Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

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Veritas Aequitas
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Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZWp0bnMBbM
Matter is not fundamental to reality, MIND is.
And what if that mind had multiple personality disorder? Oh this rabbit hole goes DEEP...
Dr. Bernardo Kastrup is the executive director of Essentia Foundation. His work has been leading the modern renaissance of metaphysical idealism, the notion that reality is essentially mental.
He has a Ph.D. in philosophy (ontology, philosophy of mind)
and another Ph.D. in computer engineering (reconfigurable computing, artificial intelligence).
As a scientist, Bernardo has worked for the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN) and the Philips Research Laboratories (where the 'Casimir Effect' of Quantum Field Theory was discovered). He's written a ton of fascinating books; links, podcast and more:
To Bernardo Kastrup, materialism is a dead duck.
Why Materialism Is Baloney:
https://www.amazon.com/Why-Materialism- ... 1782793623
The present framing of the cultural debate in terms of materialism versus religion has allowed materialism to go unchallenged as the only rationally-viable metaphysics.
This book seeks to change this.
It uncovers the absurd implications of materialism and then, uniquely, presents a hard-nosed non-materialist metaphysics substantiated by skepticism, hard empirical evidence, and clear logical argumentation.
It lays out a coherent framework upon which one can interpret and make sense of every natural phenomenon and physical law, as well as the modalities of human consciousness, without materialist assumptions.
According to this framework, the brain is merely the image of a self-localization process of mind, analogously to how a whirlpool is the image of a self-localization process of water. The brain doesn't generate mind in the same way that a whirlpool doesn't generate water. It is the brain that is in mind, not mind in the brain.
Note my focus is on the point that reality is not independent of the human conditions and nothing else with the other views of Kastrup.
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Terrapin Station »

That should say: As a scientist, Bernardo has imagined or fantasized to himself that he has worked for the "European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN)" and the "Philips Research Laboratories" (where the 'Casimir Effect' of Quantum Field Theory was imagined by Bernardo). He's imagined that he's written a ton of fascinating "books."
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Terrapin Station
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Terrapin Station »

How the heck would it work that he believes there are things such as brains, by the way? That's an incoherent notion if only mind exists.
Eodnhoj7
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Eodnhoj7 »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 4:09 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZWp0bnMBbM
Matter is not fundamental to reality, MIND is.
And what if that mind had multiple personality disorder? Oh this rabbit hole goes DEEP...
Dr. Bernardo Kastrup is the executive director of Essentia Foundation. His work has been leading the modern renaissance of metaphysical idealism, the notion that reality is essentially mental.
He has a Ph.D. in philosophy (ontology, philosophy of mind)
and another Ph.D. in computer engineering (reconfigurable computing, artificial intelligence).
As a scientist, Bernardo has worked for the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN) and the Philips Research Laboratories (where the 'Casimir Effect' of Quantum Field Theory was discovered). He's written a ton of fascinating books; links, podcast and more:
To Bernardo Kastrup, materialism is a dead duck.
Why Materialism Is Baloney:
https://www.amazon.com/Why-Materialism- ... 1782793623
The present framing of the cultural debate in terms of materialism versus religion has allowed materialism to go unchallenged as the only rationally-viable metaphysics.
This book seeks to change this.
It uncovers the absurd implications of materialism and then, uniquely, presents a hard-nosed non-materialist metaphysics substantiated by skepticism, hard empirical evidence, and clear logical argumentation.
It lays out a coherent framework upon which one can interpret and make sense of every natural phenomenon and physical law, as well as the modalities of human consciousness, without materialist assumptions.
According to this framework, the brain is merely the image of a self-localization process of mind, analogously to how a whirlpool is the image of a self-localization process of water. The brain doesn't generate mind in the same way that a whirlpool doesn't generate water. It is the brain that is in mind, not mind in the brain.
Note my focus is on the point that reality is not independent of the human conditions and nothing else with the other views of Kastrup.
That would necessitate the mind as a thing in itself given the totality of being, as mind, cannot be observed. What is observed is change in the mind thus necessitate some mind as existing beyond some other mind.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Eodnhoj7 wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:06 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 4:09 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZWp0bnMBbM
Matter is not fundamental to reality, MIND is.
And what if that mind had multiple personality disorder? Oh this rabbit hole goes DEEP...
Dr. Bernardo Kastrup is the executive director of Essentia Foundation. His work has been leading the modern renaissance of metaphysical idealism, the notion that reality is essentially mental.
He has a Ph.D. in philosophy (ontology, philosophy of mind)
and another Ph.D. in computer engineering (reconfigurable computing, artificial intelligence).
As a scientist, Bernardo has worked for the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN) and the Philips Research Laboratories (where the 'Casimir Effect' of Quantum Field Theory was discovered). He's written a ton of fascinating books; links, podcast and more:
To Bernardo Kastrup, materialism is a dead duck.
Why Materialism Is Baloney:
https://www.amazon.com/Why-Materialism- ... 1782793623
The present framing of the cultural debate in terms of materialism versus religion has allowed materialism to go unchallenged as the only rationally-viable metaphysics.
This book seeks to change this.
It uncovers the absurd implications of materialism and then, uniquely, presents a hard-nosed non-materialist metaphysics substantiated by skepticism, hard empirical evidence, and clear logical argumentation.
It lays out a coherent framework upon which one can interpret and make sense of every natural phenomenon and physical law, as well as the modalities of human consciousness, without materialist assumptions.
According to this framework, the brain is merely the image of a self-localization process of mind, analogously to how a whirlpool is the image of a self-localization process of water. The brain doesn't generate mind in the same way that a whirlpool doesn't generate water. It is the brain that is in mind, not mind in the brain.
Note my focus is on the point that reality is not independent of the human conditions and nothing else with the other views of Kastrup.
That would necessitate the mind as a thing in itself given the totality of being, as mind, cannot be observed. What is observed is change in the mind thus necessitate some mind as existing beyond some other mind.
Don't assume Kastrup is that stupid he had not anticipated the problem of infinite regression.
If you listen to his video you will note he had taken care of the problem of infinite regression and therefrom further to conclude his theory.
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Eodnhoj7 »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:06 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 4:09 am



