin, I have.” “Well, do you see any merit in it?”, I asked. He went silent … and then, very slowly, he replied: “Mr. Butlin, you have disturbed me deeply”. He knew I had rumbled him, and he had no idea how to answer me. His treachery in the form of postmodernism has now undermined the Western world.

Poor husband. After two thousand five hundred years of male philosophy, philosophy has all but destroyed him. And where were all the female philosophers? They were the ones who so effectively redirected the male philosophers’ attention away from women. They defeated men before the philosophising began.

* * *

To speak seriously for a moment, I am sure you think the idea of men joining women to fight men (in other words to fight themselves) is a little fanciful. And anyway, you say, even if Jacques Derrida promoted it, it was only philosophy. It would never make it to the real world. Wrong. Just consider the case of sexual harassment.

Western man now skates on thin ice.  He does not even have to look at a woman to be accused of sexually harassing her -- his presence suffices.  A woman, on the other hand, can strip naked in front of him (in private), put on an erotic display, and smile at him triumphantly. In law, there is absolutely nothing he can do about it. He probably does not want to, but that is besides the point. He should have society’s support if he needs it. Yet, however outrageously she acts, in the eyes of the law she can do no wrong. That is what I call real sexual harassment.  What is more, over the internet she can do far worse.  She can display her whole body, particularly her genitals, to the majority of men on earth -- on a nightly basis -- enticing them to masturbate their lives away.  Sexual harassment on this scale has serious implications for the future of mankind.

Men and women have created this unjust situation, by pushing policy only from the women’s point-of-view: incredibly, we are both trying to protect defenceless women, from predatory men. No-one is looking after men’s interests. Just as Jacques Derrida intended. Do not get me wrong, it is right that women should be attacking men vigorously -- it is the nature of the sex war -- but it is quite wrong for men to desert and go over to the other side.

In fact it is an utter disaster. When men attack themselves it stops their brains functioning. Men are meant to put limits on women’s behaviour, not liberate them -- women are far too good at liberating themselves already -- but, mesmerised by female sexuality, they have forgotten their duty. Remember, this is the same woman who prevented all those male philosophers from doing anything useful, for two thousand five hundred years. It is the same woman who harasses a large percentage of men every night. It is the same woman who will not feel like sex tonight, if you make her feel the slightest bit uncomfortable.

But gentlemen, you need not feel discouraged. There is real hope for your salvation. In figuring out what has been going on, I have also come up with a solution. Unfortunately, there is no room to tell you about it here, so it will have to wait for another time. Suffice it to say I have discovered, after all, a rational argument that works with women. An argument that men can occasionally win. In the meantime I leave you with the following saying, which summarises the situation (I will summarise for women afterwards).

“When men have too much power a dictator or male elite rules, women have no say, behaviour is exemplary, and progress stagnates. In balance men rule, women complain, behaviour is acceptable, and progress is orderly. When women have too much power, the market rules, both men and women complain, behaviour is chaotic, and progress runs out-of-control.”

Please decide which scenario fits best. But do not take too long. I fear there is little time left.

* * *

Finally, the women’s point-of-view. Here I am again, ladies. I am sure I do not need to explain things to you, but for the gentlemen I will spell it out. It can all be reduced to husband and wife. If a woman’s husband does not stand up to her (as no man dares to stand up to women in public nowadays), she cannot boost his confidence by helping him. She would be confronting herself on his behalf. Apart from damaging her own sanity, his dignity would suffer. No, somehow she has to get him to stand up by himself.

All you women know what to do, of course -- you have had cause to resort to this strategy far too often. You must act so badly, so outrageously, that finally he has to do something about it. Taunt him, flirt with other men, insult him in public, propound crazy feminist views, renege on agreements … until, finally, he wakes up and puts you in your place. Just for a little while. What a relief for everyone.

In public this is what the feminists have been doing all along, and they have been trying very hard indeed. Well done. As you see, you have already been using this ploy in public for thousands of years. Unfortunately, up to now it has only made matters worse. But stick with it for a few months longer, and, with my help, mankind will be magically resurrected. You have been very patient. I am honoured to have had your attention for so long. Thank you very much indeed.

* * *

Copyright © 2018 by Duncan Butlin

This copyright notice applies to all text and images in this essay, no matter the original date of creation.  Permission is hereby granted free of payment, to anyone to copy all or any portion of the essay, in any quantity, to any media they like.  I am honoured if anyone reads my writing, and overwhelmed should anyone decide to share it with others.  Good luck, and thank you very much indeed.


my website: https://sites.google.com/site/suffrageurbutlin/
Last edited by Duncan Butlin on Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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henry quirk
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Post by henry quirk »

You don't need a philosophy, just your spine and your testes.
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Duncan Butlin
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Duncan Butlin »

Yes, that settles it within a marriage, but in the public arena of a mass society it takes more. Especially since we've had such a long period of peace. Individual men being brave in public get shot down, which frightens the rest into silence.
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henry quirk
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"in the public arena of a mass society it takes more."

