Explain heaven and hell?

[Blaggard]

Could of put this in the religious section but wont, 'cause it's bigger than that.

Can you explain heaven or hell in a way that makes sense.

I can think of an example of hell, facing all your demons eternally, unless you weren't human it would be meaningless, eventually you'd go mad and experience nothing, such cruelty seems beyond an omnibenevolent God who loves his children anyway and gave them free will.

Explan heaven likewise, you daaan well my son, in what way did you do well, you were threatened and coerced to such an extent free will became meaningless, and you thought rather than upset a rather, let's be honest vengeful God you'd just tow the line for pragmatisms sake. And not only that all you tow the liners, don't have free will, don't think for yourself all just float along, are now in a place that is so devoid of free will as to make Earth preposterous.

You die and go to hell you suffer from nothing, you go to heaven you have to put up with other meme space sheep who were too afraid to have free will.

Can someone explain this bollsock to me, in terms that unravel the anagram?

[Gary Childress]

Hi Blaggard,

As we all know, "heaven" is presumably where the "good" people go when "life" is done and "hell" is where the "bad" people go when "life" is done. Presumably we "mortals", who are currently "existing" in the "physical" world can know nothing about such places. There are of course "earthly parallels" that we humans seem to mimic according to our religious beliefs. Perhaps life imitates religion and perhaps religion imitates life. It's perhaps interesting that our current religions seem to have originated around the time social strata in the newly forming urban centers were forming. But I think the best philosophical answer to the questions you pose are, "who knows". Life is sometimes as much a perplexing mystery as what awaits afterward perhaps is. I tend to go with the Epicureans on matters regarding the nature of "death".

On the other hand, if "everything is one" as many mystics I guess have said (if I am to believe Walter Stace), then I wonder if "heaven" and "hell", "life" and "death", etc. are not essentially the same?

[Conde Lucanor]

Can you explain heaven or hell in a way that makes sense.

It's very simple. They are illusions, fantastic realms, conceived to deal with the struggles and miseries of real, mundane life. They only make sense as consolation, as an opiate.

[Gary Childress]

Can you explain heaven or hell in a way that makes sense.

It's very simple. They are illusions, fantastic realms, conceived to deal with the struggles and miseries of real, mundane life. They only make sense as consolation, as an opiate.

Hi Conde,

A very profound insight above I should think. The only further caveat I would add is that religion can also serve other purposes as well--such as a way of justifying society (in the sense that there is a need for societies to be "just").

For an extreme example. Suppose a person commits murder for no reasonable cause and finds that he or she just likes to commit murder. Should society not "sanction" that person in some way, perhaps prevent that person from reaching some sort of "level" where he or she can better act out that desire? Perhaps even preventing such a person from having children would even be warranted. For example (out of recent news) should a general who likens killing civilians to "mowing the lawn" be allowed to remain a general and in command of a great deal of destructive power (at least so long as his thoughts are in "error")?

[cladking]

81' 3".

The Egyptians called it the "3b3w". Our concept of "heaven" is a confusion of this and "hell" was invented after the confusion.

Don't worry. I'll start that Egypt thread.

[jackles]

hell is heaven without contentment.

[Bernard]

One way of putting it is that heaven is when time goes by really quickly and hell is when it seems to almost grounds to a halt. Both are time bound states, and one is preferable to the other depending on one's subjective states. They are physical states in a sense - if our psychology can be said to be physical, which I think there is a fairly good argument for -and this is why people regard them as having more or less physical locations, even if only psychological. It's very simple stuff in the end. Confusion is had when people add infinity into the mix. Infinity stops making sense of anything.

[jackles]

dont reakon you could be more wrong bernard.heaven dosnt move in any terms its a singularity and so as such has no relativity in it .allthough it is the relativity in moving events and is the constructor of moving things of its self the kingdom of heaven is nonlocal and nonrelative.time only exists when heaven has an object in side of it.so if something is seperated from heaven time will exist for that seperated thing until it returns to heaven.time will exist for that lost thing for how ever long it takes.

[Bernard]

I rest my case.

[Gary Childress]

I rest my case.

What was your case?

[Bernard]

An exoteric case. To be fair on Jackles, I took the liberty andi assumed the questioner was not after esoteric mega-thread encouraging type of replies.

[jackles]

ha .i get your gist bernard .only sayin wots wot though.

[henry quirk]

Heaven is where you go if you are good (follow the rules).

Hell is where you go if you are bad (break the rules).

If you confess yourself (submit to the rule enforcers, declare yourself as rules breaker, promise to be good) you can get yourself a 'get out of hell' pass (not valid in Arizona, and only valid till you break the rules again...and again...and again...).

Both 'places' are fictions designed expressly to keep superstitious folks 'in line'.

[jackles]

no henry got to disagree.heaven exists and hell exists but they are realy the same thing which is nothing.nothing can be heaven or hell just depends on the individuals identity in the event selfish or not.selfish goes to hell.why because a selfish persons idea of nothing is nothing so thats what they end up in absolute nuthin but their selfish self.

[henry quirk]

"heaven exists and hell exists but they are realy the same thing which is nothing"

'nuff said.