To Bernardo Kastrup, materialism is a dead duck.



Note my focus is on the point that reality is not independent of the human conditions and nothing else with the other views of Kastrup.
That would necessitate the mind as a thing in itself given the totality of being, as mind, cannot be observed. What is observed is change in the mind thus necessitate some mind as existing beyond some other mind.
Don't assume Kastrup is that stupid he had not anticipated the problem of infinite regression.
If you listen to his video you will note he had taken care of the problem of infinite regression and therefrom further to conclude his theory.
Infinite regression exists through the constant change of now.
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 am
Don't assume Kastrup is that stupid
The ideas he's forwarding, what he's taking to be good arguments for them, and the tenor of his communication does this for us, so that no assumption is necessary.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:11 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 am
Don't assume Kastrup is that stupid
The ideas he's forwarding, what he's taking to be good arguments for them, and the tenor of his communication does this for us, so that no assumption is necessary.
Have you understood Kastrup full argument before you arrive at your judgment?
Where is your counter argument?
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:03 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:11 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 am
Don't assume Kastrup is that stupid
The ideas he's forwarding, what he's taking to be good arguments for them, and the tenor of his communication does this for us, so that no assumption is necessary.
Have you understood Kastrup full argument before you arrive at your judgment?
Where is your counter argument?
I'm not typing thousands of words at a time. We can go bit by bit, because we're going to have to settle each point.

So first, given his so-called "Basic facts of reality," the first is: "There are tight correlations between a person’s reported private experiences and the observed brain activity of the person." This only has any significance if there actually are brains and we're not simply referring to a single (perhaps the only) person's imaginings. It only has any significance if there are actually brains in bodies situated in a world, etc., which means that realism is the case. If this isn't the case and it's just something that perhaps a solely-existing mind has occur as arbitrary mental phenomena--it's just an imagined brain that we're talking about, then there's no more significance to this supposed "fact" than if the person has imagined a correlation between their experiences and a particular (imagined, of course) penguin.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:11 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:03 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:11 pm
The ideas he's forwarding, what he's taking to be good arguments for them, and the tenor of his communication does this for us, so that no assumption is necessary.
Have you understood Kastrup full argument before you arrive at your judgment?
Where is your counter argument?
I'm not typing thousands of words at a time. We can go bit by bit, because we're going to have to settle each point.

So first, given his so-called "Basic facts of reality,"
the first is: "There are tight correlations between a person’s reported private experiences and the observed brain activity of the person."

This only has any significance if there actually are brains and we're not simply referring to a single (perhaps the only) person's imaginings.
It only has any significance if there are actually brains in bodies situated in a world, etc., which means that realism is the case.

If this isn't the case and it's just something that perhaps a solely-existing mind has occur as arbitrary mental phenomena--it's just an imagined brain that we're talking about, then there's no more significance to this supposed "fact" than if the person has imagined a correlation between their experiences and a particular (imagined, of course) penguin.
I am not sure of your point??

Note the Venn Diagram I presented in the other post.

Image

In terms of Venn Diagrams,
Circle-1 is totally inside the circle-2. i.e. circle-1 is totally subsumed within circle-2.

