Solving Climate Change.

For all things philosophical.

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Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:45 am
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:41 am I have informed you of the solution to 'climate change', so now you can take it or leave it.
You've congratulated yourself by casting moral aspersions at others.
Are you here 'trying to' suggest that you are not selfish and greedy?

If yes, then good luck, you will never succeed.

But if no, then you are selfish and greedy. Nothing more needs to be said, and thus NO aspersion was cast.

By the way, how exactly have I, supposedly, "congratulated myself" here?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:45 am But there's nothing practical whatsoever in anything you've said.
What part of, ' Stop having the 'love of money' ', is not practical, to you?

Do you feel absolutely incompetent or incapable of stopping "yourself" from being a greedy and selfish human being?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:45 am It's self contradictory, and cannot possibly secure the future.
What is, supposedly, "self contradictory, and cannot possibly secure the future" here?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:45 am Hard pass!
Only AFTER you admit that you are the problem and the cause of the 'changing climate', can the issue be SOLVED here.

Your idea does NOT 'solve climate change'. Your idea is just ANOTHER long list of ideas, which will just add to 'climate change' AND pollution, while at the same time allowing some people to obtain more money, to the detriment of "others".
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Age,

I'm not going to argue with you, because you're argumentative. You're not playing by the unwritten rule - that by reason, I might change your mind. Arguing with you is like playing chess with a pigeon. It knocks the pieces over, shits on the board, and struts around like it won the game.

You're the world's dumbest proponent of the world's most stupid idea; the idea that climate change can be solved by a strategy of 'have less, pay more, tax this and stop that' - while still pumping oil.

Meanwhile, there's massive amounts of clean energy beneath our feet, in the molten interior of the earth. Harnessing that energy can solve climate change, without imposing poverty, that would fall most heavily on those least well off.

If you won't see how your green left, limits to growth, moralistic approach does not address the fundamental problem, that fossil fuels emit carbon, then I can't help you. But in reality, no-one need have a carbon footprint - because magma energy is more than an adequate alternative to fossil fuels.
Last edited by Vitruvius on Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
Belinda
Posts: 8034
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2016 10:13 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Belinda »

Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Belinda wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:02 am Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Climate change food calculator: What's your diet's carbon footprint?
By Nassos Stylianou, Clara Guibourg and Helen Briggs
BBC News
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-46459714
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:15 am Age,

I'm not going to argue with you, because you're argumentative. You're not playing by the unwritten rule - that by reason, I might change your mind. Arguing with you is like playing chess with a pigeon. It knocks the pieces over, shits on the board, and struts around like it won the game.

You're the world's dumbest proponent of the world's most stupid idea; the idea that climate change can be solved by a strategy of 'have less, pay more, tax this and stop that' - while still pumping oil.

Meanwhile, there's massive amounts of clean energy beneath our feet, in the molten interior of the earth. Harnessing that energy can solve climate change, without imposing poverty, that would fall most heavily on those least well off.

If you won't see how your green left, limits to growth, moralistic approach does not address the fundamental problem, that fossil fuels emit carbon, then I can't help you. But in reality, no-one need have a carbon footprint - because magma energy is more than an adequate alternative to fossil fuels.
Your assumptions are so far from thee actual Truth, and are not allowing you be able to see and understand what I have actually said and meant here that I will let your own Wrong ASSUMPTIONS speak for themselves.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Belinda wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:02 am Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
But NONE of that works.

I have explained what WILL actually work.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:42 am
Belinda wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:02 am Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure.

What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money.

Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'?

Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:42 am
Belinda wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:02 am Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure. What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money. Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'? Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
Is this a religious thing with you? Love of money is the root of all evil? Maybe that's so, but money is also the author of a far greater amount of good. The world's 100 year long experiment in comparative economics shows that communism did not provide the motive for innovation, and did not produce prosperity for the people. No-one was leaping over the Berlin Wall to get into East Germany. Rather, under communism, because nothing is owned, everyone steals - and production breaks down. Beneath the official communist economy develops a capitalist black market. Bribery, barter and long queues for bread. Is that what you want? Personally, I'd rather be walking along with a tenner in my pocket, and see some guy pass me in a beautifully engineered sports car - I'll never earn enough in my entire life to afford, than see both of us walking along with fuck all. If you can overcome jealousy - capitalism is awesome! And magma energy aligns the capitalist interest with sustainability - by giving us massive clean energy to sustain a prosperous future.
Ansiktsburk
Posts: 447
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:03 pm
Location: Central Scandinavia

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Ansiktsburk »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:42 am
Belinda wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:02 am Age wrote:
So, when you adults STOP your own love of money, and so STOP being greedy and selfish as well, then, and only then, you will prevent the climate from changing the way it is, in the days when this is being written. This is, really, the only True way of solving 'climate change'.
Motivation is the beginning of doing something positive about man made climate change. It is therefore exceedingly important to get a major narrative and charismatic tellers of the narrative on the side of any technology that is to be acceptable.

