Whose Life has Value?

Should you think about your duty, or about the consequences of your actions? Or should you concentrate on becoming a good person?

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prof
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by prof » Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:54 am

Nick_A wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:16 am
Prof, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Since we are as we are, everything is as it is.... We will say one thing and do another since it is our nature to be hypocrites.

Simone had it right. The powers that be dictate whose life has value...
Yes, I agree: we tend to be hypocrites.
And, yes, if you are up before a judge in a court, the judge decides how to dispose of you; although if you have the money, you can file an appeal. Yes, "them what has the gold seem to make the rules." {That is the cynical version of the Golden Rule.} ...But who needs cynics!!

However, note the subtitle of Simone Weil's best-known book,
The Need for Roots: prelude towards a declaration of duties towards mankind . Obviously, she would not settle for your view, and I quote: that "everything is as it is." She would strive to reform the status quo; she would fight for social justice.

Before her untimely death at age 34, and ever since she graduated college, she wrote about what she spoke of as "the patriotism of compassion." As a political activist, who spoke out forcefully against Franco in the Spanish Civil War, she advocated the abolition of political parties. {Franco was the Trump of that day....}

She devoted herself to political activism, work that would see her assisting in the trade union movement; she spent more than a year working as a laborer, mostly in auto factories, so she could better understand the working class.

And notice that the theory for the Science of the Moral Sense, as seen in Katz - Basic Ethics, also recommends, as an implication of its findings, that we engage in political activism - at least in our selection of candidates for political office, and for whom we are going to vote. See: http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BASIC%20ETHICS.pdf
See esp. pp. 24-35 and pp. 40-42.

and see also an earlier work: Ethics as Science
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICS ... CIENCE.pdf

.

Nick_A
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by Nick_A » Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:20 pm

prof wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:54 am
Nick_A wrote:
Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:16 am
Prof, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Since we are as we are, everything is as it is.... We will say one thing and do another since it is our nature to be hypocrites.

Simone had it right. The powers that be dictate whose life has value...
Yes, I agree: we tend to be hypocrites.
And, yes, if you are up before a judge in a court, the judge decides how to dispose of you; although if you have the money, you can file an appeal. Yes, "them what has the gold seem to make the rules." {That is the cynical version of the Golden Rule.} ...But who needs cynics!!

However, note the subtitle of Simone Weil's best-known book,
The Need for Roots: prelude towards a declaration of duties towards mankind . Obviously, she would not settle for your view, and I quote: that "everything is as it is." She would strive to reform the status quo; she would fight for social justice.

Before her untimely death at age 34, and ever since she graduated college, she wrote about what she spoke of as "the patriotism of compassion." As a political activist, who spoke out forcefully against Franco in the Spanish Civil War, she advocated the abolition of political parties. {Franco was the Trump of that day....}

She devoted herself to political activism, work that would see her assisting in the trade union movement; she spent more than a year working as a laborer, mostly in auto factories, so she could better understand the working class.

And notice that the theory for the Science of the Moral Sense, as seen in Katz - Basic Ethics, also recommends, as an implication of its findings, that we engage in political activism - at least in our selection of candidates for political office, and for whom we are going to vote. See: http://www.myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/BASIC%20ETHICS.pdf
See esp. pp. 24-35 and pp. 40-42.

and see also an earlier work: Ethics as Science
http://myqol.com/wadeharvey/PDFs/ETHICS ... CIENCE.pdf

.
Above all Simone was dedicated to experiential truth. This allowed her to experience the futility of social activism as a movement. She wrote:
Humanism was not wrong in thinking that truth, beauty, liberty, and equality are of infinite value, but in thinking that man can get them for himself without grace.
The human as opposed to the pragmatic egoistic goals of social activism are prevented because of the collective denial of the help of grace necessary to nourish the higher parts of the soul.

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Harbal
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by Harbal » Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:40 pm

Nick_A wrote:
Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:20 pm
the help of grace necessary to nourish the higher parts of the soul.
If the soul gets too much nourishment does it put on weight? Is there such a thing as a fat soul?