Post by henry quirk »

I disagree.

'Spine' and 'testes' is exactly what it takes across all circumstances, without exception.

Mass society is just a placeholder for 'individuals livin' in close proximity to one another and doin' sumthin' other than killing each other (primarily)'. There's nuthin' there to struggle with (beyond what your imagination brings to the table). The contrary body never finds 'society' arrayed against him, just a buncha folks --indviduals -- puffed up and makin' noise.

I (think I) understand what you're tryin' to do, but you're castin' too wide, and targeting wrongly.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Dalek Prime »

Personally, I just growl and stop talking till they go away.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by -1- »

How to argue with wives?

You don't. That's how.

You initially establish who is the expert in what endeavours of life, and from then you capitulate to the dominant one's views in any particular endeavour.

I and my wife (girlfriend, actually), never argue. It is the secret to the longevity of our relationships. When it comes to electronics, moving furniture, handling tools, mechanical things, I am the boss. When it comes to approaching interpersonal stuff, how to say and what to some other people, I seek her advice. In non-competitive affairs we offer unrelenting support to each other.

We got into this groove so long now, that it's become effortlessly one smooth, pleasant, joyful ride.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

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Dalek Prime wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:32 pm Personally, I just growl and stop talking till they go away.
...they???

How many of those blasted things can you handle at once?

I've got only one, and I'm telling you, she is quite the energy-drainer. In a sweet and pleasant way, but still.

Maybe you got more testes than I do.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Dalek Prime »

-1- wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm
Dalek Prime wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:32 pm Personally, I just growl and stop talking till they go away.
...they???

How many of those blasted things can you handle at once?

I've got only one, and I'm telling you, she is quite the energy-drainer. In a sweet and pleasant way, but still.

Maybe you got more testes than I do.
None at the moment (women, not testes lol). I was thinking about women in general when I wrote that. I guess the strategy is working. :lol:

Oddly enough though, my female roomie thinks it's funny when I do that. Growl, that is.

On another note, I wonder if I should go get a packet of cigarettes? I'm trying to vape instead, but the habit has this siren call that's hard to resist, though I know it won't match the reality.
Last edited by Dalek Prime on Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

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Duncan Butlin wrote: Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:55 pm Copyright © 2018 by Duncan Butlin
Has anyone ever mentioned to you any of these attributes, in connection with your views expressed, in this essay or elsewhere:

"nineteen-fifties mentality", "social anachronistic atavism", "self-inflated ego", "misogynist idealist", "infantile intellect"?
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by -1- »

Dalek Prime wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:02 pm
-1- wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm
Dalek Prime wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:32 pm Personally, I just growl and stop talking till they go away.
...they???

How many of those blasted things can you handle at once?

I've got only one, and I'm telling you, she is quite the energy-drainer. In a sweet and pleasant way, but still.

Maybe you got more testes than I do.
None at the moment (women, not testes lol). I was thinking about women in general when I wrote that. I guess the strategy is working. :lol:

Oddly enough though, my female roomie thinks it's funny when I do that. Growl, that is.
Oh, I get you. It was a perceptual error on my part. By "they" you meant all of them, more than one, but one at a time.

Makes sense.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Dalek Prime »

-1- wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:07 pm
Dalek Prime wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:02 pm
-1- wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm
...they???

How many of those blasted things can you handle at once?

I've got only one, and I'm telling you, she is quite the energy-drainer. In a sweet and pleasant way, but still.

Maybe you got more testes than I do.
None at the moment (women, not testes lol). I was thinking about women in general when I wrote that. I guess the strategy is working. :lol:

Oddly enough though, my female roomie thinks it's funny when I do that. Growl, that is.
Oh, I get you. It was a perceptual error on my part. By "they" you meant all of them, more than one, but one at a time.

Makes sense.
These days, I'm never sure if I'm making sense, myself. Perhaps it's true that, in mental illness, we are always the last to know when we are being effected by it.
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Duncan Butlin
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Duncan Butlin »

Mr. 1 --- I am envious of you happy relationship -- congratulatons. My marriage lasted 22 years, but you could hardly call it “one smooth, pleasant, joyful ride”. You ask if the following criticisms have been levelled at me:
"nineteen-fifties mentality", "social anachronistic atavism", "self-inflated ego", "misogynist idealist", "infantile intellect"?
I have to confess that the first four have been applied to me at one time or another -- even by my ex-wife, mother and sister, on occasion. Nevertheless, they supported my researching to the end. Never been called ‘infantile’, unless you are doing so now.