Part of that narrative would be that money grabbing and other manifestations of fear and mutual distrust are evils.

The political regimes that are in the conversation vary so that some regimes rely on traditional narratives while others find novel ones such as the mythologising of Greta Thunberg.
Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure.

What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money.

Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'?

Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.

But if you start there, and look at what people do, It's does not make life unbearable to reduce eating meat, to recycle stuff and so on. But saying to a family father that he should not take his car for work when the work is long away from home, well...
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.

I was born into a one up, one down back to back house with an outside toilet in a mining town in Northern England. When I was about 8 years old the mines were closed, and things went downhill! I'm familiar with poverty - that's why I hate it. It's not some romantic thing; it's degrading and painful. The green left are proposing poverty as a solution to climate change, when what they should be calling for is massive clean energy from magma - to increase prosperity. Environmental concern is a post material value. The poor cannot afford to care about climate change; neither in this country nor in the wider world.
Vitruvius
Posts: 678
Joined: Mon May 10, 2021 9:46 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Image
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:42 am





Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure. What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money. Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'? Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
Is this a religious thing with you?
No.

WHY would you have even begun TOBASSUME such a thing?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Love of money is the root of all evil?
No it is not.

The 'love of money' is third on the list of all evil.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Maybe that's so, but money is also the author of a far greater amount of good. The world's 100 year long experiment in comparative economics shows that communism did not provide the motive for innovation, and did not produce prosperity for the people.
You do have a very narrowed and short sighted view of things.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm No-one was leaping over the Berlin Wall to get into East Germany. Rather, under communism, because nothing is owned, everyone steals - and production breaks down.
WHEN will you STOP making theae completely Wrong and absurd assumptions?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Beneath the official communist economy develops a capitalist black market. Bribery, barter and long queues for bread.
Once you make an ASSUMPTION you really stick with it, hey?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Is that what you want?
Nothing of the sort.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Personally, I'd rather be walking along with a tenner in my pocket, and see some guy pass me in a beautifully engineered sports car - I'll never earn enough in my entire life to afford, than see both of us walking along with fuck all.
Okay. But this is completely off topic.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm If you can overcome jealousy - capitalism is awesome!
For who?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm And magma energy aligns the capitalist interest with sustainability - by giving us massive clean energy to sustain a prosperous future.
If you say so. But what you say here has absolutely NOTHING AT ALL to do with what I have said and talked about.
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:42 am





Sadly Belinda,

I rather suspect they'll take the stick over the carrot, because the stick won't be applied their backs. It will be applied to yours and mine. Tax this, stop that, pay more, have less - on energy, food, clothing, heating, will harm most those who spend the greater proportion of their income on these things. It won't effect the rich because these things are inconsequential expenses to them, even at thrice the price! Taxing the poor out of the market for both heating and eating to reduce demand to save the world, can only be held in place by authoritarianism, and then, you really will have cemented their power. The green left narrative is not a catalyst that will force the powers that be to harness magma energy; its the false narrative they've constructed to get you to cut your own throat. Like the Communist Manifesto - cast off your chains (and work for nothing).
An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure.

What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money.

Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'?

Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.
Quite a LOT of ASSUMING going on here. Which, by the way, was all just plain Wrong.
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm But if you start there, and look at what people do, It's does not make life unbearable to reduce eating meat, to recycle stuff and so on. But saying to a family father that he should not take his car for work when the work is long away from home, well...
Well I, for one, NEVER even suggested any such thing, let alone said any such thing. In fact, I was NEVER thinking any such thing.

WHY were you ASSUMING things that I have NEVER even mentioned?

Or, were you replying to someone else?
Age
Posts: 20205
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:17 am

Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 pm
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.

I was born into a one up, one down back to back house with an outside toilet in a mining town in Northern England. When I was about 8 years old the mines were closed, and things went downhill! I'm familiar with poverty - that's why I hate it.
And there my friends is WHY this one is fixated on one thing only. They are, literally, fixed, and thus also NOT open to what I have been saying. And this is WHY this one here is continually making so many completely Wrong ASSUMPTIONS.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 pm It's not some romantic thing; it's degrading and painful. The green left are proposing poverty as a solution to climate change, when what they should be calling for is massive clean energy from magma - to increase prosperity.
Why exactly do you think no one from ANY "side" are calling for this?

Obviously, if ANY one could make money out of this, then it would have already been done.

Greed stops people from doing what is right in Life.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:06 pm Environmental concern is a post material value. The poor cannot afford to care about climate change; neither in this country nor in the wider world.
If you stop viewing 'the world' through monetary value, then there are no rich nor poor. Value is then placed on what is actually Right, for EVERY one instead.
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