Solving Climate Change.

For all things philosophical.

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Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm

An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure. What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money. Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'? Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pmIs this a religious thing with you?
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:31 pmNo. WHY would you have even begun TO ASSUME such a thing?
I asked you a question to find out where you're coming from. So, you're a communist?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Love of money is the root of all evil?
No it is not. The 'love of money' is third on the list of all evil.
If you could send me a PDF of the full list, that would be super!
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Maybe that's so, but money is also the author of a far greater amount of good. The world's 100 year long experiment in comparative economics shows that communism did not provide the motive for innovation, and did not produce prosperity for the people.
You do have a very narrowed and short sighted view of things.
Not since I got spectacles!
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm No-one was leaping over the Berlin Wall to get into East Germany. Rather, under communism, because nothing is owned, everyone steals - and production breaks down.
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:31 pmWHEN will you STOP making theae completely Wrong and absurd assumptions?
When I got spectacles!
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Beneath the official communist economy develops a capitalist black market. Bribery, barter and long queues for bread.
Once you make an ASSUMPTION you really stick with it, hey?
I dated a very intelligent woman from the former soviet union.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Is that what you want?
Nothing of the sort.
Good!
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Personally, I'd rather be walking along with a tenner in my pocket, and see some guy pass me in a beautifully engineered sports car - I'll never earn enough in my entire life to afford, than see both of us walking along with fuck all.
Okay. But this is completely off topic.
No, it's not, because the left wing environmental narrative has been focused through the lens of equalitarian anti-capitalist politics since the 1960's, and created a widespread false assumption that sustainability requires sacrifice. It doesn't. It requires massive clean energy. That's what this thread is about, so it's entirely on topic. I love inequality. It means someone has been able to succeed - doing something socially beneficial, and profiting from it. In some small part, it benefits me if others succeed - even if it's only that I get to see a cool sportscar I'll never be able to afford.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm If you can overcome jealousy - capitalism is awesome!
For who?


It's a long list. Let's start with slavery. If it weren't for capitalism providing for personal economic and political freedom, we'd still have slavery. It was the way of the world since the dawn of time. Under communism you are not an individual. You are a factor of planned production. So it cannot be argued that communism overcomes slavery when people are owned and disposed of by the state; often in numbers that make Hitler look like an amateur genocidal maniac.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm And magma energy aligns the capitalist interest with sustainability - by giving us massive clean energy to sustain a prosperous future.
If you say so. But what you say here has absolutely NOTHING AT ALL to do with what I have said and talked about.
These things may seem unconnected to you, but let me assure you it's all related. I've been around the block more times that I can remember, and if you will but listen - rather than fight me every step, I'll give you the benefit of things I've learned.
Age
Posts: 20204
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm

An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure. What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money. Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'? Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pmIs this a religious thing with you?
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:31 pmNo. WHY would you have even begun TO ASSUME such a thing?
I asked you a question to find out where you're coming from.
I have asked you a myriad of questions, to gain clarity/find out where you are coming from, but you have yet to answer just one of them.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm So, you're a communist?
What you wrote here is a statement, with a question mark at the end. So, are you here asking me a question, or are you telling me some thing?

And, WHY you would want to use the 'communist' word, especially when considering all of what I have actually written, only you would truly know.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Love of money is the root of all evil?
No it is not. The 'love of money' is third on the list of all evil.
If you could send me a PDF of the full list, that would be super!
Okay.

But it would be much easier for me to just write the list down in words in a reply to you here.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Maybe that's so, but money is also the author of a far greater amount of good. The world's 100 year long experiment in comparative economics shows that communism did not provide the motive for innovation, and did not produce prosperity for the people.
You do have a very narrowed and short sighted view of things.
Not since I got spectacles!
My point, now proven.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm No-one was leaping over the Berlin Wall to get into East Germany. Rather, under communism, because nothing is owned, everyone steals - and production breaks down.
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:31 pmWHEN will you STOP making theae completely Wrong and absurd assumptions?
When I got spectacles!
I said, 'When WILL you ...?' Not, 'When DID you ...?'
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Beneath the official communist economy develops a capitalist black market. Bribery, barter and long queues for bread.
Once you make an ASSUMPTION you really stick with it, hey?
I dated a very intelligent woman from the former soviet union.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Is that what you want?
Nothing of the sort.
Good!
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm Personally, I'd rather be walking along with a tenner in my pocket, and see some guy pass me in a beautifully engineered sports car - I'll never earn enough in my entire life to afford, than see both of us walking along with fuck all.
Okay. But this is completely off topic.
No, it's not, because the left wing environmental narrative has been focused through the lens of equalitarian anti-capitalist politics since the 1960's, and created a widespread false assumption that sustainability requires sacrifice. It doesn't.
So what? Many people have said many things. BUT, I have NEVER said NOR talked about ANY such things. So, WHY bring up such off topic things in replies to what I have actually said and written?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm It requires massive clean energy. That's what this thread is about, so it's entirely on topic. I love inequality. It means someone has been able to succeed - doing something socially beneficial, and profiting from it.
LOL Just about absolutely EVERY thing 'you', human beings, have done, for profit, is what is causing the Wrong in the world, including 'climate change'.