‘Atavistic’ is spot on: I believe that the female take-over started 25 million years ago (see here for explanation: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid= ... WIzMTcxODQ). As for ‘misogynist’ it depends on your interpretation. I want to stay locked in combat with women all my life -- I believe society is doomed if men don’t take up the sex war again -- but at the same time I enjoy the fight, and I find the women often do too.

‘Self-inflated’ is inevitable, if I am to wage war at all. The feminist takeover is so complete that rational analysis leads any man to deep pessimism. On the face of it, the idea that little old me can make a difference is ludicrous, so it is only with a healthy belief in my own (fictitious) messiah-complex that I can hold my head up high.

To have come up with so many criticisms I suspect you must have read a fair portion of my essay -- for which I thank you very much.


My website: https://sites.google.com/site/suffrageurbutlin/
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

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Duncan Butlin wrote: Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:26 pm Mr. 1 --- I am envious of you happy relationship -- congratulatons. My marriage lasted 22 years, but you could hardly call it “one smooth, pleasant, joyful ride”. You ask if the following criticisms have been levelled at me:
"nineteen-fifties mentality", "social anachronistic atavism", "self-inflated ego", "misogynist idealist", "infantile intellect"?
I have to confess that the first four have been applied to me at one time or another -- even by my ex-wife, mother and sister, on occasion. Nevertheless, they supported my researching to the end. Never been called ‘infantile’, unless you are doing so now.

‘Atavistic’ is spot on: I believe that the female take-over started 25 million years ago (see here for explanation: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid= ... WIzMTcxODQ). As for ‘misogynist’ it depends on your interpretation. I want to stay locked in combat with women all my life -- I believe society is doomed if men don’t take up the sex war again -- but at the same time I enjoy the fight, and I find the women often do too.

‘Self-inflated’ is inevitable, if I am to wage war at all. The feminist takeover is so complete that rational analysis leads any man to deep pessimism. On the face of it, the idea that little old me can make a difference is ludicrous, so it is only with a healthy belief in my own (fictitious) messiah-complex that I can hold my head up high.

To have come up with so many criticisms I suspect you must have read a fair portion of my essay -- for which I thank you very much.


My website: https://sites.google.com/site/suffrageurbutlin/
has anyone told you you are erudite, well-spoken (in writing), and clear in your expressions?

You treat the battle of the sexes literally as a battle, as a war. I am from Canada, we negotiate here everything. When a province called Quebec wanted to separate from the rest of the country, we negotiated who pays for what and who gets what assets during and leading to after the separation. The negotiations were to prevent any disputes and / or armed conflicts later or during. The negotiations in mid-stream made the separatists change their minds. They realized they are much better off staying in the Dominion.

I think your approach is only distasteful because every of your sentiments are based on the assumption that men are superior to women. My stance is that men and women complement each other, and though they have differences, it is better to rely on the differentness to advance a family or a community, than to clamp down on it and have a hegemonic rule by one party or the other.
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Kayla »

i live in a large multigeneration household - all major - and many no so major - political views are represented here

i read a few snippets of your meanderings to some of them - and even my Trump-voting great-uncle thinks you are a sexist ass - "one of them real sexists"
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Duncan Butlin
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Re: A philosophy for arguing with wives

Post by Duncan Butlin »

Mr. 1 --- Very few people have complimented me like that -- thank you very much indeed. I live on the south coast of England, though I used to live in the US, and I have visited Alberta several times. That Quebec resolution was wonderful, I agree. At an exhibition in Japan in 1970 I even shook hands with president Trudeau (senior) in the Quebec discotheque!

No, I don’t think men are always superior, though I fear I give off that impression. I think men and women are equal value as human beings, and my list of female superiorities is much longer than my list of male ones! And I’ve even got evidence -- see this report (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid= ... jI0NDMyMmE).

In a marriage, far from wanting a ‘hegemonic rule’ by the man, I think the man should only occasionally get his way -- all the rest of the time the woman rules. Only when he puts his foot down should she accede. Yes, I love the word complementary too, and I delight in celebrating and exaggerating the differences between us.

I love my ex-wife, but I tried to be kind all the time, so I ended up encouraging her bad behaviour as well as her good. After 22 years it was finally too much for her.

Thanks again for your kind comments.


https://sites.google.com/site/suffrageurbutlin/
Last edited by Duncan Butlin on Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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