Philosophy Now Forum

commonsense wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:50 pmHowever, inasmuch as it can be said that ignorance is bliss, thinking skills interfere with happiness. This would certainly result in diminished satisfaction with life.

Furthermore, (faulty) thinking is a necessary ingredient for many mental health issues. This, too, can make for a decreased level of functionality and a miserable existence.

On balance, philosophy is harmful.

A harsh summation.

I have to say that ignorance is far from bliss for me. Rather, philosophy (and science - I don't draw much of a line personally) acts like cognitive therapy for me, helping to raise my vision above the froth and messiness of constant surface change and to consider the deeper and broader aspects of reality, along with a realisation of the relative triviality of that which we think important.

For me, it's a bit like trying to achieve a deep deathbed perspective of life - without the dying, of course

JasonPalmer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:09 am I often meet philosophy graduates who work in dead end jobs with much repetitive and mind numbing work, it seems that a degree in philosophy is not much use, apart from to teach it, but those jobs are less and less.

Having developed the mind, it is then crushed by the capitalist systems desire for specialisation and skills.

so.....read the magazine but forget doing it for a living ?

Philosophy, .. real philosophy, is about discovering who you are, it's hard work undoing all the hard work that was put in you, (indoctrination) by other people.

When that work is completed, one simply doesn't care about competition or the desire to be accepted or acknowledged for ones skills.

One simply does what one likes, even if that means staring at four walls all day long for the rest of their life. On the other hand if one desires to become a brain surgeon, then go for it, what's stopping you, you create your own reality.

.

Philosophy doesn't destroy lives,. People destroy lives.

Omg...I'm a Republican!

Greta wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:13 am

commonsense wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:50 pmHowever, inasmuch as it can be said that ignorance is bliss, thinking skills interfere with happiness. This would certainly result in diminished satisfaction with life.

Furthermore, (faulty) thinking is a necessary ingredient for many mental health issues. This, too, can make for a decreased level of functionality and a miserable existence.

On balance, philosophy is harmful.

A harsh summation.

I have to say that ignorance is far from bliss for me. Rather, philosophy (and science - I don't draw much of a line personally) acts like cognitive therapy for me, helping to raise my vision above the froth and messiness of constant surface change and to consider the deeper and broader aspects of reality, along with a realisation of the relative triviality of that which we think important.

For me, it's a bit like trying to achieve a deep deathbed perspective of life - without the dying, of course

But then surely it helps to accept dying, that is depending upon one's depth in philosophy. Once the universe unfolds in our minds eye, it's beauty shines, it's enough to be thankful for the time we've had to absorb the truth of it all, it's complexity; yes, definitely beautiful.

I agree that it's also true that to rid ourselves of our flawed programming by those that are the most terrified of dying is paramount, and thankfully can only be the case if one truly delves philosophy's depths. Philosophy is the father, science it's progeny, the clearest picture is heeding it all, surely a monumental task, but just as surely worth it!

'Knowing' definitely illuminates realities complexity, but I wouldn't want to have it any other way, I mean who really wants to waste their only life living a lie??? Basically a fool. At least it seems to be our only life, that is at least with respect to our consciousness. That only our elements, that we've temporally borrowed, shall continue ad-infinitum, unfortunately, doesn't lend much comfort, because most of us true philosophers, want to see and learn forever. Or at least until such time that all can completely be known.

There is one thing that plagues me as I use the tools of philosophy though, and that's watching seemingly helplessly at the fools steer the human ship. Thus clouding the vision of the young, including all those older that have yet to be acquainted with the wisdom contained in a true philosophical quest.

Peace, my friends!

SpheresOfBalance wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 12:38 am

Greta wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:13 am

commonsense wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:50 pmHowever, inasmuch as it can be said that ignorance is bliss, thinking skills interfere with happiness. This would certainly result in diminished satisfaction with life.

Furthermore, (faulty) thinking is a necessary ingredient for many mental health issues. This, too, can make for a decreased level of functionality and a miserable existence.

On balance, philosophy is harmful.

A harsh summation.

I have to say that ignorance is far from bliss for me. Rather, philosophy (and science - I don't draw much of a line personally) acts like cognitive therapy for me, helping to raise my vision above the froth and messiness of constant surface change and to consider the deeper and broader aspects of reality, along with a realisation of the relative triviality of that which we think important.

For me, it's a bit like trying to achieve a deep deathbed perspective of life - without the dying, of course

But then surely it helps to accept dying, that is depending upon one's depth in philosophy.

Acceptance of death is a work in progress for me. At this point I would like at least another ten years - or at least however long it will take me to finish and organise my short stories

SpheresOfBalance wrote:There is one thing that plagues me as I use the tools of philosophy though, and that's watching seemingly helplessly at the fools steer the human ship.

You are not alone there. Even as children, the leaders were not the brightest, whose games tended to be too complicated to interest the majority. The situation remains much the same as adults. I think of society as akin to an ocean liner - huge and cumbersome, where turning anything around in a short time is almost impossible due to the weight of inertia/history.

This is the froth and bubble I spoke of earlier. History has largely been built upon the warfare, vanities, follies and blunderings of our ancestors. Yet somehow all this bungling and seemingly pointless bloodshed, destruction and suffering has brought humanity from the caves to cities, skyscrapers and space exploration. However, respecting that humanity's/life's lunacy somehow works does not mean we have to join the other lemmings in jumping into the melee for our entire lives.

