The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

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TimeSeeker
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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by TimeSeeker » Sat Oct 27, 2018 7:04 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:59 am
TimeSeeker wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:17 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 4:55 am
Principle of Charity??
I can't offer the principle of charity when what you preach is IMMORAL! What you preach is HARMFUL TO HUMANS.

It's a trolley problem! You preach to save 10 people wile letting 100 die from PREVENTABLE DISEASES!

Your ACTIONS are a NETT NEGATIVE of 90 HUMAN LIVES!!!
That I preached the acceptance of people being killed by mosquitoes?
Strawman.

You preach that premeditated death (terrorism, murder) is somehow and somewhy worse than 'natural' death ( http://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheet ... s-of-death ).

You teach people to ignore the proportion and scale of real-world problems in relation to one another. You steal people’s attention away from the big issues with fear-mongering even though death-by-terrorist is a few orders of magnitude less likely than a heart attack.

Because people are more scared of terrorism than 'natural causes of death' governments put far more focus on fighting terror (WAR!) than investing in science & medicine; or tackling the prevalent causes of death. You know - things which actually move the needle on SAVING HUMAN LIVES!

Democracy, baby! The WILL of the (fearful) people. People who think like you are the very reason why we have to deal with the on-going security theater: the practice of investing in countermeasures intended to provide the feeling of improved security while doing little or nothing to achieve it. ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_theater )

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:59 am
This is really stupid.
EXACTLY! I am trying to point out your ignorance, but the notion of opportunity cost is foreign to you. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opportunity_cost - that is why you keep ignoring the elephant in the room.

The PURPOSE of terrorism is not death. The PURPOSE of terrorism is mass-hysteria and over-reaction. So you are doing EXACTLY what the terrorists want you to do ;)

You fail to draw a distinction between PERCEIVED risk vs ACTUAL risk: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/ ... isk_2.html
We over-react to intentional actions, and under-react to accidents, abstract events, and natural phenomena.
That's why we worry more about anthrax (with an annual death toll of roughly zero) than influenza (with an annual death toll of a quarter-million to a half-million people). Influenza is a natural accident, anthrax is an intentional action, and the smallest action captures our attention in a way that the largest accident doesn't. If two airplanes had been hit by lightning and crashed into a New York skyscraper, few of us would be able to name the date on which it happened.
All you need to do in order to cure yourself of such ignorance is to abandon Kantian ethics in favour of consequentialism. Then you might actually start paying attention to the things that pose real, actual danger TO US and TO YOU.

Veritas Aequitas
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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Sun Oct 28, 2018 4:13 am

TimeSeeker wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 7:04 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:59 am
TimeSeeker wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:17 am

I can't offer the principle of charity when what you preach is IMMORAL! What you preach is HARMFUL TO HUMANS.

It's a trolley problem! You preach to save 10 people wile letting 100 die from PREVENTABLE DISEASES!

Your ACTIONS are a NETT NEGATIVE of 90 HUMAN LIVES!!!
That I preached the acceptance of people being killed by mosquitoes?
Strawman.

You preach that premeditated death (terrorism, murder) is somehow and somewhy worse than 'natural' death ( http://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheet ... s-of-death ).

You teach people to ignore the proportion and scale of real-world problems in relation to one another. You steal people’s attention away from the big issues with fear-mongering even though death-by-terrorist is a few orders of magnitude less likely than a heart attack.

Because people are more scared of terrorism than 'natural causes of death' governments put far more focus on fighting terror (WAR!) than investing in science & medicine; or tackling the prevalent causes of death. You know - things which actually move the needle on SAVING HUMAN LIVES!

Democracy, baby! The WILL of the (fearful) people. People who think like you are the very reason why we have to deal with the on-going security theater: the practice of investing in countermeasures intended to provide the feeling of improved security while doing little or nothing to achieve it. ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_theater )

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 6:59 am
This is really stupid.
EXACTLY! I am trying to point out your ignorance, but the notion of opportunity cost is foreign to you. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opportunity_cost - that is why you keep ignoring the elephant in the room.

