a defense of drag show/drag queens..
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a defense of drag show/drag queens..
as I am old, I recall watching TV in the old days,
and one of the set pieces of variety shows in the
1950' and 60's were men dressing as women....
if you were a movie or TV star back in the day,
you would, at one point or another appear in drag on TV...
Milton Berle for example, appear in drag in multiple shows
and being old, I can remember people like Dean Martin and
I seem to recall even John Wayne doing a show in drag with
multiple other male movie stars...
I grew up with that, it wasn't a scary thing like it is today,
and it was humorous, taken for laughter, it wasn't the life and
death thing it is today.... and one of the best rated comedy
movies of all time, was based on men dressing as women,
"Some like it hot".... and it is still a hilarious movie..
but why has men dressing as women created so much fuss
and downright unpleasantness?
it has nothing to do with cross dressing, it has everything to do
with men feeling insecure... Ron DeSantis who clearly hates
drag shows, really is pointing out that he has a image problem...
he is insecure with being a man...it has nothing to do with drag
shows and everything to do how these people feel about themselves...
men who are truly secure with who they are and their sexuality,
have no fear about drag shows... it doesn't bother us if men
wear dresses... who cares? but conservatives who fear everything
and I mean everything, are afraid of other men cross dressing,
they will find any excuse to ban it....to "protect" the children
is a lie.... conservatives don't care about children, if they did
they would do something about the fact that over half the homeless
population in America is children and they would do something
about childhood hunger, or help children get better medical care,
nah, the GOP/MAGA crowd couldn't give a shit about children...
they hide behind children to cover up the fact that they
are afraid of everything.. fear drives them to hate drag shows
and men who cross dress...
and it is too bad that conservatives hate themselves so much that
they must deny others the right to be themselves... there is nothing
wrong with cross dressing, or drag shows...
it doesn't impact the children, (I am a father)
and it doesn't impact society.....
it is just your fears and insecurities that drive this particular
point of view...next week it will be something else, lets us
see, over the last few years conservatives have been
afraid of.. CRT, pedophilia, liberals drinking the blood of children, space lasers,
education, gay marriage, Liberals destroying America, and of course this
week fear, trans people/cross dressing... wonder what you will fear
and attack next week, holding hands? maybe that might lead to
unwanted sex and pregnancy? who knows, I don't practice fear or
allow fear to dominate my life like conservatives do, but I am sure
they will find something new to spew about soon....
Kropotkin
and one of the set pieces of variety shows in the
1950' and 60's were men dressing as women....
if you were a movie or TV star back in the day,
you would, at one point or another appear in drag on TV...
Milton Berle for example, appear in drag in multiple shows
and being old, I can remember people like Dean Martin and
I seem to recall even John Wayne doing a show in drag with
multiple other male movie stars...
I grew up with that, it wasn't a scary thing like it is today,
and it was humorous, taken for laughter, it wasn't the life and
death thing it is today.... and one of the best rated comedy
movies of all time, was based on men dressing as women,
"Some like it hot".... and it is still a hilarious movie..
but why has men dressing as women created so much fuss
and downright unpleasantness?
it has nothing to do with cross dressing, it has everything to do
with men feeling insecure... Ron DeSantis who clearly hates
drag shows, really is pointing out that he has a image problem...
he is insecure with being a man...it has nothing to do with drag
shows and everything to do how these people feel about themselves...
men who are truly secure with who they are and their sexuality,
have no fear about drag shows... it doesn't bother us if men
wear dresses... who cares? but conservatives who fear everything
and I mean everything, are afraid of other men cross dressing,
they will find any excuse to ban it....to "protect" the children
is a lie.... conservatives don't care about children, if they did
they would do something about the fact that over half the homeless
population in America is children and they would do something
about childhood hunger, or help children get better medical care,
nah, the GOP/MAGA crowd couldn't give a shit about children...
they hide behind children to cover up the fact that they
are afraid of everything.. fear drives them to hate drag shows
and men who cross dress...