It can be fun to immerse ourselves in society's madness and mayhem for a while but, like a Hesse character, we can become sullied and brutalised enough to viscerally understand why it's best to strive for calmness and mercy (Answer: life is hard enough already).

Greta wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:09 am

SpheresOfBalance wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 12:38 am

Greta wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:13 am
A harsh summation.

I have to say that ignorance is far from bliss for me. Rather, philosophy (and science - I don't draw much of a line personally) acts like cognitive therapy for me, helping to raise my vision above the froth and messiness of constant surface change and to consider the deeper and broader aspects of reality, along with a realisation of the relative triviality of that which we think important.

For me, it's a bit like trying to achieve a deep deathbed perspective of life - without the dying, of course

But then surely it helps to accept dying, that is depending upon one's depth in philosophy.

Acceptance of death is a work in progress for me. At this point I would like at least another ten years - or at least however long it will take me to finish and organise my short stories

SpheresOfBalance wrote:There is one thing that plagues me as I use the tools of philosophy though, and that's watching seemingly helplessly at the fools steer the human ship.

You are not alone there. Even as children, the leaders were not the brightest, whose games tended to be too complicated to interest the majority. The situation remains much the same as adults. I think of society as akin to an ocean liner - huge and cumbersome, where turning anything around in a short time is almost impossible due to the weight of inertia/history.

This is the froth and bubble I spoke of earlier. History has largely been built upon the warfare, vanities, follies and blunderings of our ancestors. Yet somehow all this bungling and seemingly pointless bloodshed, destruction and suffering has brought humanity from the caves to cities, skyscrapers and space exploration. However, respecting that humanity's/life's lunacy somehow works does not mean we have to join the other lemmings in jumping into the melee for our entire lives.

It can be fun to immerse ourselves in society's madness and mayhem for a while but, like a Hesse character, we can become sullied and brutalised enough to viscerally understand why it's best to strive for calmness and mercy (Answer: life is hard enough already).

You know greta, now don't get freaked out, because the spheres of imbalance that I am is really only interested in truth, but it's amazing how much we seem to agree on a lot of things. Sure, we say things differently, but you're one of the few that I seem to agree with more than the rest. Now saying that, I hope I haven't just insulted you.

Peace, my friend.

P.S. And may time afford you that which shall cause you to feel at ease, when it's your time to return from whence you came. Short stories huh, sounds interesting... Keep up the creativity, as I've said in the past, 'humans are the most beautiful when they create, as in art!

Thanks Spheres. I'm not freaking out. What I'd said was reasonable (as far as I can tell) and you agreed with those ostensibly reasonable thoughts

I'm still not wild about the idea of returning from whence I came. I'm not quite old and/or dilapidated enough to find that idea too enthusing.

Greta wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:51 am Thanks Spheres. I'm not freaking out. What I'd said was reasonable (as far as I can tell) and you agreed with those ostensibly reasonable thoughts
Yep, because at 60, I too have been ostensibly reasonable in my thinking.

I'm still not wild about the idea of returning from whence I came. I'm not quite old and/or dilapidated enough to find that idea too enthusing.

Yeah, sorry about that, I know all too well how people become uncomfortable being reminded of the inevitable. I only referred to dying because you brought it up as obviously something you feared, like the rest of us of course, and actually I was trying to calm you a bit, saying that philosophy can abate that fear. Or so I have found that being the case. Of course I'm still not ready yet.

SpheresOfBalance wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:46 am

Greta wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:51 am Thanks Spheres. I'm not freaking out. What I'd said was reasonable (as far as I can tell) and you agreed with those ostensibly reasonable thoughts
Yep, because at 60, I too have been ostensibly reasonable in my thinking.

There are probably a few around our vintage here but not all seem keen on reason ...

SpheresOfBalance wrote:I'm still not wild about the idea of returning from whence I came. I'm not quite old and/or dilapidated enough to find that idea too enthusing.

Yeah, sorry about that, I know all too well how people become uncomfortable being reminded of the inevitable. I only referred to dying because you brought it up as obviously something you feared, like the rest of us of course, and actually I was trying to calm you a bit, saying that philosophy can abate that fear. Or so I have found that being the case. Of course I'm still not ready yet.

No probs. I think about death all the time, at least once a day. Call me superstitious but I like to send a clear and unambiguous message to the universe that I am not done yet. If you have ever read Terry Pratchett novels, my enthusiasm for staying alive is similar to those of his characters.

If put in proper context it would destroy the institutions which destroy lives.

Yes philosophy destroys...but it also creates and gives meaning where the sheer vanity of material wealth provides none.

thinking destroys lives - stop it...

-Imp

Impenitent wrote: ↑Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:48 pm thinking destroys lives - stop it...

-Imp

Interesting thought.

Thinking breeds insanity

commonsense wrote: ↑Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:46 pm Thinking breeds insanity

Thanks for the thought...do you suffer from insanity?

Geddouddahere you guys, philosophy and science are simply interesting and fun. There's nothing quite like the feeling of, "Ohhhhh, now I get it!".

Any philosophy that screws you up is not philosophy - that's just bullshitting to yourself. Philosophy is just observing the world and yourself within it, finding it all curious and interesting and then trying to make sense of it.

Some may figure that ignorance is bliss, that it's better not to have bitten into the apple of knowledge, to remain happily oblivious, hypnotised by incomprehensible shapes and forms. Perhaps, arguably, it would be better for them but as per Nagle et al, they cannot be sure what is better for others.