The PURPOSE of terrorism is not death. The PURPOSE of terrorism is mass-hysteria and over-reaction. So you are doing EXACTLY what the terrorists want you to do ;)

You fail to draw a distinction between PERCEIVED risk vs ACTUAL risk: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/ ... isk_2.html
We over-react to intentional actions, and under-react to accidents, abstract events, and natural phenomena.
That's why we worry more about anthrax (with an annual death toll of roughly zero) than influenza (with an annual death toll of a quarter-million to a half-million people). Influenza is a natural accident, anthrax is an intentional action, and the smallest action captures our attention in a way that the largest accident doesn't. If two airplanes had been hit by lightning and crashed into a New York skyscraper, few of us would be able to name the date on which it happened.
All you need to do in order to cure yourself of such ignorance is to abandon Kantian ethics in favour of consequentialism. Then you might actually start paying attention to the things that pose real, actual danger TO US and TO YOU.
Strawman!

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by TimeSeeker » Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:32 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sun Oct 28, 2018 4:13 am
Strawman!
Not at all :)

I have already stated in the objective morality thread that I subscribe to the "No Harm" principle ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primum_non_nocere ) so even one human death is a nett negative. To accuse me of psychopathy is ad hominem.

Principles, logic, science - they are all TOOLS! Means to an end! You've put the tools before the humans! So are you projecting psychopathy?
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 4:55 am
Morally, even if one human is killed with premeditation, that is a negative to humanity not in terms of numbers but in terms of moral principles.
Why does premeditation/intent matter?!?

And the rest of it...
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Sat Oct 27, 2018 4:55 am
(ETC)
Btw, 33,000 attacks with fatalities imply there could be >150,000 deaths.

I believed [based on your un_empathic views] you are a confirmed psychopath.
Morally, even if one human is killed with premeditation, that is a negative to humanity not in terms of numbers but in terms of moral principles.

As such even with one premeditated killing, humanity must take it seriously and find out the root cause to prevent a gradual trend towards more premeditated killings.

Are you implying 6 millions Jews killed by Hitler/Nazism in comparison to 2.5 billion people on Earth then [1940-50] is not a net-negative [morally] evil act? So to you, since that 0.24% is so insignificant, we should not have bothered about it or may close an eye to killing another 50 million human being by other humans?
(...)
Yes, I reaffirm you are narrow-minded [I did not say “small minddedness”] in this case due to your lack of empathy for other human beings.

Note the difference,
-mosquitoes do not bite people with the intention to kill them with malaria,
-Islamic terrorists [human beings] kill non-believers [human beings] with intention as a divine duty obligated by a God [illusory].
(ETC)
Regardless of the numbers, both cases are negative and nett-negative to humanity in terms of diseases and morality respectively.
But the most important question of all: Is what you doing even working? Are you reducing/preventing any "religious harm", or are you just contributing to Islamophobia?

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am

TimeSeeker wrote:
Sun Oct 28, 2018 7:32 am
But the most important question of all: Is what you doing even working? Are you reducing/preventing any "religious harm", or are you just contributing to Islamophobia?
I have been accusing the current society as trending toward stupidity [in terms of bad subsumption of premises and bad judgment].
I presume you are familiar with set theory [maths] and its equivalent the Venn Diagrams.

If you throw the term "Islamophobia" around [at me] without applying critical thinking and rationality, you are indeed stupid.
  • A phobia is an extreme or irrational fear of or aversion to something.
    (google dictionary)
The justified critique of Islam - the ideology - is based on a genuine fears arising naturally on the evidently terrible evil and violent acts committed by SOME [from pool of 300 million !! :shock: ] evil prone Muslims being triggered and inspired by loads of evil laden verses in the holy text of Islam.

Thus justified negative criticisms cannot be termed "Islamophobic".
These criticisms as not based on irrational fears belonging to the "phobia" set.

In contrast, the term 'homophobic' is very appropriate because homosexuals [LBGTs] do not have any ideology directed to harm the nons. Thus is is very irrational to fear [critique, condemned, kill, etc.] homosexuals for what they are naturally [in most cases].