and it is too bad that conservatives hate themselves so much that
they must deny others the right to be themselves... there is nothing
wrong with cross dressing, or drag shows...
it doesn't impact the children, (I am a father)
and it doesn't impact society.....
it is just your fears and insecurities that drive this particular
point of view...next week it will be something else, lets us
see, over the last few years conservatives have been
afraid of.. CRT, pedophilia, liberals drinking the blood of children, space lasers,
education, gay marriage, Liberals destroying America, and of course this
week fear, trans people/cross dressing... wonder what you will fear
and attack next week, holding hands? maybe that might lead to
unwanted sex and pregnancy? who knows, I don't practice fear or
allow fear to dominate my life like conservatives do, but I am sure
they will find something new to spew about soon....
Kropotkin
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Why do we have to be mindless zombies who approve of everything?
Why do we have to be labeled as fearful if we don't want something to be happening?
Why can't we decide that something is inappropriate for one or more reasons and that's the way it is? And we can act on that.
For example, Dean Martin was often shown with a glass of whiskey in his hand and "supposedly drunk". I don't think that should be shown to children because it's a bad example for them.
Do I need to shut up and pretend that I don't feel that way? Why? Why not?
Why do we have to be labeled as fearful if we don't want something to be happening?
Why can't we decide that something is inappropriate for one or more reasons and that's the way it is? And we can act on that.
For example, Dean Martin was often shown with a glass of whiskey in his hand and "supposedly drunk". I don't think that should be shown to children because it's a bad example for them.
Do I need to shut up and pretend that I don't feel that way? Why? Why not?
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
I too am old, and I too grew up watching the shows you mentioned, and I have no problem with them.Peter Kropotkin wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 5:01 pm as I am old, I recall watching TV in the old days,
and one of the set pieces of variety shows in the
1950' and 60's were men dressing as women....
if you were a movie or TV star back in the day,
you would, at one point or another appear in drag on TV...
Milton Berle for example, appear in drag in multiple shows
and being old, I can remember people like Dean Martin and
I seem to recall even John Wayne doing a show in drag with
multiple other male movie stars...
I grew up with that, it wasn't a scary thing like it is today,
and it was humorous, taken for laughter, it wasn't the life and
death thing it is today.... and one of the best rated comedy
movies of all time, was based on men dressing as women,
"Some like it hot".... and it is still a hilarious movie..
but why has men dressing as women created so much fuss
and downright unpleasantness?
it has nothing to do with cross dressing, it has everything to do
with men feeling insecure... Ron DeSantis who clearly hates
drag shows, really is pointing out that he has a image problem...
he is insecure with being a man...it has nothing to do with drag
shows and everything to do how these people feel about themselves...
men who are truly secure with who they are and their sexuality,
have no fear about drag shows... it doesn't bother us if men
wear dresses... who cares? but conservatives who fear everything
and I mean everything, are afraid of other men cross dressing,
they will find any excuse to ban it....to "protect" the children
is a lie....
As other examples, I loved Curley Howard's and Stan Laurel's comedic portrayals of females...
However, are we to understand that you personally would have no problem taking your 4-year-old grandchild (perhaps a little girl) to this drag queen's library reading show...
...where he could "accidently" expose his nasty crotch to her???
Furthermore, in what way could it possibly be "healthy" to expose little children to the hideous vision of this grown man's bizarre and twisted lifestyle?...
Let's hear your "defense" of these things.
_______
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Oh, it's only about the clothes that people wear?Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:10 pm To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
Why do drag queens have makeup? Why to they "act" like women? What's that all about?
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Making drag "illegal" and not allowing a drag queen to teach in an elementary classroom are two different things. If someone wants to see a drag show, they can go find a place that is having one. I would think taking a young child to one may be questionable depending on what the drag queen does or says but that's what movie ratings like G, PG, R, X, and others are for.Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:10 pm To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
- FlashDangerpants
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Makeup was invented for men. The government dictating what it means to "act like a man" or "act like a woman" seems as absurd as the government deciding that some clothes are men's clothes and some clothes are women's clothes. I don't see any angle of it that isn't inherently absurd.phyllo wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:17 pmOh, it's only about the clothes that people wear?Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:10 pm To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
Why do drag queens have makeup? Why to they "act" like women? What's that all about?
