A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Anything to do with gender and the status of women and men.

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Skepdick
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Skepdick »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:05 am
Skepdick wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:02 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:01 am
Umm, just what you listed? Actually just the second one would have been fine.
So having two X chromosomes makes you a woman? Why?

Surely having two X chromosomes makes you someone who has two X chromosomes?
A man trying to tell a woman 'what' she is. Fuck off.
Quit faking outrage you fucking bitch.

I am not telling you what you are.
I am asking you how you have determined what you are.

What is it about you that makes you a "woman"?
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:05 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:04 am
Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:02 am
Has it? I'm not aware of this reality where there's no penalty for "wrong-gender" behaviours. Especially if we're talking about America, where nearly half the population thinks gay sex should be a criminal offense.

No, I definitely don't think that's exactly how it's always been
Nothing to do with being gay, especially as a large percentage of those 'transwimmin' decide that they are lesbian 'wimmin' (how very convenient).
It has a lot to do with being gay. You say it's always been that men are allowed to behave like women with no social penalties. I'm literally showing you a clear example where that is decidedly not the case
'Literally' showing me? What is it with you fucking yanks that you feel the need to put 'literally' in front of every other sentence?

I really don't give a flying rat's arse what you 'think'. A woman is xx. If people want to pretend otherwise then that's their delusion. Nothing to do with me. But when they try to force ME to agree that a cat is a dog then I'm going to push back.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Skepdick wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:08 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:05 am
Skepdick wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:02 am
So having two X chromosomes makes you a woman? Why?

Surely having two X chromosomes makes you someone who has two X chromosomes?
A man trying to tell a woman 'what' she is. Fuck off.
Quit faking outrage you fucking bitch.

I am not telling you what you are.
I am asking you how you have determined what you are.

What is it about you that makes you a "woman"?
I just told you fuck face. What the fuck do you want me to say to your stupid fucking 'question'. If you don't know what a woman is then I suggest you go back to kindergarten, or read an actual book.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Flannel Jesus »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:12 am
Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:05 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:04 am

Nothing to do with being gay, especially as a large percentage of those 'transwimmin' decide that they are lesbian 'wimmin' (how very convenient).
It has a lot to do with being gay. You say it's always been that men are allowed to behave like women with no social penalties. I'm literally showing you a clear example where that is decidedly not the case
'Literally' showing me? What is it with you fucking yanks that you feel the need to put 'literally' in front of every other sentence?

I really don't give a flying rat's arse what you 'think'. A woman is xx. If people want to pretend otherwise then that's their delusion. Nothing to do with me. But when they try to force ME to agree that a cat is a dog then I'm going to push back.
Right, so you actually don't want to defend what you said about "that's always been the case" because you reasonably know that in fact that is not now and has never been the case.
Skepdick
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Skepdick »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:13 am I just told you fuck face.
No you didn't.

You told me THAT having two X chromosomes makes you a "woman".
You didn't tell me WHY having two X chromosomes makes you anything other than somebody who has two X chromosomes.
Last edited by Skepdick on Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:46 am, edited 2 times in total.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:17 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:12 am
Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:05 am
It has a lot to do with being gay. You say it's always been that men are allowed to behave like women with no social penalties. I'm literally showing you a clear example where that is decidedly not the case
'Literally' showing me? What is it with you fucking yanks that you feel the need to put 'literally' in front of every other sentence?

I really don't give a flying rat's arse what you 'think'. A woman is xx. If people want to pretend otherwise then that's their delusion. Nothing to do with me. But when they try to force ME to agree that a cat is a dog then I'm going to push back.
Right, so you actually don't want to defend what you said about "that's always been the case" because you reasonably know that in fact that is not now and has never been the case.
I don't recall children getting hormone treatment just because they didn't conform to gender stereotypes. In fact it's the wokies who are the worst offenders when it comes to gender stereotyping.
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Skepdick wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:20 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:13 am I just told you fuck face.
Yeah, you told me WHAT makes you a "woman".
You did't tell me why that particular thing makes you a "woman".
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:13 am What the fuck do you want me to say to your stupid fucking 'question'.

I want you to tell me why that particular thing makes you a "woman".
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:13 am If you don't know what a woman is then I suggest you go back to kindergarten, or read an actual book.
Sure. Which curriculum would you prescribe? One which teaches gender as a social construct; or some other curriculum?
You still haven't said what 'gender is a social construct' means.

A simple biology book would do it.
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Flannel Jesus »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:22 am
Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:17 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:12 am

'Literally' showing me? What is it with you fucking yanks that you feel the need to put 'literally' in front of every other sentence?

I really don't give a flying rat's arse what you 'think'. A woman is xx. If people want to pretend otherwise then that's their delusion. Nothing to do with me. But when they try to force ME to agree that a cat is a dog then I'm going to push back.
Right, so you actually don't want to defend what you said about "that's always been the case" because you reasonably know that in fact that is not now and has never been the case.
I don't recall children getting hormone treatment just be they didn't conform to gender stereotypes. In fact it's the wokies who are the worst offenders when it comes to gender stereotyping.
You are not on topic. You are still not saying anything to demonstrate what you said, which anybody with eyes knows to be false. Anyone who is conscious in the western world knows that there are, in fact, and have always been for as long as any western society has existed, behaviours and preferences prescribed for one gender and proscribed for the other.

You say "That's exactly how it has always been." As if there are no gendered expectations or even laws. That's clearly decidedly not the case.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:24 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:22 am
Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:17 am

Right, so you actually don't want to defend what you said about "that's always been the case" because you reasonably know that in fact that is not now and has never been the case.
I don't recall children getting hormone treatment just be they didn't conform to gender stereotypes. In fact it's the wokies who are the worst offenders when it comes to gender stereotyping.
You are not on topic. You are still not saying anything to demonstrate what you said, which anybody with eyes knows to be false. Anyone who is conscious in the western world knows that there are, in fact, and have always been for as long as any western society has existed, behaviours and preferences prescribed for one gender and proscribed for the other.

You say "That's exactly how it has always been." As if there are no gendered expectations or even laws. That's clearly decidedly not the case.
Still nothing to do with whether or not I'm a woman.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Right, no capacity to maintain a thread in a conversation lmao.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

Right. No capacity to be rational and express yourself coherently. I'm not surprised, since there is no coherence in the wokie position.
Skepdick
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Skepdick »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:23 am You still haven't said what 'gender is a social construct' means.

A simple biology book would do it.
We find ourselves into the same situation as before. I can only explain it to you but I can't understand it for you.

Given all the facts about you which make you who you are - it is socially determined which particular subset/combination of facts about you makes you a "woman".

Society determines the necessary and sufficient factual conditions for womanhood.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Flannel Jesus »

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:34 am Right. No capacity to be rational and express yourself coherently. I'm not surprised, since there is no coherence in the wokie position.
What's incoherent about my position that behaviours have been prescribed for one gender and proscribed for another? It seems pretty straight forward.
Skepdick
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Skepdick »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:38 am What's incoherent about my position that behaviours have been prescribed for one gender and proscribed for another? It seems pretty straight forward.
For starters - it's not entirely clear if that's true.

If the behavioural norms can be bypassed by simply dressing as the opposite gender then the behavioural norms are grounded in the appearance of a particular gender and not in biology.
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Re: A contradiction, I think, between "gender is a social construct" and trans-ness

Post by Iwannaplato »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 9:36 am
I'm sure VT and SD are going to require a great deal of ripostes, but I updated my first post, while you responded
viewtopic.php?p=631875#p631875
and responded to your response here...
viewtopic.php?p=631880#p631880
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