Another very insulting linguistic abuse is the term 'racism' when applied to religion!
These days critiques of Islam are termed racists and bigots. This is very stupid in terms of the Venn Diagram.
Are you reducing/preventing any "religious harm",
I have already explained in this thread why my focus is on evil and violent acts from religions, i.e.

Why I Focus on Religious-Based Evil Only?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=25284
which is obviously preventing evil and violent acts i.e. "religious harm."

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by TimeSeeker » Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:14 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am
I have been accusing the current society as trending toward stupidity [in terms of bad subsumption of premises and bad judgment].
I presume you are familiar with set theory [maths] and its equivalent the Venn Diagrams.
Then you need to look in the mirror. You fail to understand dynamics and consequences. You fail to consider the 2nd, 3rd and Nth order effects of your own actions if they were to become a categorical imperative. You fail to consider the law of unintended consequences. Colloquially termed side-effects. Kantian universalism doesn't work in practice.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am
If you throw the term "Islamophobia" around [at me] without applying critical thinking and rationality, you are indeed stupid.
And I am sure the standards of what entails "critical thinking" are your own. It's just that I am busy trying to convince you that your standards for "critical thinking" are rather low.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am
  • A phobia is an extreme or irrational fear of or aversion to something.
    (google dictionary)
The justified critique of Islam - the ideology - is based on a genuine fears arising naturally on the evidently terrible evil and violent acts committed by SOME [from pool of 300 million !! :shock: ] evil prone Muslims being triggered and inspired by loads of evil laden verses in the holy text of Islam.

Thus justified negative criticisms cannot be termed "Islamophobic".
These criticisms as not based on irrational fears belonging to the "phobia" set.
1. Lets not call it "Islamophobia". Lets call it a hasty over-generalization ( https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/too ... ralization ).
2. The pool is 1.5 billion, not 300 million.
3. You have grave misunderstanding of probability theory and p-values ( https://www.dummies.com/education/math/ ... ical-data/ )
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am
In contrast, the term 'homophobic' is very appropriate because homosexuals [LBGTs] do not have any ideology directed to harm the nons. Thus is is very irrational to fear [critique, condemned, kill, etc.] homosexuals for what they are naturally [in most cases].

Another very insulting linguistic abuse is the term 'racism' when applied to religion!
These days critiques of Islam are termed racists and bigots. This is very stupid in terms of the Venn Diagram.
Insulted or otherwise, you have a grave misunderstanding of statistics.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:25 am
Are you reducing/preventing any "religious harm",
I have already explained in this thread why my focus is on evil and violent acts from religions, i.e.

Why I Focus on Religious-Based Evil Only?
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=25284
which is obviously preventing evil and violent acts i.e. "religious harm."
I am going to put this in simple terms for you. You are making a causal claim that "religion causes harm" even though correlation is NOT causation (again - statistics 101 stuff). Lets for a second suppose that it's true and lets even suppose that what you are doing against "religious harm" is working.

If your quest against "religious harm' prevents X violent acts BUT causes Y violent acts by breeding hasty generalization against the religious who do not resort to 'religious harm' e.g If Y > X then YOUR ACTIONS are a nett negative to society.

So, how many 'religious harms' have you prevented?

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am

TimeSeeker wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:14 am
Lets for a second suppose that it's true and lets even suppose that what you are doing against "religious harm" is working.

If your quest against "religious harm' prevents X violent acts BUT causes Y violent acts by breeding hasty generalization against the religious who do not resort to 'religious harm' e.g If Y > X then YOUR ACTIONS are a nett negative to society.

So, how many 'religious harms' have you prevented?
Note there are two aspects to this;
  • 1. The theory 'certain religions [as justified] are directly responsible for harm.

