Instead of "Wot" now at least you are trying to respond with your best shots.Peter Holmes wrote: ↑Tue May 17, 2022 7:00 amHere are some dictionary definitions.Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Tue May 17, 2022 4:12 amI am asking again, what is the grounding of your 'what is fact'? So far you are making groundless claims.
Notice the two radically different uses of the word 'fact':
- Fact Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fact
Kids Definition of fact ... 1 : something that really exists or has occurred
FACT | definition in the Cambridge English Dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dic ... glish/fact
Meaning of fact in English ... something that is known to have happened or to exist, especially something for which proof exists
Fact Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/fact
a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true
a feature of reality that is or was the case; and a thing that's true -
the second of which refers to a true factual assertion - a description - typically a linguistic expression.
Obviously, outside language, features of reality have no truth-value. Features of reality just are, neither true nor false. Reality is not linguistic.
Unfortunately leveraging on dictionaries meaning of 'what is fact' is really kindergarten-philosophy.
I did a survey of 'what is fact' from 13 dictionaries.
To apply a higher level of philosophy, one need to get into the essence of beyond the dictionaries meanings of what is fact.
If you reflect more deeply on the various meanings of "what is fact" in all these dictionaries, the underlying principles is,
what is fact is conditioned upon as specific FSK [explicit or implied].
Note these plain meanings [from above] of 'what is fact'
- 1 : something that really exists or has occurred
2. a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true or
3. something that actually exists; reality; truth:
- as above; something that is known to have happened or to exist, especially something for which proof exists.
or
a thing that is known or proved to be true.
.."he ignores some historical and economic facts"
something that is known to have happened or to exist, especially something for which proof exists, or about which there is information:
..No decision will be made until we know all the facts.
You can't argue with facts: a fact is something proven to be true.
A thing that is known or proved to be true.
a thing that is known to be true, especially when it can be proved
The definition of a fact is something that is true or something that has occurred or has been proven correct.
..An example of a fact is that the world is round.
Something demonstrated to exist or known to have existed
Here are the more specific meaning of what is fact,
- An objective consensus on a fundamental reality that has been agreed upon by a substantial number of people.
There is no doubting the fact that the Earth orbits the Sun.
https://www.yourdictionary.com/fact
You will note the dictionaries meaning progressively advance from the kid's stuff to the more refined philosophical meanings which is most valid for our purpose, which I had directly reference to the WIKI's definition of fact;
- A fact is something that is true. The usual test for a statement of fact is verifiability, that is whether it can be demonstrated to correspond to experience. Standard reference works are often used to check facts. Scientific facts are verified by repeatable careful observation or measurement by experiments or other means.
For example,
"This sentence contains words." accurately describes a linguistic fact, and
"The sun is a star" accurately describes an astronomical fact. Further,
"Abraham Lincoln was the 16th President of the United States" and "Abraham Lincoln was assassinated" both accurately describe historical facts.
Generally speaking, facts are independent of belief and of knowledge and opinion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact
- 1. Whatever is fact must be conditioned to a specific framework and system [of knowledge, language games, whatever].
2. The credibility of the fact will depend on the credibility of the said F&S relied upon; the scientific [& mathematics] FSKs are the most credible and thus are the standard.
I have surveyed the meaning of what is fact from 13 dictionaries, none of them refer to fact in terms of 'that is or was the case' or your usual 'states of affairs' [see post below]. [if any, it would be a very rare one]Notice the two radically different uses of the word 'fact':
a feature of reality that is or was the case; and a thing that's true -
the second of which refers to a true factual assertion - a description - typically a linguistic expression.
Obviously, outside language, features of reality have no truth-value. Features of reality just are, neither true nor false. Reality is not linguistic.
I believe your very narrow and restricted definition of what is fact is confined to a specific linguistic FSK which you admit has no link to reality, thus your 'what is fact' is unrealistic.
In the first place, your 'what is fact' is delusional, i.e. it is not based on reality as you admitted but rather it is a linguistic-based 'what is fact'.Your mistake is to confuse the two different uses of the word 'fact', ignoring the first and primary use: 'something that really exists or has occurred', etc.
Your claim that such a thing doesn't and can't exist outside a descriptive context is false.
We say a factual assertion is true only if it asserts something that really does exist outside the descriptive context - namely, a fact.
You are strawmanning.
What I claimed as 'what is fact' is based on reality, i.e. verifiable and justifiable based on empirical evidences within a credible FSK [of near equivalence to the scientific FSK].
You are referring to yourself!You've been suckered by a trendy relativisation of what we call truth which was fashionable around sixty years ago. But mistaking what we say about things for the way things are is an ancient and persistent delusion.
- The common usage of "something that has really occurred or is the case*" dates from the mid-16th century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact#Etymology_and_usage
i.e. that is or was the case without any reference to a specific Framework and System,