Race versus culture

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Londoner
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Londoner » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:44 pm

Seleucus wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:20 pm
Evola held this view of spiritual racism that basically rejects concern with genetic or material race... I expect that it is a rather rare case when race and culture are ever really out of sync.
What does 'rejects concern' mean? That they think there are such things as 'genetic or material race', but they choose to ignore them? Because that does not seem to be the case with you, going by your opening post.

And if 'spiritual racism' has nothing to do with 'genetic and material race' (which you are anyway supposed to be rejecting), then why would they ever be in sync?
Political correctness/critical theory is the seeing of everything through the dynamic of drama triangle.
What is a 'dynamic of drama triangle'? What on earth does that mean?
For those who deny race, it's a very deprived way of looking at the world. There are only flowers, no blue bells, no tiger lily, no Japanese or Balinese Kambojas.
So do blue bells belong to a different 'spiritual race' than tiger lilies? Does each type of flower belong to a separate 'spiritual race' or can they also be lumped together as 'genetically Indo-European' flowers or 'Orientals'? And is the spiritual race of a rhododendron bush also rarely out of sync with its material race, or is that just humans?

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Seleucus
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Seleucus » Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:48 pm

Londoner wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:44 pm
Seleucus wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:20 pm
Evola held this view of spiritual racism that basically rejects concern with genetic or material race... I expect that it is a rather rare case when race and culture are ever really out of sync.
What does 'rejects concern' mean? That they think there are such things as 'genetic or material race', but they choose to ignore them?
Read some Evola... :roll:

http://www.cakravartin.com/wordpress/wp ... -World.pdf
And if 'spiritual racism' has nothing to do with 'genetic and material race' (which you are anyway supposed to be rejecting), then why would they ever be in sync?
For example, Malay people are in large Muslim with an underlay of Hind-Buddhism, and beneath that the neolithic culture of the animist Austronesian migration, you'll mostly find Malay people with this spiritual heritage, not many Africans, excepting the Malagasy perhaps. Another way of putting it, is Korean Christians, Filipino Christians and European Christians don't really have much more in common spiritually than name, their Christianity is going to be an expression of the underlying racial psychology and spirituality.
What is a 'dynamic of drama triangle'? What on earth does that mean?
Try googling for "drama triangle"... :roll:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpman_drama_triangle
So do blue bells belong to a different 'spiritual race' than tiger lilies? Does each type of flower belong to a separate 'spiritual race' or can they also be lumped together as 'genetically Indo-European' flowers or 'Orientals'? And is the spiritual race of a rhododendron bush also rarely out of sync with its material race, or is that just humans?
I doubt flowers are conscious. At least above and beyond that sense that we might say that the whole Universe is fundamentally spirit.

commonsense
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by commonsense » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:10 pm

davidm wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:09 pm
Seleucus wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:48 pm
Who are you gonna throw your chips in with when there's an incongruity? Your race, or your culture?
How about throwing your chips in with the human race?
Acrophobia might have been a vital adaptation for prehistoric humankind. Without it, the preservation of the human species could have been at risk from fatal falls from cliffs. Although human beings have evolved, there are still some who harbor a vestigial fear of heights.

It must have been just as significant for the propagation of the species that humanoids not breed with inhuman animals. Xenophobia might have served well in this regard in prehistory. It is a fact today that infants have an early fear of faces unlike their nurturer's. For some, a fear of the less familiar adheres throughout their lives.

The cause of not throwing chips in with the human race is fear.
Last edited by commonsense on Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:15 pm

commonsense wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:10 pm
davidm wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:09 pm
Seleucus wrote:
Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:48 pm
Who are you gonna throw your chips in with when there's an incongruity? Your race, or your culture?
How about throwing your chips in with the human race?
Acrophobia might have been a vital adaptation for prehistoric humankind. Without it, the preservation of the human species could have been at risk from fatal falls from cliffs. Although human beings have evolved, there are still some who harbor a vestigial fear of heights.

It must have been just as significant for the propagation of the species that humanoids not breed with inhuman animals. Xenophobia might have served well in this regard in prehistory. It is a fact today that infants have an early fear of faces unlike their nurturer's. For some, a fear of the less familiar adheres throughout their lives.

The cause of not throwing your chips in with the human race is fear.
I suppose next the PC mind-police will be calling it 'racism' that most people are attracted to their own race (and if they can think of a better word then by all means present it). Sorry, but I fail to see how 'ethnicity' is any different or more acceptable and 'politically sound'. Is someone racist for finding Chinese or Indian men sexually unappealing? By the same token, Indians and Chinese nearly always marry each other, and tend to be very unhappy when their children do otherwise. The Japanese find it even more unacceptable. Dare I mention 'honour' killings? But of course this must never be called racism, because according to the PC code of ethics, those races,ethnicities? are inherently inferior anyway and therefore must be indulgently placed in the 'things we must be tolerant of' basket.
I can hear the copy-paste 'reasoning' already. Ahhh, but this is merely 'social conditioning'. With the 'correct' indoctrination from preschool, there will be no such thing as racial (ethnical) preference and humans will all co-exist in a loving global orgy of inter-human sex and procreation. I hate to break this to them, but humans are going to have sex with who they want to have sex with regardless of parents, conditioning, culture, blah, blah...... Even if race is 'cosmetic', does that make it 'nonexistent'? Not really. It just means it's 'cosmetic', and I'm pretty sure that most humans have always thought of it as just that anyway (without even thinking about what they are thinking about).
Last edited by vegetariantaxidermy on Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Londoner
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Londoner » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:35 pm