    2. The solution and its implementation to prevent further religious harm.
I have always stated, my theory is true and the corrective actions taken must incorporate fool proof mechanisms, i.e. no side effects that will generate any addition negativity. Note the Principles of Poka Yoke,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poka-yoke
Poka-yoke (ポカヨケ, [poka joke]) is a Japanese term that means "mistake-proofing" or "inadvertent error prevention". The key word in the second translation, often omitted, is "inadvertent".
It was originally described as baka-yoke, but as this means "fool-proofing" (or "idiot-proofing") the name was changed to the milder poka-yoke.

There is no poka-yoke solution that protects against an operator's sabotage, but sabotage is a rare behavior among people.[1]

A poka-yoke is any mechanism in any process that helps an equipment operator avoid (yokeru) mistakes (poka). Its purpose is to eliminate product defects by preventing, correcting, or drawing attention to human errors as they occur.[2]
The pool is 300 million Muslims with active evil tendencies.
I did not elaborate earlier.
There are 1.5 billion Muslims but I have conservatively estimated 20% are unfortunately born with an active evil tendency to commit a range of evil and violent acts.

Note this is going off topic re this OP.
I intend to raise an OP re "Why Certain Religions are Inherently Evil and Violent?"

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by TimeSeeker » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:21 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
I have always stated, my theory is true and the corrective actions taken must incorporate fool proof mechanisms, i.e. no side effects that will generate any addition negativity.
How do you propose to mitigate side-effects in a system where you have no absolute control? There are no such things as "fool proof mechanisms". That is precisely WHY side-effects happen! That is WHY we also call them UNINTENDED consequences ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequences )

It is because we are stupid and the world is complex - we can't calculate all the consequences of our actions.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
Note the Principles of Poka Yoke,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poka-yoke
Poka-yoke (ポカヨケ, [poka joke]) is a Japanese term that means "mistake-proofing" or "inadvertent error prevention". The key word in the second translation, often omitted, is "inadvertent".
It was originally described as baka-yoke, but as this means "fool-proofing" (or "idiot-proofing") the name was changed to the milder poka-yoke.

There is no poka-yoke solution that protects against an operator's sabotage, but sabotage is a rare behavior among people.[1]

A poka-yoke is any mechanism in any process that helps an equipment operator avoid (yokeru) mistakes (poka). Its purpose is to eliminate product defects by preventing, correcting, or drawing attention to human errors as they occur.[2]
Poka Yoke == Hanlon's razor. There is no fool-proof mechanism to ignorance e.g the Dunning-Kruger effect either.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
The pool is 300 million Muslims with active evil tendencies.
I did not elaborate earlier.
There are 1.5 billion Muslims but I have conservatively estimated 20% are unfortunately born with an active evil tendency to commit a range of evil and violent acts.
How did you estimate this number? Was there any empirical rigour or did you thumb-suck it? What ASSUMPTIONS did you have to make in order to calculate it; and what attempts at falsification have you tried so far?

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:04 am

TimeSeeker wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:21 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
I have always stated, my theory is true and the corrective actions taken must incorporate fool proof mechanisms, i.e. no side effects that will generate any addition negativity.
How do you propose to mitigate side-effects in a system where you have no absolute control? There are no such things as "fool proof mechanisms". That is precisely WHY side-effects happen! That is WHY we also call them UNINTENDED consequences ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequences )

It is because we are stupid and the world is complex - we can't calculate all the consequences of our actions.
There are no absolute fool proof mechanisms.
The point here is to establish the optimal fool proof mechanisms as opposed being ignorant and indifferent to fool proofing one's actions.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
Note the Principles of Poka Yoke,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poka-yoke
Poka-yoke (ポカヨケ, [poka joke]) is a Japanese term that means "mistake-proofing" or "inadvertent error prevention". The key word in the second translation, often omitted, is "inadvertent".
It was originally described as baka-yoke, but as this means "fool-proofing" (or "idiot-proofing") the name was changed to the milder poka-yoke.

