Something For Nothing

[simplicity]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior. People will literally do EVERYTHING...lie, cheat, steal, de-fraud, frame, extort, injury, murder, and even slaughter on a mass scale to these ends. And the kicker is that most folks seem to accept this as the simply the price of admission.

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

[Immanuel Can]

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

Sounds like you're making a case for the rightness of the tenth commandment.

[mickthinks]

all human progress will be severely retarded

Retarded in comparison to what? Other mammals? The insects? The dinosaurs?

[simplicity]

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

Sounds like you're making a case for the rightness of the tenth commandment.

If there is a better way out there, perhaps it would be in having a system where people are rewarded for their actual productivity instead of their ability to participate in the manipulation of others.

I am not anti-capitalist, only anti-corporate and anti-government [except for very the very basics, e.g., protection of life and property].

[simplicity]

all human progress will be severely retarded

Retarded in comparison to what? Other mammals? The insects? The dinosaurs?

In comparison to human potential.

[Immanuel Can]

I am not anti-capitalist, only anti-corporate and anti-government [except for very the very basics, e.g., protection of life and property].

It's the wanting to take what others have that's the problem. There's something truly horrible and unspeakably spiteful about a person who has food, clothing and shelter, as much as she needs, but cannot stand that thought that her neighbour might have a little bit more of something than she herself has.

Such people will never be happy, because they don't know how to be: to be satified with what you have, so long as you have what you need, is one of the great secrets to life.

Envy is a nasty, nasty thing. And unfortunately, most of today's so-called calls for "justice" or "equity" do not come from the lips of people who do not have enough, but from those who simply always want more.

[Belinda]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior. People will literally do EVERYTHING...lie, cheat, steal, de-fraud, frame, extort, injury, murder, and even slaughter on a mass scale to these ends. And the kicker is that most folks seem to accept this as the simply the price of admission.

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

True, that is the case of people for whom washing machines and the like are the only something worth coveting. However there are many people for whom finding a meaning for their existence is more important than washing machines.

[RCSaunders]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior. People will literally do EVERYTHING...lie, cheat, steal, de-fraud, frame, extort, injury, murder, and even slaughter on a mass scale to these ends. And the kicker is that most folks seem to accept this as the simply the price of admission.

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

True, that is the case of people for whom washing machines and the like are the only something worth coveting. However there are many people for whom finding a meaning for their existence is more important than washing machines.

You won't have much time to spend, "finding a meaning for your existence," when your existence is spending all your time washing your clothes in the river by pounding them with stones. If you haven't figured out the meaning of your existence by the time you are fourteen, you never will.

[RCSaunders]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior.

Every social/political system (government) exists to fulfill the desires of those who seek to have more than they can produce or achieve by their own effort. One of the chief lies is the notion of, "rights," to what they have not produced themselves. Every government is a defiance of the true nature of justice and all life:

Produce or die!

[Belinda]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior. People will literally do EVERYTHING...lie, cheat, steal, de-fraud, frame, extort, injury, murder, and even slaughter on a mass scale to these ends. And the kicker is that most folks seem to accept this as the simply the price of admission.

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

True, that is the case of people for whom washing machines and the like are the only something worth coveting. However there are many people for whom finding a meaning for their existence is more important than washing machines.

You won't have much time to spend, "finding a meaning for your existence," when your existence is spending all your time washing your clothes in the river by pounding them with stones. If you haven't figured out the meaning of your existence by the time you are fourteen, you never will.

So says the washing-machine materialist.

[Walker]

You won't have much time to spend, "finding a meaning for your existence," when your existence is spending all your time washing your clothes in the river by pounding them with stones. If you haven't figured out the meaning of your existence by the time you are fourteen, you never will.

Reminds me of a movie scene.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZLWtFiU0Io

[henry quirk]

I believe the goal of obtaining, "something for nothing," is the greatest driver of human socio-pathological behavior. People will literally do EVERYTHING...lie, cheat, steal, de-fraud, frame, extort, injury, murder, and even slaughter on a mass scale to these ends. And the kicker is that most folks seem to accept this as the simply the price of admission.

I am certain that few would argue against the notion that our kind has a ways to go. Until we can get beyond this deranged desire to covet what is not ours, over-all human progress will be severely retarded.

A Fatal Tendency of Mankind

Self-preservation and self-development are common aspirations among all people. And if everyone enjoyed the unrestricted use of his faculties and the free disposition of the fruits of his labor, social progress would be ceaseless, uninterrupted, and unfailing.

But there is also another tendency that is common among people. When they can, they wish to live and prosper at the expense of others. This is no rash accusation. Nor does it come from a gloomy and uncharitable spirit. The annals of history bear witness to the truth of it: the incessant wars, mass migrations, religious persecutions, universal slavery, dishonesty in commerce, and monopolies. This fatal desire has its origin in the very nature of man — in that primitive, universal, and insuppressible instinct that impels him to satisfy his desires with the least possible pain.

Property and Plunder

Man can live and satisfy his wants only by ceaseless labor; by the ceaseless application of his faculties to natural resources. This process is the origin of property.

But it is also true that a man may live and satisfy his wants by seizing and consuming the products of the labor of others. This process is the origin of plunder.

Now since man is naturally inclined to avoid pain — and since labor is pain in itself — it follows that men will resort to plunder whenever plunder is easier than work. History shows this quite clearly. And under these conditions, neither religion nor morality can stop it.

When, then, does plunder stop? It stops when it becomes more painful and more dangerous than labor.

It is evident, then, that the proper purpose of law is to use the power of its collective force to stop this fatal tendency to plunder instead of to work. All the measures of the law should protect property and punish plunder.

But, generally, the law is made by one man or one class of men. And since law cannot operate without the sanction and support of a dominating force, this force must be entrusted to those who make the laws.

This fact, combined with the fatal tendency that exists in the heart of man to satisfy his wants with the least possible effort, explains the almost universal perversion of the law. Thus it is easy to understand how law, instead of checking injustice, becomes the invincible weapon of injustice. It is easy to understand why the law is used by the legislator to destroy in varying degrees among the rest of the people, their personal independence by slavery, their liberty by oppression, and their property by plunder. This is done for the benefit of the person who makes the law, and in proportion to the power that he holds.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=32456

[RCSaunders]

True, that is the case of people for whom washing machines and the like are the only something worth coveting. However there are many people for whom finding a meaning for their existence is more important than washing machines.

You won't have much time to spend, "finding a meaning for your existence," when your existence is spending all your time washing your clothes in the river by pounding them with stones. If you haven't figured out the meaning of your existence by the time you are fourteen, you never will.

So says the washing-machine materialist.

What do you eat? Poems?

[Immanuel Can]

If you haven't figured out the meaning of your existence by the time you are fourteen, you never will.

Yes...fourteen-year-olds are known to be repositories of much wisdom.

[RCSaunders]

Self-preservation and self-development are common aspirations among all people. And if everyone enjoyed the unrestricted use of his faculties and the free disposition of the fruits of his labor, social progress would be ceaseless, uninterrupted, and unfailing.

But there is also another tendency that is common among people. When they can, they wish to live and prosper at the expense of others.

Good socialist doctrine. Of course if one thinks the purpose of one's life is for the sake of, "social progress," one ends up believing society (other people) exist for their sake.

A wrong premise always results in a wrong conclusion.