Seleucus wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:48 pm

Read some Evola... :roll:
If what you have written so far is derived from Evola you have failed to inspire me to want to go to the source.
For example, Malay people are in large Muslim with an underlay of Hind-Buddhism, and beneath that the neolithic culture of the animist Austronesian migration, you'll mostly find Malay people with this spiritual heritage, not many Africans, excepting the Malagasy perhaps. Another way of putting it, is Korean Christians, Filipino Christians and European Christians don't really have much more in common spiritually than name, their Christianity is going to be an expression of the underlying racial psychology and spirituality.
So we have a 'racial psychology' to add to 'spiritual race' and 'genetic and material race'. Are there any more types of race you would like to bring up?
Try googling for "drama triangle"... :roll:
Somebody has drawn a diagram so it must be meaningful.
Me: So do blue bells belong to a different 'spiritual race' than tiger lilies? Does each type of flower belong to a separate 'spiritual race' or can they also be lumped together as 'genetically Indo-European' flowers or 'Orientals'? And is the spiritual race of a rhododendron bush also rarely out of sync with its material race, or is that just humans?

I doubt flowers are conscious. At least above and beyond that sense that we might say that the whole Universe is fundamentally spirit.
OK. You say that those who deny 'race' cannot distinguish between different types of flowers. But this is not 'genetic and material race' but 'spiritual race'. So when you remark 'I doubt flowers are conscious' are you saying that flowers do not have spiritual race' because they are not conscious? (Am I also safe to assume that flowers do not have a racial psychology?)

You helpfully add that the universe is fundamentally spirit. But we gather that flowers do not have spiritual race because they are not conscious, so since the universe is spirit are you saying the universe is conscious? If it is, that gives you a problem. Since the universe is spirit, then everything in the universe e.g. all the people, all the flowers, must have the same spirit. So how could there be different spiritual races ?

Or perhaps there are are alternate universes, that belong to different spiritual races? So that two people standing next to each other may belong to different universes?

Please explain further. It is so interesting.

Belinda
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Belinda » Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:25 pm

Seleucus, would it perhaps be better if you stopped referring to race when what you mean is ethnicity?

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:31 pm

Belinda wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:25 pm
Seleucus, would it perhaps be better if you stopped referring to race when what you mean is ethnicity?
What difference does it make? So he doesn't like people who are cosmetically different from him. Does it really make any difference WHAT he calls them? Is anyone but a biologist thinking of biology when they think 'race'? I suppose the medical world is being racist when it talks about certain 'cosmetically differing' groups of people being susceptible to cerain illnesses. It's all really beyond pathetic.

thedoc
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by thedoc » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:14 pm

It would probably upset some people to be told that all human beings are one race even if they are different ethnicity. (Race and species mean just about the same thing.) It would probably upset them even more if you told them that all humans evolved from the same common ancestor as the other apes and the monkeys.

thedoc
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by thedoc » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:25 pm

commonsense wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:10 pm
The cause of not throwing chips in with the human race is fear.
That is certainly one factor. Sorry for this, but sometimes a song says it better than I can.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnY-Ft7F9eo

Dubious
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Dubious » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:28 pm

thedoc wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:14 pm
It would probably upset some people to be told that all human beings are one race even if they are different ethnicity. (Race and species mean just about the same thing.) It would probably upset them even more if you told them that all humans evolved from the same common ancestor as the other apes and the monkeys.
...and the only reason apes and monkeys are still around is that god needs a spare in case man screws up.

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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:34 pm

thedoc wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:14 pm
It would probably upset some people to be told that all human beings are one race even if they are different ethnicity. (Race and species mean just about the same thing.) It would probably upset them even more if you told them that all humans evolved from the same common ancestor as the other apes and the monkeys.
But they certainly aren't all the same culture. And differing culture often comes hand in hand with 'cosmetic differences'. Even when it doesn't humans still don't like each other very much. Think of the different branches of christianity/islam, christians and those who don't share their particular superstition, the Indian caste system, white supremacists and everyone else, Canadians and Americans, Americans and the rest of the world, Republicans and Democrats... etc.etc.

thedoc
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by thedoc » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:57 pm

Dubious wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:28 pm
...and the only reason apes and monkeys are still around is that god needs a spare in case man screws up.
Too late. I guess we should be waiting for the asteroid, a big one, - no, that would wipe the apes out too, - it doesn't matter, God can fix it?

thedoc
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by thedoc » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:59 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:34 pm
Humans still don't like each other very much.
You should fit right in, you don't like anyone.

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Arising_uk
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Arising_uk » Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:08 pm

Seleucus wrote:What do you think? ...
I think by an' large it's none of my business but if I was to act it would be on the side that wasn't slaughtering and raping women and children as my starter.
Would you accept someone who is the same race but of an alien culture over someone who is another race but shares your language and religious beliefs? ...
I accept people on their behavior towards me and mine regardless of race or creed.
The truth is of course that language, race, and religion tend to align, but in cases where they don't?
How is this a truth?

What necessary links are there between a race, a language and a religion?

Dubious
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Re: Race versus culture

Post by Dubious » Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:13 pm

thedoc wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:57 pm
Dubious wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:28 pm
...and the only reason apes and monkeys are still around is that god needs a spare in case man screws up.
Too late. I guess we should be waiting for the asteroid, a big one, - no, that would wipe the apes out too, - it doesn't matter, God can fix it?
Maybe not too late; apes and monkeys are still around! He can put them in charge instead; that way humans can be more confident about their own future and that of the planet as a whole.

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