There is no poka-yoke solution that protects against an operator's sabotage, but sabotage is a rare behavior among people.[1]

A poka-yoke is any mechanism in any process that helps an equipment operator avoid (yokeru) mistakes (poka). Its purpose is to eliminate product defects by preventing, correcting, or drawing attention to human errors as they occur.[2]
Poka Yoke == Hanlon's razor. There is no fool-proof mechanism to ignorance e.g the Dunning-Kruger effect either.
Nope, the are not the same.
Poka Yoke is a deliberate implementation of a full system to ensure fool proofing. The principles of Kaizen are installed to ensure there is continuous improvements to the results.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
The pool is 300 million Muslims with active evil tendencies.
I did not elaborate earlier.
There are 1.5 billion Muslims but I have conservatively estimated 20% are unfortunately born with an active evil tendency to commit a range of evil and violent acts.
How did you estimate this number? Was there any empirical rigour or did you thumb-suck it? What ASSUMPTIONS did you have to make in order to calculate it?
I have defined 'evil' elsewhere.
There is a range of evil ranging from genocides [95/100] evilness to lying/petty crimes [5/100].

Out of 100% of normal [not mentally sick] people, what is the % of people who will lie in their lifetime.
It has to be more than 50% and in reality >80%.
Therefore to state that 20% of people are likely to commit evil [as defined] acts [reserved for those of higher degrees] is very conservative. QED!

Note you are in a state of resistance for resisting sake.
That is why you are not able to think deeper and wider.
When you are resisting [defense, fight or flight, etc.] your lower and mid-brain will be more active than your thinking brain.
To me it is a waste of time discussing with those with a high-resistance state.

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by TimeSeeker » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:59 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:04 am
There are no absolute fool proof mechanisms.
The point here is to establish the optimal fool proof mechanisms as opposed being ignorant and indifferent to fool proofing one's actions.
Ah, you say 'optimal' so you speak of optimisation. What are your optimisation criteria? How do you MEASURE success and failure as you iterate?
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:04 am
Poka Yoke is a deliberate implementation of a full system to ensure fool proofing. The principles of Kaizen are installed to ensure there is continuous improvements to the results.
6-sigma. Iterative improvement. Evolution. Call it what you will. It is defect minimisation.

The problem with your approach is that you first have you identify the defect! e.g the ROOT CAUSE.

Which you haven't done.
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
I have defined 'evil' elsewhere.
There is a range of evil ranging from genocides [95/100] evilness to lying/petty crimes [5/100].
So you have excluded all of the TOP 10 CAUSES OF DEATH from the list of 'evil' things....

That is - you have constrained your thinking only to INTENTIONAL harm. WH?!?!?!?
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
Note you are in a state of resistance for resisting sake.
That is why you are not able to think deeper and wider.
When you are resisting [defense, fight or flight, etc.] your lower and mid-brain will be more active than your thinking brain.
To me it is a waste of time discussing with those with a high-resistance state.
Well. That's ironic. To me - you are in an 'I am right about this' state. That is - nothing can convince that you are wrong. That is - your belief is unfalsifiable.

That is. Nothing can convince you that you are guilty of iatrogenesis. So - you are no better than the illness you attempt to cure.

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Eodnhoj7 » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:13 pm

From a personal note, I have known a few muslims in my lifetime and from my experiences the culture and religion should be respected. To argue an extremist stance against the muslims in the respect they are all extremists is not just illogical but reflects the majority of the human condition whether religious or not as having the same condition of violence, etc. that is not strictly limited to the muslim population.

In many respects they are more virtuous and well balanced than their western religious counterparts.

This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason.

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:15 am

Eodnhoj7 wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:13 pm
From a personal note, I have known a few muslims in my lifetime and from my experiences the culture and religion should be respected. To argue an extremist stance against the muslims in the respect they are all extremists is not just illogical but reflects the majority of the human condition whether religious or not as having the same condition of violence, etc. that is not strictly limited to the muslim population.

In many respects they are more virtuous and well balanced than their western religious counterparts.

This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason.
Anti-Muslims??
Note this OP that I raised;

Do Not Blame Muslims!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=24842
In addition, we should NOT even lay the ultimate blame on those unfortunate Muslims who committed the evil acts.