Circle-1 in this case are the "Basic facts of reality,"

Circle-2 is the mind with reality [all there is]. This is not related to the individual mind but rather the collective mind of humanity.

As such whatever are the basic facts of reality [1], they are totally subsumed within the collective-mind and reality [2].

Thus re Kastrup 'Everything is Mind' implied the "Basic facts of reality," which are independent [of things and individual minds] at one level, they are not independent of the collective 'mind'.
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:48 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:11 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:03 am
Have you understood Kastrup full argument before you arrive at your judgment?
Where is your counter argument?
I'm not typing thousands of words at a time. We can go bit by bit, because we're going to have to settle each point.

So first, given his so-called "Basic facts of reality,"
the first is: "There are tight correlations between a person’s reported private experiences and the observed brain activity of the person."

This only has any significance if there actually are brains and we're not simply referring to a single (perhaps the only) person's imaginings.
It only has any significance if there are actually brains in bodies situated in a world, etc., which means that realism is the case.

If this isn't the case and it's just something that perhaps a solely-existing mind has occur as arbitrary mental phenomena--it's just an imagined brain that we're talking about, then there's no more significance to this supposed "fact" than if the person has imagined a correlation between their experiences and a particular (imagined, of course) penguin.
I am not sure of your point??

Note the Venn Diagram I presented in the other post.

Image

In terms of Venn Diagrams,
Circle-1 is totally inside the circle-2. i.e. circle-1 is totally subsumed within circle-2.

Circle-1 in this case are the "Basic facts of reality,"

Circle-2 is the mind with reality [all there is]. This is not related to the individual mind but rather the collective mind of humanity.

As such whatever are the basic facts of reality [1], they are totally subsumed within the collective-mind and reality [2].

Thus re Kastrup 'Everything is Mind' implied the "Basic facts of reality," which are independent [of things and individual minds] at one level, they are not independent of the collective 'mind'.
In other words, you either didn't understand my comment, or you might as well act as if you didn't, and then you might as well just repeat some stuff you already said even though it has nothing to do with my comment.

Yeah, this is a great start to a discussion about what's wrong with Kastrup's argument. Too bad I didn't just go ahead and type thousands of words. lol
Belinda
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Belinda »

'Mind' or consciousness is not only quantitative it's also qualitative. States of consciousness vary in correlation with brain chemicals that are active at any specific time. Thus you have waking consciousness, hallucinatory consciousness, sleeping consciousness, and dreaming consciousness.This scientific study of correlations between brain and mind tend very much to demonstrate that besides subjective states of conscioousness there is also something material i.e. brain chemicals.

Dreaming itself varies at least between dreaming where the ego is present and dreaming where the ego is absent. Qualia also vary according to the dreaming experience; some dreaming does not include sounds: dream sleep sometimes includes intelligible even reasoned utterances, more often not.Some dream qualia and/or some hallucinations exclude smell qualia , and some exclude touch qualia.

Waking consciousness might include two or more separated 'personalities', more often includes one personality.This fact might indicate to an idealist that it is 'personality' or consciousness that makes reality. However the fact of multiple personalities might also indicate some subject's several selection criteria in place of the single criterion we normally use. Doctor Jekyll had always the potential to become Mr Hyde and vice versa.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:41 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:48 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:11 am
I'm not typing thousands of words at a time. We can go bit by bit, because we're going to have to settle each point.

So first, given his so-called "Basic facts of reality,"
the first is: "There are tight correlations between a person’s reported private experiences and the observed brain activity of the person."

This only has any significance if there actually are brains and we're not simply referring to a single (perhaps the only) person's imaginings.
It only has any significance if there are actually brains in bodies situated in a world, etc., which means that realism is the case.

If this isn't the case and it's just something that perhaps a solely-existing mind has occur as arbitrary mental phenomena--it's just an imagined brain that we're talking about, then there's no more significance to this supposed "fact" than if the person has imagined a correlation between their experiences and a particular (imagined, of course) penguin.
I am not sure of your point??

Note the Venn Diagram I presented in the other post.

Image

In terms of Venn Diagrams,
Circle-1 is totally inside the circle-2. i.e. circle-1 is totally subsumed within circle-2.

Circle-1 in this case are the "Basic facts of reality,"

Circle-2 is the mind with reality [all there is]. This is not related to the individual mind but rather the collective mind of humanity.

As such whatever are the basic facts of reality [1], they are totally subsumed within the collective-mind and reality [2].

Thus re Kastrup 'Everything is Mind' implied the "Basic facts of reality," which are independent [of things and individual minds] at one level, they are not independent of the collective 'mind'.
In other words, you either didn't understand my comment, or you might as well act as if you didn't, and then you might as well just repeat some stuff you already said even though it has nothing to do with my comment.