Belinda
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by Belinda » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:52 pm

I wondered what Christians mean by "Grace".

(Googled)
A shorthand for what grace is - “mercy, not merit.” Grace is the opposite of karma, which is all about getting what you deserve. Grace is getting what you don’t deserve, and not getting what you do deserve. Christianity teaches that what we deserve is death with no hope of resurrection.
This God of grace and infinite mercy is very good as the alternative to the punitive version of God. However the God of grace and infinite mercy is not a fact of life but is what people do who behave with grace and mercy.

Nick_A
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by Nick_A » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:07 am

Belinda wrote:
Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:52 pm
I wondered what Christians mean by "Grace".

(Googled)
A shorthand for what grace is - “mercy, not merit.” Grace is the opposite of karma, which is all about getting what you deserve. Grace is getting what you don’t deserve, and not getting what you do deserve. Christianity teaches that what we deserve is death with no hope of resurrection.
This God of grace and infinite mercy is very good as the alternative to the punitive version of God. However the God of grace and infinite mercy is not a fact of life but is what people do who behave with grace and mercy.
"Grace fills empty spaces, but it can only enter where there is a void to receive it We must continually suspend the work of the imagination in filling the void within ourselves."
"In no matter what circumstances, if the imagination is stopped from pouring itself out, we have a void (the poor in spirit). In no matter what circumstances... imagination can fill the void. This is why the average human beings can become prisoners, slaves, prostitutes, and pass thru no matter what suffering without being purified." Simone Weil
We live in imagination. Modern technology has replaced the old values of contemplation, meditation, prayer, and whatever else which stills the mind allowing the energy of grace to nourish the psych. Without it, the intensity of social activism assures the denial of grace. When this happens we descend into being governed by our lower more animal and selfish personalities.

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie » Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:27 pm

Agreed. Whenever I eat sardines, I say why is it legally allowed for me to kill fish, when I cannot prove their sentience, and yet I cannot prove the sentience of some other humans either.

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GreatandWiseTrixie
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Re: Whose Life has Value?

Post by GreatandWiseTrixie » Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:28 pm

Nick_A wrote:
Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:07 am

We live in imagination. Modern technology has replaced the old values of contemplation, meditation, prayer, and whatever else which stills the mind allowing the energy of grace to nourish the psych. Without it, the intensity of social activism assures the denial of grace. When this happens we descend into being governed by our lower more animal and selfish personalities.
This is true. SJWs are psychopathic national socialists who will block you in 5 seconds if you dont bow to their whims.

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Luxin
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All life has value -- only monsters think it doesn't.

Post by Luxin » Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am

November 1, 2018

Hi Nick,

Every life has value because the spirit of God is there. There but often unexpressed, hence evil.

Man without a spiritual concept -- without agape or Love for all, i.e. the good and beautiful spirit of God in all, including the 'bad' -- represents the reality of genocide implicit in 666, the 'mark of the beast'. The number 666 is the number 999 reversed. We are the only potentially spiritual beings, and that potential finds its ultimate expression in the positive side of the number 9, which represents Universal Love, Understanding and Compassion. The writer of the Book of Revelation, John of Patmos, probably knew Number.

When the 9 swings to the dark side through ignorance or spiritual poverty, the worst imaginable atrocities take place as men become the only true beasts or monsters in the Universe. However, degenerate people are not to blame for what they do and must be forgiven as that is the only way their victims can find peace. Believe it or not, the 'wicked' are not even essentially responsible for the evil they do, because all evil proceeds from the negative channel of mind, which is capable of anything including, as we know, the slander and character assassination of an entire race.

The majority of us are capable of murder. I won't say why, though I do know why. It's depressing and best left for people like me to know and keep to myself mostly. My statement will neither increase nor does it justify murder. All I can say is that the high murder and genocide rate will not change for any amount of wishful or hopeful thinking that the human race will somehow magically change. All of us taken collectively ARE the beast. We are our own worst nightmare, and that nightmare is very likely going to continue until we annihilate ourselves almost entirely. Indic thinkers have theorized that the human race has annihilated itself many times already.