Instead I have always stated, the ultimate root cause and primary blame of Islamic-related evil acts must be directed to the evil elements within the ideology of Islam.

Islam is Laden with Evil Elements
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25185

Can you prove to me Islam is a Religion of Peace?

Point is you lack intellectual honesty and integrity because you concluded without evidence, i.e. having a thorough understanding [not necessary agree] of the premises you relied upon, i.e. the Quran as the core of Islam.

Prove to me you are not an intellectual bastard in regard to this specific issue?

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:48 am

TimeSeeker wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:59 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:16 am
Note you are in a state of resistance for resisting sake.
That is why you are not able to think deeper and wider.
When you are resisting [defense, fight or flight, etc.] your lower and mid-brain will be more active than your thinking brain.
To me it is a waste of time discussing with those with a high-resistance state.
Well. That's ironic. To me - you are in an 'I am right about this' state. That is - nothing can convince that you are wrong. That is - your belief is unfalsifiable.

That is. Nothing can convince you that you are guilty of iatrogenesis. So - you are no better than the illness you attempt to cure.
Where are your evidences and arguments?

I have been in this business for a long time.
When I started long ago I was bashed left and right by the giants of Philosophy Forums.
Since then I have changed my views, e.g. from being homophobe to acceptance, from theist to non-theists, secondary to primary sources of famous Philosophers, etc. and I took great steps to cover whatever knowledge gaps I had plus ensuring all my views are supported by evidence and critical arguments.
Show me a case where I have failed to produce evidences/arguments or in the direction of arguments and evidences?

You? you need to dig deeper and wider with reference to Philosophy [since this is a Philosophy Forum].

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Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Eodnhoj7 » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:26 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:15 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:13 pm
From a personal note, I have known a few muslims in my lifetime and from my experiences the culture and religion should be respected. To argue an extremist stance against the muslims in the respect they are all extremists is not just illogical but reflects the majority of the human condition whether religious or not as having the same condition of violence, etc. that is not strictly limited to the muslim population.

In many respects they are more virtuous and well balanced than their western religious counterparts.

This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason.
Anti-Muslims??
Note this OP that I raised;

Do Not Blame Muslims!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=24842
In addition, we should NOT even lay the ultimate blame on those unfortunate Muslims who committed the evil acts.

Instead I have always stated, the ultimate root cause and primary blame of Islamic-related evil acts must be directed to the evil elements within the ideology of Islam.

Islam is Laden with Evil Elements
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25185

Can you prove to me Islam is a Religion of Peace?

Point is you lack intellectual honesty and integrity because you concluded without evidence, i.e. having a thorough understanding [not necessary agree] of the premises you relied upon, i.e. the Quran as the core of Islam.

Prove to me you are not an intellectual bastard in regard to this specific issue?
Howdy...err...John is not here for the moment...my name is...well that does not matter...I have many names...

I always liked how John used the "..." dot, dot, dot...haha...what a clever self righteous little fucker...dot, dot, dot...seriously though...what the fuck is that supposed to mean?

So on to business of course...

A notification popped up on my screen...is It "my" screen...ehh...whatever...A number...not a name. I thougnt it was very fitting...I like that... numbering people...

Hmm... I think I will throw in, out of my deep respect for John of course... A few more

"...... ...... ......"

Very fitting actually...

I read the first few sentences...just to say I did...and this is what I say oh "man of justice":

I do not have to prove anything to a blip in time...for time grown old is its own proof. You will come and you will go, like a fading spark that burns out under the guilt of not being bright enough...and "oh the guilt" of not being strong or wise enough...dot, dot, dot, hehe...

I know it, it is really a heavy burden seeing all the injustice...just keep doing what you are doing and I am sure it will all work out...

There is a void, it burns under a black flame you cannot comprehend until you experience it for yourself...and the intensity of it is...what is the word..."crucifying?"...it will do...truly a deep spiritual experience if I do say so myself...dot, dot, dot...hehe...haha...whatever...

There is no light, and the burning is beyond any conception of heat or cold. Inside and outside tear through the other...one becomes one with the self...whatever the fuck that is...dot, dot, dot...