Yeah, this is a great start to a discussion about what's wrong with Kastrup's argument. Too bad I didn't just go ahead and type thousands of words. lol
My responses above is the answer to your first question, i.e. if there is mind ONLY, then there is no brains.

Point is you are too confused with your dogmatic perspective, you are not able to see [not necessary agree with] other perspectives.

Note Kastrup's argument,
"the brain is in the mind, not the mind is in the brain"
therefore if there is a mind only, then there is also the brain which is in the mind.

Note "in" is not to be taken literally but in term of the Venn Diagrams explanations I had given above.
In addition, 'mind' it not the conventional definition of mind you are stuck with.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Belinda wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:35 am 'Mind' or consciousness is not only quantitative it's also qualitative. States of consciousness vary in correlation with brain chemicals that are active at any specific time. Thus you have waking consciousness, hallucinatory consciousness, sleeping consciousness, and dreaming consciousness.This scientific study of correlations between brain and mind tend very much to demonstrate that besides subjective states of conscioousness there is also something material i.e. brain chemicals.

Dreaming itself varies at least between dreaming where the ego is present and dreaming where the ego is absent. Qualia also vary according to the dreaming experience; some dreaming does not include sounds: dream sleep sometimes includes intelligible even reasoned utterances, more often not.Some dream qualia and/or some hallucinations exclude smell qualia , and some exclude touch qualia.

Waking consciousness might include two or more separated 'personalities', more often includes one personality.This fact might indicate to an idealist that it is 'personality' or consciousness that makes reality. However the fact of multiple personalities might also indicate some subject's several selection criteria in place of the single criterion we normally use. Doctor Jekyll had always the potential to become Mr Hyde and vice versa.
Noted the above but not sure what is your point to the OP.

In the OP, Kastrup claimed,
1. the realists' idea of materialism [physicalism] i.e. reality is independent of the human mind, is baloney.
2. Kastrup claimed that the whole of reality is an image [representation] of the mind [not the individual's mind but the collective mind of humanity]. This is a meta-epistemological view of reality.
Kastrup wrote:According to this framework, the brain is merely the image of a self-localization process of mind, analogously to how a whirlpool is the image of a self-localization process of water. The brain doesn't generate mind in the same way that a whirlpool doesn't generate water.
It is the brain that is in mind, not mind in the brain.
Belinda
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Re: Bernardo Kastrup: Everything is Mind

Post by Belinda »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 4:43 am
Belinda wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 11:35 am 'Mind' or consciousness is not only quantitative it's also qualitative. States of consciousness vary in correlation with brain chemicals that are active at any specific time. Thus you have waking consciousness, hallucinatory consciousness, sleeping consciousness, and dreaming consciousness.This scientific study of correlations between brain and mind tend very much to demonstrate that besides subjective states of conscioousness there is also something material i.e. brain chemicals.

Dreaming itself varies at least between dreaming where the ego is present and dreaming where the ego is absent. Qualia also vary according to the dreaming experience; some dreaming does not include sounds: dream sleep sometimes includes intelligible even reasoned utterances, more often not.Some dream qualia and/or some hallucinations exclude smell qualia , and some exclude touch qualia.

Waking consciousness might include two or more separated 'personalities', more often includes one personality.This fact might indicate to an idealist that it is 'personality' or consciousness that makes reality. However the fact of multiple personalities might also indicate some subject's several selection criteria in place of the single criterion we normally use. Doctor Jekyll had always the potential to become Mr Hyde and vice versa.
Noted the above but not sure what is your point to the OP.

In the OP, Kastrup claimed,
1. the realists' idea of materialism [physicalism] i.e. reality is independent of the human mind, is baloney.
2. Kastrup claimed that the whole of reality is an image [representation] of the mind [not the individual's mind but the collective mind of humanity]. This is a meta-epistemological view of reality.
Kastrup wrote:According to this framework, the brain is merely the image of a self-localization process of mind, analogously to how a whirlpool is the image of a self-localization process of water. The brain doesn't generate mind in the same way that a whirlpool doesn't generate water.
It is the brain that is in mind, not mind in the brain.
I will make my point more precise.

"Mind" is consciousness. Consciousness is not all one state but is several states of being each of which correlates with a brain state governed by neurochemicals. It seems silly to ignore constant correlations between consciousness and brain states.
It follows that neither mind not matter is metaphysically primary. It does follow that both mind and matter are equally ontic attributes of nature.
Kastrup claimed that the whole of reality is an image [representation] of the mind [not the individual's mind but the collective mind of humanity].
Does that mean the "image" is all one image, or does it mean that the "image" is a composite of all images that have ever been and even will be ?
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