You really can NOT look at this without money, and monetary gain, being involved, right?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm In some small part, it benefits me if others succeed - even if it's only that I get to see a cool sportscar I'll never be able to afford.
You REALLY are stuck and fixated.

Wanting things 'you', human beings, do NOT need is WHY 'you' are in such the mess 'you' are, in the days when this is being written.

Rid "yourselves" of your wanting, greedy, and monetary ways FIRST, then you can begin planning ways to get MORE than you have ever dreamed of, up to now, without ANY one suffering nor missing out.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm If you can overcome jealousy - capitalism is awesome!
For who?


It's a long list. Let's start with slavery. If it weren't for capitalism providing for personal economic and political freedom, we'd still have slavery.[/quote]

LOL It was because of capitalism slavery came into existence.

By the way, slavery is NOT a who.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm It was the way of the world since the dawn of time.
LOL You really do have a very narrowed and short sighted field of view.
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm Under communism you are not an individual. You are a factor of planned production. So it cannot be argued that communism overcomes slavery when people are owned and disposed of by the state; often in numbers that make Hitler look like an amateur genocidal maniac.
Are you at all able to look at any thing other than 'capitalism' and 'communism'?
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:27 pm And magma energy aligns the capitalist interest with sustainability - by giving us massive clean energy to sustain a prosperous future.
If you say so. But what you say here has absolutely NOTHING AT ALL to do with what I have said and talked about.
These things may seem unconnected to you, but let me assure you it's all related. I've been around the block more times that I can remember, and if you will but listen - rather than fight me every step, I'll give you the benefit of things I've learned.
You really are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed.
Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:43 pm You really are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed.
Only to stupid shit. I haven't given up hope that even a monkey like you, might accidentally type something worth taking in.
Age
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 12:02 am
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:43 pm You really are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed.
Only to stupid shit. I haven't given up hope that even a monkey like you, might accidentally type something worth taking in.
And then they resort to this. Talk about "running a forum into the ground". To you, is this type of talking of yours here meant to take place in philosophical discussion?

Have you even just once stopped to consider what has been said and written to you here in this forum?

If yes, then explain to us WHY you think your idea of magma energy already.
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FlashDangerpants
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by FlashDangerpants »

Vitruvius wrote: Sat Sep 18, 2021 11:02 pm
Vitruvius wrote: Sat Sep 18, 2021 12:30 pm BBC news have added 'climate' as a stand alone section, apart from the science section. Given the significance of the issue - I'd like to do the same thing here. "Cornoavirus discussion" has its own section, and that's not even an existential issue - unless you're an antivax, anti-masker, in which case, you'll almost certainly die - and your legacy will be a video on youtube, crying about how wrong you were, and encouraging other people to wear masks and get jabs! But I digress. Climate change is an existential issue, it's important, it's going to be a subject forever, has enormous implications across science, economics, politics; it deserves its own section.
Belinda wrote: Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:19 pmI agree climate change is too enormous not to stand alone as the greatest danger man has ever faced.
FlashDangerpants wrote: Sat Sep 18, 2021 9:14 pmI would counter by pointing to the gender sub, which is nothing but a place for bitter reactionaries like Can and Veggie to complain endlessly about ladyboys. The Covid sub is nothing but a place for a similar coalition of reactionaries and loons to spam MAGA memes. If you put a climate sub on this forum it will go exactly the same way.
Here's a quote from Veggie on the gender forum:

Re: Puberty blockers - no parental consent.
Post by vegetariantaxidermy » Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:50 pm

"If gender is 'only a social construct' then what exactly are these fuckwits changing children 'into'? How can you 'feel like' something that supposedly doesn't exist? None too bright these wokies. So what? if a boy likes playing with dolls or playing dress-ups? Doesn't make him a girl. Plenty of girls don't like doing those things. Does that mean they are all boys? The physical harm that wokedom is doing to children is only secondary to the mental harm that it's doing. Children are only their little pawns in the creation of the dystopia that they envision for humanity."