There is no beginning or end to it...and it extends to a recess beyond the mind...as a matter of fact it consumes it in all truth...

The screaming and yelling gives good company comsidering "it ks not good for man to be alone". They shriek and scream in total hopelessness...just pure terror without end...way more interesting than a fireworks show...

Words are pulled apart at the seems, reason holds no sway...nor purpose...

One is pulled through the self, twisting and contorting into all sorts of..."shapes?"...that word will do...


You may want to leave your purpose at the door way...it will do you no good...


Welcome son...we are waiting for you...to join us....until then...good job...enjoy your stay in the mean time.

In the mean time it will be interesting to see what John has to say...clever little bastard...I am going to have one hell of a time ripping him apart in due course...

Dot, dot, dot...rofl...

What a fucking joke.

Veritas Aequitas
Posts: 2656
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:41 am

Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Veritas Aequitas » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:34 am

Eodnhoj7 wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:26 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:15 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:13 pm
From a personal note, I have known a few muslims in my lifetime and from my experiences the culture and religion should be respected. To argue an extremist stance against the muslims in the respect they are all extremists is not just illogical but reflects the majority of the human condition whether religious or not as having the same condition of violence, etc. that is not strictly limited to the muslim population.

In many respects they are more virtuous and well balanced than their western religious counterparts.

This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason.
Anti-Muslims??
Note this OP that I raised;

Do Not Blame Muslims!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=24842
In addition, we should NOT even lay the ultimate blame on those unfortunate Muslims who committed the evil acts.

Instead I have always stated, the ultimate root cause and primary blame of Islamic-related evil acts must be directed to the evil elements within the ideology of Islam.

Islam is Laden with Evil Elements
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25185

Can you prove to me Islam is a Religion of Peace?

Point is you lack intellectual honesty and integrity because you concluded without evidence, i.e. having a thorough understanding [not necessary agree] of the premises you relied upon, i.e. the Quran as the core of Islam.

Prove to me you are not an intellectual bastard in regard to this specific issue?
Howdy...err...John is not here for the moment...my name is...well that does not matter...I have many names...

I always liked how John used the "..." dot, dot, dot...haha...what a clever self righteous little fucker...dot, dot, dot...seriously though...what the fuck is that supposed to mean?

So on to business of course...

A notification popped up on my screen...is It "my" screen...ehh...whatever...A number...not a name. I thougnt it was very fitting...I like that... numbering people...

Hmm... I think I will throw in, out of my deep respect for John of course... A few more

"...... ...... ......"

Very fitting actually...

I read the first few sentences...just to say I did...and this is what I say oh "man of justice":

I do not have to prove anything to a blip in time...for time grown old is its own proof. You will come and you will go, like a fading spark that burns out under the guilt of not being bright enough...and "oh the guilt" of not being strong or wise enough...dot, dot, dot, hehe...

I know it, it is really a heavy burden seeing all the injustice...just keep doing what you are doing and I am sure it will all work out...

There is a void, it burns under a black flame you cannot comprehend until you experience it for yourself...and the intensity of it is...what is the word..."crucifying?"...it will do...truly a deep spiritual experience if I do say so myself...dot, dot, dot...hehe...haha...whatever...

There is no light, and the burning is beyond any conception of heat or cold. Inside and outside tear through the other...one becomes one with the self...whatever the fuck that is...dot, dot, dot...

There is no beginning or end to it...and it extends to a recess beyond the mind...as a matter of fact it consumes it in all truth...

The screaming and yelling gives good company comsidering "it ks not good for man to be alone". They shriek and scream in total hopelessness...just pure terror without end...way more interesting than a fireworks show...

Words are pulled apart at the seems, reason holds no sway...nor purpose...

One is pulled through the self, twisting and contorting into all sorts of..."shapes?"...that word will do...


You may want to leave your purpose at the door way...it will do you no good...


Welcome son...we are waiting for you...to join us....until then...good job...enjoy your stay in the mean time.