The accumulated sin of ages of spiritual ignorance -- i.e. not knowing what we are and our tremendous potential for good or evil -- has brought the human race a horrifyingly enormous load of bad karma. I could say some things, but I'd be wasting my time because no one would believe me. Things are bad now, but they are going to get much worse. It's going to be a wrath of God beyond anyone's imagination. It's good to live in this time before 'the wave hits', preparing my soul for its future.

I could even tell you when the wave will hit, but it wouldn't help us at all because the human race is LOCKED into its bad karma. That's how karma works, to ensure that the FULL karmic retribution of Nature is issued to us. After the 'next end' or the physical death of collective humanity (read virtual 'monstrosity'), the souls of the righteous will reincarnate so that the human race may be restored to Life and the possibility of Love and Wisdom again ... another chance, as long as Nature herself has not also been destroyed.

Age
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Re: All life has value -- only monsters think it doesn't.

Post by Age » Thu Nov 01, 2018 6:20 am

Luxin wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am
November 1, 2018

Hi Nick,

Every life has value because the spirit of God is there. There but often unexpressed, hence evil.

Man without a spiritual concept -- without agape or Love for all, i.e. the good and beautiful spirit of God in all, including the 'bad' -- represents the reality of genocide implicit in 666, the 'mark of the beast'. The number 666 is the number 999 reversed. We are the only potentially spiritual beings, and that potential finds its ultimate expression in the positive side of the number 9, which represents Universal Love, Understanding and Compassion. The writer of the Book of Revelation, John of Patmos, probably knew Number.

When the 9 swings to the dark side through ignorance or spiritual poverty, the worst imaginable atrocities take place as men become the only true beasts or monsters in the Universe. However, degenerate people are not to blame for what they do and must be forgiven as that is the only way their victims can find peace. Believe it or not, the 'wicked' are not even essentially responsible for the evil they do, because all evil proceeds from the negative channel of mind, which is capable of anything including, as we know, the slander and character assassination of an entire race.

The majority of us are capable of murder. I won't say why, though I do know why. It's depressing and best left for people like me to know and keep to myself mostly.
WHY will you not really say why the majority of us are capable of murder?

So WHAT if it is, allegedly, depressing?

WHY do you THINK ii is "best left for people like you"?

And, WHAT do you mean by "people like you"? WHAT are 'you type of people like'?

Luxin wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am
My statement will neither increase nor does it justify murder. All I can say is that the high murder and genocide rate will not change for any amount of wishful or hopeful thinking that the human race will somehow magically change. All of us taken collectively ARE the beast. We are our own worst nightmare, and that nightmare is very likely going to continue until we annihilate ourselves almost entirely. Indic thinkers have theorized that the human race has annihilated itself many times already.

The accumulated sin of ages of spiritual ignorance -- i.e. not knowing what we are and our tremendous potential for good or evil -- has brought the human race a horrifyingly enormous load of bad karma. I could say some things, but I'd be wasting my time because no one would believe me.
WHY do you THINK/BELIEVE that you would be wasting your time, saying some things, because no one would BELIEVE you?

Have you said those things to ALL people yet? If not, then you do NOT know if you are wasting your time or not.

There are some people who actually are OPEN to listen and hear what is actually being said.

Luxin wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am
Things are bad now, but they are going to get much worse. It's going to be a wrath of God beyond anyone's imagination.
Some have already imagined exactly what will take place.
Luxin wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am
It's good to live in this time before 'the wave hits', preparing my soul for its future.

I could even tell you when the wave will hit, but it wouldn't help us at all because the human race is LOCKED into its bad karma.
If they are LOCKED or NOT some people still wonder out of curiosity.

Would you like to give a rough indication of when the "wave will hit"?
Luxin wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:18 am
That's how karma works, to ensure that the FULL karmic retribution of Nature is issued to us. After the 'next end' or the physical death of collective humanity (read virtual 'monstrosity'), the souls of the righteous will reincarnate so that the human race may be restored to Life and the possibility of Love and Wisdom again ... another chance, as long as Nature herself has not also been destroyed.

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