In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Can philosophers help resolve the real problems that people have in their lives?

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marjoram_blues
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In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:28 am

Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass

Philosophy Explorer
Posts: 4648
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 7:39 am

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by Philosophy Explorer » Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:43 am

marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Depends on the "trouble."

Overall I'm used to solving my own problems.

PhilX

marjoram_blues
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Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:08 am

Philosophy Explorer wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Depends on the "trouble."

Overall I'm used to solving my own problems.

PhilX
True. It always depends.
And troubles or problems are not always real.

It's all relative...centuries of war and famine. Hours of sheer boredom. A minute of pain.
A sharp realisation that we are all doooomed...

What is the Hardest Problem you solved on your own ?
In the shortest of time ?
And what is your problem solving technique?

Philosophy Explorer
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Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 7:39 am

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by Philosophy Explorer » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:21 am

marjoram_blues wrote:
Philosophy Explorer wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Depends on the "trouble."

Overall I'm used to solving my own problems.

PhilX
True. It always depends.
And troubles or problems are not always real.

It's all relative...centuries of war and famine. Hours of sheer boredom. A minute of pain.
A sharp realisation that we are all doooomed...

What is the Hardest Problem you solved on your own ?
In the shortest of time ?
And what is your problem solving technique?
The hardest problem I ever solved on my own was finding an eighth-order magic square which, when dot multiplied by (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) or (8,7,6,5,4,3 2,1), gives 1,170 as a result for all rows and columns. I solved the problem in less than 12 hours; when I left it as a puzzle, hundreds had looked at it with no solution.

How did I solve it? By repeating a certain procedure and by being analytical.

PhilX

marjoram_blues
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Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:30 am

Philosophy Explorer wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:
Philosophy Explorer wrote:
Depends on the "trouble."

Overall I'm used to solving my own problems.

PhilX
True. It always depends.
And troubles or problems are not always real.

It's all relative...centuries of war and famine. Hours of sheer boredom. A minute of pain.
A sharp realisation that we are all doooomed...

What is the Hardest Problem you solved on your own ?
In the shortest of time ?
And what is your problem solving technique?
The hardest problem I ever solved on my own was finding an eighth-order magic square which, when dot multiplied by (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) or (8,7,6,5,4,3 2,1), gives 1,170 as a result for all rows and columns. I solved the problem in less than 12 hours; when I left it as a puzzle, hundreds had looked at it with no solution.

How did I solve it? By repeating a certain procedure and by being analytical.

PhilX
Ah, that is just a game. Not a trouble concerning self or real world issues. Try again.

Philosophy Explorer
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Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by Philosophy Explorer » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:35 am

marjoram_blues wrote:
Philosophy Explorer wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:
True. It always depends.
And troubles or problems are not always real.

It's all relative...centuries of war and famine. Hours of sheer boredom. A minute of pain.
A sharp realisation that we are all doooomed...

What is the Hardest Problem you solved on your own ?
In the shortest of time ?
And what is your problem solving technique?
The hardest problem I ever solved on my own was finding an eighth-order magic square which, when dot multiplied by (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) or (8,7,6,5,4,3 2,1), gives 1,170 as a result for all rows and columns. I solved the problem in less than 12 hours; when I left it as a puzzle, hundreds had looked at it with no solution.

How did I solve it? By repeating a certain procedure and by being analytical.

PhilX
Ah, that is just a game. Not a trouble concerning self issues. Try again.
I don't have any self issues. Sorry.

PhilX

marjoram_blues
Posts: 1630
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:42 am

Philosophy Explorer wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:
Philosophy Explorer wrote:
The hardest problem I ever solved on my own was finding an eighth-order magic square which, when dot multiplied by (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) or (8,7,6,5,4,3 2,1), gives 1,170 as a result for all rows and columns. I solved the problem in less than 12 hours; when I left it as a puzzle, hundreds had looked at it with no solution.

How did I solve it? By repeating a certain procedure and by being analytical.

PhilX
Ah, that is just a game. Not a trouble concerning self issues. Try again.
I don't have any self issues. Sorry.

PhilX
I edited it to 'concerning self or real world' issues...because I kinda guessed you would say that.
What would you say if someone told you might have a problem with lack of insight and self knowledge?
I know.
They are wrong. To think that, and even if it were true - they shouldn't point it out coz u r happy just as u r.
No problem :)
Or is there a problem with the phrase 'self issues' ? So what did you mean by saying you were 'Overall used to solving your own problems'... Do you use some kind of philosophy?