In the mean time it will be interesting to see what John has to say...clever little bastard...I am going to have one hell of a time ripping him apart in due course...

Dot, dot, dot...rofl...

What a fucking joke.
Who is ranting now, evidence as above.

You accused me of the following;
  • "This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason."
I have provided you the evidences and arguments with reason.
Give me proper evidence and argument to support your case?

User avatar
Eodnhoj7
Posts: 5038
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:18 am

Re: The Negation of the Self is the Actualization of the Self.

Post by Eodnhoj7 » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:43 am

Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:34 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:26 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote:
Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:15 am

Anti-Muslims??
Note this OP that I raised;

Do Not Blame Muslims!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=24842
In addition, we should NOT even lay the ultimate blame on those unfortunate Muslims who committed the evil acts.

Instead I have always stated, the ultimate root cause and primary blame of Islamic-related evil acts must be directed to the evil elements within the ideology of Islam.

Islam is Laden with Evil Elements
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25185

Can you prove to me Islam is a Religion of Peace?

Point is you lack intellectual honesty and integrity because you concluded without evidence, i.e. having a thorough understanding [not necessary agree] of the premises you relied upon, i.e. the Quran as the core of Islam.

Prove to me you are not an intellectual bastard in regard to this specific issue?
Howdy...err...John is not here for the moment...my name is...well that does not matter...I have many names...

I always liked how John used the "..." dot, dot, dot...haha...what a clever self righteous little fucker...dot, dot, dot...seriously though...what the fuck is that supposed to mean?

So on to business of course...

A notification popped up on my screen...is It "my" screen...ehh...whatever...A number...not a name. I thougnt it was very fitting...I like that... numbering people...

Hmm... I think I will throw in, out of my deep respect for John of course... A few more

"...... ...... ......"

Very fitting actually...

I read the first few sentences...just to say I did...and this is what I say oh "man of justice":

I do not have to prove anything to a blip in time...for time grown old is its own proof. You will come and you will go, like a fading spark that burns out under the guilt of not being bright enough...and "oh the guilt" of not being strong or wise enough...dot, dot, dot, hehe...

I know it, it is really a heavy burden seeing all the injustice...just keep doing what you are doing and I am sure it will all work out...

There is a void, it burns under a black flame you cannot comprehend until you experience it for yourself...and the intensity of it is...what is the word..."crucifying?"...it will do...truly a deep spiritual experience if I do say so myself...dot, dot, dot...hehe...haha...whatever...

There is no light, and the burning is beyond any conception of heat or cold. Inside and outside tear through the other...one becomes one with the self...whatever the fuck that is...dot, dot, dot...

There is no beginning or end to it...and it extends to a recess beyond the mind...as a matter of fact it consumes it in all truth...

The screaming and yelling gives good company comsidering "it ks not good for man to be alone". They shriek and scream in total hopelessness...just pure terror without end...way more interesting than a fireworks show...

Words are pulled apart at the seems, reason holds no sway...nor purpose...

One is pulled through the self, twisting and contorting into all sorts of..."shapes?"...that word will do...


You may want to leave your purpose at the door way...it will do you no good...


Welcome son...we are waiting for you...to join us....until then...good job...enjoy your stay in the mean time.

In the mean time it will be interesting to see what John has to say...clever little bastard...I am going to have one hell of a time ripping him apart in due course...

Dot, dot, dot...rofl...

What a fucking joke.
Who is ranting now, evidence as above.

You accused me of the following;
  • "This anti-muslim rant veritas premises the majority of his viewpoint and argument on is...boring as there is nothing new to it due to its absence of reason."
I have provided you the evidences and arguments with reason.
Give me proper evidence and argument to support your case?
What evidence have you or John provided? What do either of you know of evidence? Why bother with it...? You feel what you feel, the other one feels what he feels...And that is it.

Dot, dot, dot

Isn't it fun for you to feel angry? That is what matters...enjoy it...let it set you free...

John can have fun with...does he ever have fun? Probably should hurry up with that too...dot, dot, dot...

Me personally...just keep doing what you are doing...

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