Could you point out the reactionary loony-ism?
I don't actually bother looking at what the incels and crones are writing in the Gender sub very often, so I hadn't realised when I wrote those words that you are one of them. I have no intention of getting involved in any of that nonsense again unless something genuinely new crops up, which seems unlkely as I mentioned that sub specifically because it is such a howling desert of regurgitated excrement.

That said, if you've read more than 6 of veggie's posts you should realise that she is indeed a reactionary loon, which sub she's writing in makes no difference.

For what it's worth, what you pasted there is badly argued of course because it is a thought that Veggie stole from Can, and that's a double axis of fucking stupid bastards. You seem to think you have some business telling everyone else what philosophy should aspire to. Nobody who wants to be lecturing me about that should be reposting hopeless shit that has the logical consequence that nobody could ever switch from supporting Liverpool to Man Utd, that it means nothing to stop being a postman and start being a teacher. You should be able to see when somebody is overworking the text "only a social construct" without my help.
Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:43 pm You really are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed.
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 12:02 amOnly to stupid shit. I haven't given up hope that even a monkey like you, might accidentally type something worth taking in.
Age wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 2:40 amAnd then they resort to this. Talk about "running a forum into the ground". To you, is this type of talking of yours here meant to take place in philosophical discussion? Have you even just once stopped to consider what has been said and written to you here in this forum? If yes, then explain to us WHY you think your idea of magma energy already.
The first thing any philosopher should know is, if you will not suffer the indignity of being wrong, you cannot learn. The second thing a philosopher should know, is that you don't have to agree with an idea to understand it.

I started this thread to discuss an alternate approach to climate change - one that maintains capitalism, freedom and prosperity - by basing human activities on limitless clean energy from the molten interior of the earth. This approach would not require imposing poverty, to reduce demand, to reduce emissions. And what I was met with was people asserting climate change is a hoax.

On the death penalty thread, no one wants to discuss my idea that human rights can be forfeited - as so make the criminal guilty of particularly inhuman crimes, liable for the death penalty. What if they're innocent? ...is the argument I've been dealing with page after page. So yes, running the forum into the ground by deliberately seeking to disrupt and derail, every subject of discussion.
Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:49 am ...
This is off topic! As was your remarkably similar, first contribution:

"A word of advice - if you want your thread to be about climate change and your preferred sci-fi fix for it, you need to not engage with Age. He has a one track mind dedicated to the "simple solution" he has for all of the word's problems, not just that one. He will make your thread be about that, and yet you will never understand what this thing he is selling even is; he will only tell you that you have failed to understand because you aren't asking open enough questions. If you want to poke that turd, let him hijcack a stupid thread about something you aren't interested in, and do so there, all conversations with him are the same anyway irrespective of OP."
Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

COP26: Australia PM undecided on attending crucial climate summit

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-58703128

Why would you?

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FlashDangerpants
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by FlashDangerpants »

Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 8:15 am
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:49 am ...
This is off topic!
I was answering a question you asked me.
Age
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:43 pm You really are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed.
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 12:02 amOnly to stupid shit. I haven't given up hope that even a monkey like you, might accidentally type something worth taking in.
Age wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 2:40 amAnd then they resort to this. Talk about "running a forum into the ground". To you, is this type of talking of yours here meant to take place in philosophical discussion? Have you even just once stopped to consider what has been said and written to you here in this forum? If yes, then explain to us WHY you think your idea of magma energy already.
The first thing any philosopher should know is, if you will not suffer the indignity of being wrong, you cannot learn. The second thing a philosopher should know, is that you don't have to agree with an idea to understand it.
Both of which have absolutely NOTHING to do with what I have said here.
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am I started this thread to discuss an alternate approach to climate change - one that maintains capitalism, freedom and prosperity - by basing human activities on limitless clean energy from the molten interior of the earth.
Which, as you have already been informed, would NOT solve 'climate change'.

I, however, have informed you of what would ACTUALLY solve 'climate change', to wit you have ignored wholeheartedly.
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am This approach would not require imposing poverty, to reduce demand, to reduce emissions. And what I was met with was people asserting climate change is a hoax.
If that is what you have seen, from the actual words put to you, then my claim that you are MORE CLOSED than I had first noticed stands even further now.

How many people do you claim "asserted 'climate change' is a hoax" here?