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TSBU
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Post by TSBU » Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:18 pm

marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
It depends on the trouble. And you seem to be talking about a very concrete one.
The hardest problem... the hardest problems are usually not easy limited to one field, they touch your whole life, if your problem is big enough, your life is a mess, and you don't know where to start. Life is the hardest problem, and it's never solved.

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Greta
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Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by Greta » Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:38 pm

marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Yes, that probably covers a lot of it :)

Re: #2 "stuff the world" - only the human world. The culture. The judgements. The unfairness. The cruelty. The pushiness. The propensity for human probosci to find their way into others' business. I escape from all that to the garden, the dog and local bushland.

Early humans gained what they needed to survive from nature and then sought solace and security from nature's harshness with other humans. Modern urban humans gain what they need to survive from other humans and then seek solace and security from human harshness in nature.

marjoram_blues
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Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 1:24 pm

TSBU wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
It depends on the trouble. And you seem to be talking about a very concrete one.
The hardest problem... the hardest problems are usually not easy limited to one field, they touch your whole life, if your problem is big enough, your life is a mess, and you don't know where to start. Life is the hardest problem, and it's never solved.
Yes, already agreed that it depends on the trouble. And yes, I was thinking mainly real world concerns. Practical issues.There is no requirement to limit any problem to one field.

The time of your life can be happy even with difficulties; it may even depend on you having them. What doesn't kill you...
As you say, it is when problems (real or imagined) overwhelm and you don't know where to start - what can be done?
What or who do you turn to, if unable to cope ? A real person, a fictional character, history, games...
Sharing favourite moments, movies, melodies...

What do you consider is a most effective tool in our box of tricks...when it comes to philosophy.

marjoram_blues
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Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 1:34 pm

Greta wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Yes, that probably covers a lot of it :)

Re: #2 "stuff the world" - only the human world. The culture. The judgements. The unfairness. The cruelty. The pushiness. The propensity for human probosci to find their way into others' business. I escape from all that to the garden, the dog and local bushland.

Early humans gained what they needed to survive from nature and then sought solace and security from nature's harshness with other humans. Modern urban humans gain what they need to survive from other humans and then seek solace and security from human harshness in nature.
Yeah, I'm currently in 'Stuff the Human World' mode :)
And yes, doing a bit of both - seeking out some others and breathing in fresh air; out walking and talking. Or on here...for what it's worth.
It sounds like you are most fortunate in your escape world.

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TSBU
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Post by TSBU » Tue Jan 31, 2017 6:52 pm

marjoram_blues wrote:
TSBU wrote:you seem to be talking about a very concrete one.
yes, I was thinking mainly real world concerns. Practical issues.There is no requirement to limit any problem to one field.
I meant that you seemed to be thinking in a particular problem, like "how to pay the rent" or something like that.
The time of your life can be happy even with difficulties; it may even depend on you having them. What doesn't kill you...
Now it seems like you've never had any big trouble. What is probably going to kill you unless you do something...
As you say, it is when problems (real or imagined) overwhelm and you don't know where to start - what can be done?
What or who do you turn to, if unable to cope ? A real person, a fictional character, history, games...
Sharing favourite moments, movies, melodies...
It depends on the problem, there is no easy answer. I don't evade reality as a rule, like you seem to be saying in my eyes, I prefer to solve the problem, if I am overhelmed, I try to fight stronger. Some people are live the grass in the floor, they never broke, they change, some people are like metal, they force till they broke. Some are better to one things, and some for others. Buildings are built with metal though.
What do you consider is a most effective tool in our box of tricks...when it comes to philosophy.
There are no tricks. Philosophy, for me, is a serie of "rules" that guide my thoughts all the time, they don't give a concrete answer for a problem, they just give me the begining, the more abstract methodology. Philosophy is operative system,personality developement, there is nothing above it,if you want, philosophy works with garbage to provide the "tools", so it doesn't have any tool.

It is always times of trouble, there are harder and easier times, but there is always something to be better.
Last edited by TSBU on Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

marjoram_blues
Posts: 1630
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 12:50 pm

Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:30 pm

So a problem might arise if the operating system breaks down; no systematic rules to follow.
Major mental maladie.
How to fix it ?

Processing, processing...
...