What behaviours should the government classify as "female" behaviours that men cannot legally do?
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
_______
Oh my goodness, I never thought I'd need to haul out this old adage twice in a 48-hour period, but here we are...
_______
Oh my goodness, I never thought I'd need to haul out this old adage twice in a 48-hour period, but here we are...
_______
Last edited by seeds on Wed Mar 22, 2023 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Forget about "the government".Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:32 pmMakeup was invented for men. The government dictating what it means to "act like a man" or "act like a woman" seems as absurd as the government deciding that some clothes are men's clothes and some clothes are women's clothes. I don't see any angle of it that isn't inherently absurd.phyllo wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:17 pmOh, it's only about the clothes that people wear?Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:10 pm To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
Why do drag queens have makeup? Why to they "act" like women? What's that all about?
What behaviours should the government classify as "female" behaviours that men cannot legally do?
Why can't a person or a group of people decide that some things ought not to be shown to children?
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
It seems that there is a level of either dishonesty or delusion at work if a person wishes to present themselves as the opposite sex by wearing what is traditionally worn by the opposite sex. It's tolerable to a point, in a comedy show for example, but I for one don't want to wander through society trying to figure out who is male or female and who isn't. It's traditional for men and women to distinguish their sex when they're out and about. Like wedding rings are traditional to show someone that the person they're hitting on is already spoken for. Truth in advertising.Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:32 pmMakeup was invented for men. The government dictating what it means to "act like a man" or "act like a woman" seems as absurd as the government deciding that some clothes are men's clothes and some clothes are women's clothes. I don't see any angle of it that isn't inherently absurd.phyllo wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:17 pmOh, it's only about the clothes that people wear?Flannel Jesus wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:10 pm To make drag illegal is to decide what clothes women can wear and what clothes men can wear. Why in the world would we want the government to dictate what style of clothes we can wear?
Why do drag queens have makeup? Why to they "act" like women? What's that all about?
What behaviours should the government classify as "female" behaviours that men cannot legally do?
I mean, incest is illegal. Raping an underage child is illegal. Should the government stand clear of those affairs too? So far your argument seems to be that government shouldn't tell us what to do. That in itself is not a reason alone. Just because it's a written law doesn't mean it is a bad law. Just because "big government" is telling you not to do something doesn't necessarily mean it's perfectly fine to do it. Yelling fire in a movie theater is against the law. If a man is trying very hard to present himself as a woman, then if someone asks him if he's male or female and he demands that we address him as female also, then that's dishonest and probably a bit counter-productive in some social settings. A salesman rolling the mileage back on a car you're about to purchase and telling you it has fewer miles than it does is counter-productive to you acting in your own best interest. There's no law against people lying to each other in casual situations, however, it's not exaclty encouraged. A teacher teaching children should try to tell the truth as much as possible for the benefit of the kids.
- vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
The gender equivalent of 'black face'.
Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
It's insulting to women?
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..
Undoubtedly you feel the way you feel. So what? Many feelings are largely if not wholly void of reason.phyllo wrote: ↑Wed Mar 22, 2023 5:53 pm Why do we have to be mindless zombies who approve of everything?
Why do we have to be labeled as fearful if we don't want something to be happening?
Why can't we decide that something is inappropriate for one or more reasons and that's the way it is? And we can act on that.
For example, Dean Martin was often shown with a glass of whiskey in his hand and "supposedly drunk". I don't think that should be shown to children because it's a bad example for them.
Do I need to shut up and pretend that I don't feel that way? Why? Why not?
By all means make a well-reasoned case as to why men - is it also always "bad" for women? - cross dressing is "bad" under all circumstances.