DPMartin wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2019 4:15 pm
Age wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:52 am
What justifies?
Is 'that', which is just.
Only 'that', which is in agreement with and by ALL, IS JUST.
nice thought
its true that the agreement justifies. it's justified to paint the car blue because the agreement states to paint the car blue. so could it be said the agreement is the reason an act is justified?
Yes this could be said.
'Agreement', by one individual or by ALL individuals is, 'what justifies'.
(Now before I continue I will apologize in advance. All of this can be explained in very few words, but i do have a tendency to TRY TO explain all-of-this in great detail so that it is much better understand where I am coming from and how these answers are arrived at. So, again apologies.)
Every thing that is "justified" is 'justified' only because some one or some people are "justifying" it (whatever the 'it' is). Those who have 'justified it' have agreed that 'it' could be and is 'justified'. However, if that 'justification', which is justified to and by one or a few ones, is actually 'just' and 'right' to ALL and EVERY one, then that is a completely other matter.
Only
what IS JUST to and by EVERY one is
what IS Truly Just. The rest is, appropriately or inappropriately termed, "a justification".
DPMartin wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2019 4:15 pm also does the agreement have to be with power to sustain and establish justification?
I do NOT see 'power' as necessarily having any part in this. Just 'agreement' does. For example just one person might agree on their own terms that some actions are justified, and to them those actions ARE justified, but to others those actions are NOT justified at all - like the actions of allowing children to die of starvation.
I do NOT see the 'agreement' within one, or with some, being 'with power', other than the 'power of agreement' itself has MADE the "justification", itself.
Maybe the power of CHOICE is what establishes and sustains justification? And, the power of CHOICE comes from the freedom to choose, maybe?
But anyway, to establish and sustain justification only agreement is needed. Even if that agreement is within "one's own self", as they say, or in agreement with ALL or any number up to ALL, the 'agreement' itself establishes AND sustains the 'justification'. If there is NO, apparent, conflict of views, then agreement is reached, within just one and/or up to ALL, and if NO conflict is being seen, then justifications are MADE.
'Justifying' comes from 'agreeing'. Whereas, 'agreement reached' is when justification is made. So, 'what justifies' is
agreeing AND agreement (of views), maybe?
DPMartin wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2019 4:15 pmwhat if a more powerful in agreement eliminates the previous agreement and those in the previous agreement?
Then they are 'just' eliminated. Nothing more, and nothing less. The MORE that are in agreement, the less chances of the 'agreement' just being a subjective "justification", and more chances of the agreement being Truly JUST (or an objective Justification). Obviously, if ALL are in agreement, then there is NO one disagreeing. So, what is being justified by ALL, for all intention purposes, IS JUST, and thus, literally, Truly JUSTIFIED. What IS JUST is naturally just (and/or) justified.
But in saying this, OF COURSE, if another view comes along, and as long as EVERY one is OPEN to LOOKING AT that new view, and 'it' is MORE justified than the last one, and ALL are agreeing, then the last "justified" view gets eliminated and the so called "new" view becomes the JUST and RIGHT view, now.
The words 'justify', 'justifying', and 'justified, come from the word 'just', and obviously ONLY
what IS Truly JUST can be Truly justified.
True JUSTIFICATION can ONLY come from agreement between and with ALL, and by and for ALL, ONLY. After all only what is JUST for ALL could and would be Truly Justified. All the other "justifications" are, literally, just "justifications" or attempts at "justifying" 'that' which can NOT be Truly 'justified' anyway. All adult human beings do this "justifying", of wrong actions, a LOT of the time and a LOT more than they realize. These "justifications" can be, and are only, "justified" by one or by some, as they are only for one or some. These "justifications" are NOT for nor by ALL. What is for and by ALL is just naturally JUST anyway. Andy by the way does NOT necessarily even need justification. It is just ALREADY internally KNOWN to be True and Just anyway.
What is in agreement with and by ALL is actually JUST True, Right, and Correct. By JUST, LOOKING AT
what IS the actual and real Truth of things this can be SEEN. What IS JUST for, and by, ALL IS what IS also True JUSTICE.
In the days of when this is written, just about ALL of what is said to be "just", "justifying", "justified", "justification", and "justice" IS just ONLY for a relatively few and NOT for ALL, at all really.
In the coming days, however,
what IS Truly Just will come about.
Now, to use the 'allowing children to die of starvation' example. There are NOT many adults who, in their own home, would allow a child to die from just not having enough food to eat. 'To allow that would be unjust', most adults would think, and AGREE. But how far away does a child have to be from you and/or your own home before you start allowing them to die just because they need SOME food? If a child is on your front porch or at your front door, then is all right/justified to allow them to die just because they need some food? or what about at the end of the driveway would you then let them die of starvation? or if they are on the corner at the end of your street would you drive past them everyday and let them die, or when they are in another neighborhood, or when they are in another city or country, is that when it is all right to ALLOW them to die?
When this is written, there ARE children dying of starvation EVERY day on this one and only home, called earth. This can be so easily prevented. Children do NOT need to die, but adult human beings ALLOW them to. So, what is the thinking within 'you', ALL adults, which ALLOWS you to ALLOW children to die, just because they are hungry and do NOT have enough food to eat? Are you having trouble to obtain enough food for yourself and so this is WHY children are dying?
What is it 'in agreement' individually with all of you ADULTS that ALLOWS you to ALLOW children to die? Obviously, 'you' the adult reader of this would NOT allow a child to die in your "own" (four walled) home but 'what is it' 'in agreement' within your views that ALLOWS you to ALLOW children to die, who are just "somewhat removed" from you? Why is one child more important to you than another child is?
What would be 'in agreement' collectively among ALL adult human beings, which would have MORE POWER which could and would completely ELIMINATE those previous "agreements" within yourselves individually, which ALLOWED you ALL to ALLOW such a thing to happen as LETTING children die before you?
What conflict is there, which is actually EXISTING, which is being IGNORED and what CHOICE could you ALL make that would PREVENT and STOP you ALL from ALLOWING children from dying, just because they NEED a little bit of food, in the future?
When, and IF, that
more powerful in agreement eliminates the previous agreement and those in the previous agreement comes to the forefront, then you will SEE for yourselves what actually CAN, and DOES, occur, with an agreement that IS by, and for, EVERY one, as One.