And, what has that got to do with what I have actually said and written?
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am On the death penalty thread, no one wants to discuss my idea that human rights can be forfeited - as so make the criminal guilty of particularly inhuman crimes, liable for the death penalty.
How many people were you expecting/hoping wwould discuss your ideas with you?
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am What if they're innocent? ...is the argument I've been dealing with page after page.
AND, what if they are innocent?

AND, what has this got to do with me?
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:59 am So yes, running the forum into the ground by deliberately seeking to disrupt and derail, every subject of discussion.
What is your 'yes' response here, in answer to exactly?
Age
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 8:15 am
FlashDangerpants wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:49 am ...
This is off topic! As was your remarkably similar, first contribution:

"A word of advice - if you want your thread to be about climate change and your preferred sci-fi fix for it, you need to not engage with Age. He has a one track mind dedicated to the "simple solution" he has for all of the word's problems, not just that one. He will make your thread be about that, and yet you will never understand what this thing he is selling even is; he will only tell you that you have failed to understand because you aren't asking open enough questions.
Well how could ANY one Truly understand "another" if one is not Truly OPEN to the "other"?

Also, you are NOT asking "open enough questions" is because you are CLOSED to ANY thing other than what you ALREADY BELIEVE is true.
Vitruvius wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 8:15 am If you want to poke that turd, let him hijcack a stupid thread about something you aren't interested in, and do so there, all conversations with him are the same anyway irrespective of OP."
This is because EVERY thing comes back to the EXACT SAME thing, which you would ALREADY have learned and understood if you were NOT so CLOSED.
Ansiktsburk
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Ansiktsburk »

Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:37 pm
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:35 pm

An absolute miniscule cost to produce a just about never ending and completely pollution free source of energy, which could support a population far greater than the one that currently exists when this is being written, WILL come in to existence.

However, before this will be devised and created first things first. What creates and causes human made climate change needs to stopped first.

After all prevention is, obviously, better than the cure.

What causes human made climate change is greedy and selfish human beings love of money.

Why do adult human beings have a 'love of money'?

Because of the way they were brought up.

So, when adult human beings STOP being greedy and selfish, through their 'love of money', then they will STOP teaching their children to 'love money' and 'be greedy', which, in turn, will help prevent human made climate change.

When things are dreamed up, devised, planned, constructed, and created for the betterment of ALL of humankind, instead of for a monetary and profit seeking reason, then, and ONLY THEN, will the newly devised pollution free and much less resource reliant energy source be finalized and come to fruition.
This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.
Quite a LOT of ASSUMING going on here. Which, by the way, was all just plain Wrong.
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm But if you start there, and look at what people do, It's does not make life unbearable to reduce eating meat, to recycle stuff and so on. But saying to a family father that he should not take his car for work when the work is long away from home, well...
Well I, for one, NEVER even suggested any such thing, let alone said any such thing. In fact, I was NEVER thinking any such thing.

WHY were you ASSUMING things that I have NEVER even mentioned?

Or, were you replying to someone else?
I was replying to you. In the same way you wrote. That grown up people are selfish and greedy... they try to make a good life for themselves and their families.
Age
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Age »

Ansiktsburk wrote: Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:08 am
Age wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:37 pm
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm
This seems to be written by someone brought up in the world created by that greed and selfishness. While people from a family of daytime work and longer back pooreness knows that wanting the things that make the workdays bearable, a car, electricity, hot water, travel to a vacation venue is good things that make life good for ordinary people. It´s not as simple and nice a problem of green guys being good and entrepreneurs being bad. Its about a lot of people wanting a nice, comfortable life. And that, in itself, is not a bad thing. But when billions of people want that, it becomes a problem. A huge problem. Trying to sugarcoat that is not helpful.
Quite a LOT of ASSUMING going on here. Which, by the way, was all just plain Wrong.
Ansiktsburk wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:01 pm But if you start there, and look at what people do, It's does not make life unbearable to reduce eating meat, to recycle stuff and so on. But saying to a family father that he should not take his car for work when the work is long away from home, well...
Well I, for one, NEVER even suggested any such thing, let alone said any such thing. In fact, I was NEVER thinking any such thing.

WHY were you ASSUMING things that I have NEVER even mentioned?

Or, were you replying to someone else?
I was replying to you. In the same way you wrote. That grown up people are selfish and greedy... they try to make a good life for themselves and their families.
What is this in relation to though?

Many people do many things. But that in itself does not make what they do good, nor right.
Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

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Vitruvius
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Re: Solving Climate Change.

Post by Vitruvius »

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