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Greta
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Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by Greta » Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:38 pm

marjoram_blues wrote:
Greta wrote:
marjoram_blues wrote:Do you seek comfort in 'Philosophical Counselling' ?
Do you say Stuff the World and Everyone In it ?
Do you read the news and wonder about Alternative Facts ?
Do you need a new dictionary to translate what is a traitor?
Do you stop asking questions...
...and simply accept...
All Things Must Pass
Yes, that probably covers a lot of it :)

Re: #2 "stuff the world" - only the human world. The culture. The judgements. The unfairness. The cruelty. The pushiness. The propensity for human probosci to find their way into others' business. I escape from all that to the garden, the dog and local bushland.

Early humans gained what they needed to survive from nature and then sought solace and security from nature's harshness with other humans. Modern urban humans gain what they need to survive from other humans and then seek solace and security from human harshness in nature.
Yeah, I'm currently in 'Stuff the Human World' mode :)
And yes, doing a bit of both - seeking out some others and breathing in fresh air; out walking and talking. Or on here...for what it's worth.
It sounds like you are most fortunate in your escape world.
Still, I have less patience these days. I am becoming a grumpy old "get off my lawn" cow. After some decades where many still believed in kindness and compassion, today kindness is equated with gullibility and compassion with contemptible hypocrisy.

The contempt given to those those expressing sensitivity or compassion for the weak has been shocking to me. I see it as a remasculinisation of society, presumably in preparation for war. There is increasingly withering contempt for anything deemed even vaguely feminine - women, gays, compassion, peace, gentleness, kindness, forgiveness, beauty, refinement - and even intelligence.

So bullying is back in vogue after some decades of relative clarity. Calmly exchanging ideas and information is giving way to fighting, where ad hominems are increasingly accorded greater value in the public conversation than logic and reason, which of course is partly why the US is now run by The Don.

As Prince Charles noted, the lessons of WWII are being forgotten and, while he's not the most credible source, I think he's far from the only one noticing the flavour of the times. I suppose we now know how long it takes to go from "Never again" to "Let's fight again" - around 60 years, or two generations. Lessons of history are famously not leaned from one or even a few disasters, but a repeated pummelling until the message gets through the thick hominid skulls of multiple generations.

As you noted, I am lucky, and have more chance to retreat from it all than most. However, the ugliness is almost ubiquitous online now. As a school bullying victim and later an anti-bullying advocate I find it hard not to engage bullies online. I want to resist rather than submit/leave. I have to let it go, though, because if you associate with negativity enough - even if in conflict (or perhaps especially so) - you take on exactly that negativity yourself. The US is suffering under this issue - having focused so much on Muslims that they have become remarkably more like those puritanical prejudiced patriarchal autocrats in a short time.

In truth, any president could easily destroy Islamic fundamentalism within a decade, but they aren't allowed to do so. All that's needed is to spend the trillions that would have spent on fighting in the middle east on developing renewable energy solutions ASAP to replace fossil fuels and thus starve the terrorists funds.

Of course this can't happen due to vested interests. Everyone must suffer so fossil fuel companies can maximise their profits with their expensive 20th century infrastructure - and they are being enabled by those whose salaries we pay to represent us. So it goes. Seemingly China will have to lead the world in developing the renewable energy solutions. Reducing oil use is the only realistic answer to trouble in the middle east and the best way to alleviate these "times of trouble" generally, although one has the sense that whatever is done will be too little, too late. We are lucky to have lived through relatively civilised and stable times. While things are getting worse in most areas, living conditions for most people are still the best in human history.

Which brings us to "all things must pass". I like to think that whatever comes out of the upcoming craziness will grow to be greater than what came before, as has always been the case for billions of years.

Sorry, I rabbitted on a bit.

marjoram_blues
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Re: In Times of Trouble - what do you do?

Post by marjoram_blues » Wed Feb 01, 2017 9:53 am

Thanks, Greta, enjoyed your post. Nothing quite like an honest and open exchange of ideas. Especially given the fast moving change in politics - and upheavals.

I'm particularly concerned re the UK move away from Europe towards a changed and unpredictable USA. Speaking generally - I fucking hate what is happening. May and Trump holding hands.
It sickens me to my very core.
I can't even begin to articulate...
thank goodness there are others out there who can do this so much better - and hopefully, make a stand against any regressive steps.

Bye for now.

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