Cherry-picking. The Bible is more than the 10 commandments.
Isiah 45:51
Exodus 20:3
....
https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/No-Other-Is-God
YHWH is omnipresent. There is no "after" or "before".
Cherry-picking. The Bible is more than the 10 commandments.
YHWH is omnipresent. There is no "after" or "before".
You have little sense of humor, don't you ?gaffo wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:41 am trial by combat was outlawed in Britian in 1817? due to a high profile duel of the time, that law outlawing Trial by Combat was after the indepence of these United States, and so (just an an aside) Trial by Combat is still legal in America.
legally speaking, not practically speaking.
just a FYI on the matter and utterly off topic to this thread.
you are showing your Christian bias, if you have read the Torah as a historical document, you would not discount the clear Polythiesm found in the Torah and older Minor Prophet's works.Logik wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2019 6:11 amCherry-picking. The Bible is more than the 10 commandments.
Isiah 45:51
Exodus 20:3
....
https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/No-Other-Is-God
YHWH is omnipresent. There is no "after" or "before".
Yes!Belinda wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:52 am I agree, Gaffo. Rather than group and evaluate religions according to their myths it would be better for most purposes to describe, explain, and evaluate them according to the continuum of liberal/ fundamentalist quality. it's entirely possible to be a devout Muslim and an enthusiastic and active feminist.
I think that the political misogyny among the Islamic nations is caused, not by the Koran or the mythology of Islam, but by the history of Muslim nations and ethnic groups
nope. in the past, 800-1200 AD (when Europe was in the Dark Age) - Arabs were in their Enlightenment Age - math (Algebra), adopted the East Indian numberals (including the Zero), Astronomical knowledge (which they inherited via conquoring the Zoroestrians originally, then expanded that knowledge).
You are focusing on the messenger and not the message. Do you think polytheism and monotheism are any different in practice?gaffo wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:38 am you are showing your Christian bias, if you have read the Torah as a historical document, you would not discount the clear Polythiesm found in the Torah and older Minor Prophet's works.
but carry on in your bias and assume i cherry pick if that give you comfort.
Logik wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:11 amYou are focusing on the messenger and not the message.gaffo wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:38 am you are showing your Christian bias, if you have read the Torah as a historical document, you would not discount the clear Polythiesm found in the Torah and older Minor Prophet's works.
but carry on in your bias and assume i cherry pick if that give you comfort.
sure, they are worshiping different gods.
care to elaborate?
What makes a religion is the little rituals people do: hang out together on Sundays. Break bread on Shabbos. Light candles in front of some pictures at 5am and sing prayer. Fast in April. Celebrate birth of some dude in December. All of those are things people DO. Real, empirical, scientifically verifiable actions.gaffo wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:42 amcare to elaborate?That which makes a religion is the rituals and practices being adhered to. Whether you perform 10 rituals in service of 10 gods. Or 10 rituals in service of 1 capricious god. There is absolutely no distinction in practice. Only in narratives.
yes i agree ritual is probably the most important aspect of Relgion over Dogma.Logik wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:57 amWhat makes a religion is the little rituals people do: hang out together on Sundays. Break bread on Shabbos. Light candles in front of some pictures at 5am and sing prayer. Fast in April. Celebrate birth of some dude in December. All of those are things people DO. Real, empirical, scientifically verifiable actions.gaffo wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:42 amcare to elaborate?That which makes a religion is the rituals and practices being adhered to. Whether you perform 10 rituals in service of 10 gods. Or 10 rituals in service of 1 capricious god. There is absolutely no distinction in practice. Only in narratives.
All of those rituals is what builds communities. Builds camaraderie, cooperation and solidarity. The "I believe in God" part is just what you SAY. It's just a linguistic ritual. It means absolutely nothing. It's an epiphenomenon to the rituals.
In contrast to the actual rituals people do the "I believe in God" part is NOT testable by science. As I keep challenging people (and thy keep failing) to determine my (a)theism empirically.
And so as far as any scientist is concerned religion (monotheistic or polytheistic) is about rituals and behaviour, not the God-belief.
Does group prayer work? Of course it works! When you let the entire community know that John is having a problem, SOMEBODY who knows how to help will come to John's help! As far as John is concerned "God did it".
Confession and prayer - same as modern day psychotherapy. Only cheaper.
All these rituals serve a purpose, and some times they do work, but not for the reasons people say they work (they say God - which basically means "i have no clue how it works"). That's hardly a problem though. Competence does not require comprehension. You drive a car without having an understanding of how an engine works. You use a computer without having an understanding how a CPU is built. etc etc.
And so back to the number of rituals/gods.
Hinduism is what "We" (the west) would have had had Christianity not overun Greco-Roman Religion. if not for Christianity, we in the west would have our own version of Hinduism - Roman/Greece Religion today as the majorty religion in the west.Logik wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:57 am Hindus have simply chosen to fragment the capriciousness of one God into as many deities they desire. Shiva - the destroyer. Hanuman - the celibate. Ganesha - the problem solver/obstacle remover. The Abrahamic god simply suffers from multiple personality disorder.
Because the Abrahamic god is created in our own image
I practice no rituals that are specific to atheism for they would be entirely superfluousLogic wrote:
by calling yourself an atheist are you saying that you practice no rituals whatsoever ?
You are thinking about this backwards. Your actions and behaviors define you. Not the label you have chosen for yourself.surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:11 am I practice no rituals that are specific to atheism for they would be entirely superfluous
But you DO practice some rituals even if they have nothing to do with atheism. Do you not? Brushing your teeth. Drinking beer with mates on Friday evening, watch football, Hanging out with family on Easter/Christmas (same as every Christian), going to doctor when you are ill.surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:11 am Belief systems have rituals but atheism is not a belief system so they are not necessary
That's true. However historical circumstances in western Europe after the European Dark Ages involved the printing press, Renaissance, Reformation, and then followed European scientific enlightenment; all this sequence accompanied by increasing military and imperial power in western Europe , power which the Muslims' world lost.nope. in the past, 800-1200 AD (when Europe was in the Dark Age) - Arabs were in their Enlightenment Age - math (Algebra), adopted the East Indian numberals (including the Zero), Astronomical knowledge (which they inherited via conquoring the Zoroestrians originally, then expanded that knowledge).
the problem today with "the Arabs", is that they have forgotten that they used to have a great enlightened culture (I think their education system does not inform them of this history - why? not sure why - but i've met many Muslims and most of them do not know it)
Some of your examples are extremely trivial indeed : you brush your teeth because its healthy to do soLogic wrote:
But you DO practice some rituals even if they have nothing to do with atheism. Do you not ? Brushing your teeth. Drinking beer with mates
on Friday evening watch football Hanging out with family on Easter / Christmas ( same as every Christian ) going to doctor when you are ill
And at the very least the Atheistic rituals you do practice are probably something like : arguing with theists / rejecting theistic rituals
( except Christmas ! Because everybody loves gifts ! ) etc etc etc
Those rituals define your religion. Those very rituals may become questionable taboos to future generations. As and when we all have
automated robot doctors in our house - people who still insist going to actual doctors will be seen as weird. As and if we ever find ourselves as
a culture of teetotalers - people who drink beer will be seen as weird. Watching football may be as unacceptable to the people of year 4500 as Gladiator fighting in Rome is unacceptable to us today