Hermeneutics: Applications?

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Skepdick
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Skepdick »

Terrapin Station wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:48 am Standard definition of "perception" - "the ability to see, hear, or become aware of something through the senses."
This is the error of all Western Philosophy and Logocentrism.

You keep confusing your nouns and your verbs.

Perception is a noun.
Perceiving is a verb.

Perceiving comes before perception.

Western Philosophy is eternally fucked for choosing to ignore system dynamics. Time.
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Sculptor
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Sculptor »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:14 am
Sculptor wrote: Thu Apr 01, 2021 3:53 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Tue Mar 30, 2021 12:05 pm Here is a video on a short Intro to Hermeneutics.

Hermeneutics: A Very Short Introduction
Jens Zimmermann
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wPTV5hyB0Y

Do you agree with the subject of Hermeneutics for philosophical discussions?
Unless you use it to unpack your assumptions, rather than reinforce them it is useless as all it does is send you down in an ever decreasing spiral to the hell of your own misconceptions.
The history of Hermeneutics, has been mostly used in that great time wasting activity biblical interpretation. This is the perfect example of never escaping your prejudices and assumptions.

However in the modern world the "hermeneutic circle" has been modifed and revived in a more useful and tool for self examination and personal skepticism.
Here we can look at the usual suspects such as Heidegger, Gadamer and Derrida.
Why are so jumpy into biblical issues re hermeneutics?
Because you there is not much point in searching for the truth in a book of fiction.

... garbage...

I noted you are totally ignorant of what is 'hermeneutics-proper' which lead to all your interpretation of what is reality as fatuous.
You obviously know nothing about it. But that is not surprising since you know nothing at all about anything.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Angelo Cannata wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:42 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:02 am You should go back to philosophical kindergarten to start learning 'what is perception'.
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:14 am I noted you are totally ignorant of what is 'hermeneutics-proper' which lead to all your interpretation of what is reality as fatuous.
Is this forum moderated by anybody?
Veritas Aequitas, how do you evaluate these words of yours?
I believe you have not seen those that are very much worst than the above yet that are directed at me. Normally I do not start the tit-for-tat unless it is initiated by the other party. In any case the above is not a personal attack but at least will prompt them to research further.
Last edited by Veritas Aequitas on Sat Apr 03, 2021 7:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:48 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:02 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Thu Apr 01, 2021 1:16 pm
Not my perception. That's not how my brain works. I perceive things all the time where I apply no concepts, names, etc. to them--where I have zero thoughts about them, aside for a low-level awareness that that nameless, etc. stuff is present--if you'd call that "thought."
ditto Skepdick's :!: :?:

You should go back to philosophical kindergarten to start learning 'what is perception'.
Standard definition of "perception" - "the ability to see, hear, or become aware of something through the senses."
You forgot this is a philosophy forum?
Your response above entailed more details than what is the standard definition.
Note,
  • Perception is not only the passive receipt of these signals, but it's also shaped by the recipient's learning, memory, expectation, and attention.[4][5] Sensory input is a process that transforms this low-level information to higher-level information (e.g., extracts shapes for object recognition).[5]
    The process that follows connects a person's concepts and expectations (or knowledge), restorative and selective mechanisms (such as attention) that influence perception.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perception
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Terrapin Station
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 4:21 am
  • Perception is not only the passive receipt of these signals, but it's also shaped by the recipient's learning, memory, expectation, and attention.[4][5]
The connotations of the term include that, but those are not necessary connotations (of the conventional usage of the term in philosophical contexts).
Skepdick
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Skepdick »

Terrapin Station wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 10:30 am The connotations of the term include that, but those are not necessary connotations (of the conventional usage of the term in philosophical contexts).
That's a normative view-point.

The verb/noun distinction produces different philosophical contexts.

You seem biased towards the Western one.
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 10:30 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 4:21 am
  • Perception is not only the passive receipt of these signals, but it's also shaped by the recipient's learning, memory, expectation, and attention.[4][5]
The connotations of the term include that, but those are not necessary connotations (of the conventional usage of the term in philosophical contexts).
You are simply eeling your way out without reference to the original issue, i.e.
Terrapin Station wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 9:32 am
Angelo Cannata wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:52 am How can we talk about "raw perception" since, as soon as we perceive our awareness of perceiving something, we must admit that we are using our brain, so that we are biased, conditioned by it?
So first, the idea isn't that we'd not be using our brains. We're still talking about perception. The question was "Do you not agree that we can perceive things without applying concepts, without assigning names for those things, etc.?"
Point is all normal people perceived things with concepts [of nature and nurture] embedded in the brain as 'Angelo' had implied and I agreed with that.

Note philosophically, [mine]
  • Pure concepts of the understanding(Categories)
    A pure concept of the understanding, or category, is a characteristic, predicate, attribute, quality, or property of any possible object, that is, an object in general or as such. These concepts are not abstractions of what is common to several perceived, particular, individual objects, as are empirical concepts.
    "Since the categories are a priori and are therefore not abstractions from sense perceptions, they owe their origin to the very nature of the mind itself." (29)
    They are not derived from perceptions of external objects, as are empirical concepts. Instead, they are the result of the way that the mind is constituted or formed. They come from within the mind [via evolution], not from outside of the mind.
    -wiki
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Terrapin Station
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:52 am Point is all normal people perceived things with concepts [of nature and nurture] embedded in the brain as 'Angelo' had implied and I agreed with that.
What empirical evidence are you appealing to re how most people perceive? (And why would how most people perceive be relevant here?)
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:06 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:52 am Point is all normal people perceived things with concepts [of nature and nurture] embedded in the brain as 'Angelo' had implied and I agreed with that.
What empirical evidence are you appealing to re how most people perceive? (And why would how most people perceive be relevant here?)
I stated ALL people [normal human beings] not 'most'.
I am referring to the perception of ALL possible empirical evidences.

Your point is you [implied all normal human] can perceive without concepts which is ridiculous. You have not explained you claim yet.
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Terrapin Station
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Terrapin Station »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:13 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:06 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:52 am Point is all normal people perceived things with concepts [of nature and nurture] embedded in the brain as 'Angelo' had implied and I agreed with that.
What empirical evidence are you appealing to re how most people perceive? (And why would how most people perceive be relevant here?)
I stated ALL people [normal human beings] not 'most'.
I am referring to the perception of ALL possible empirical evidences.

Your point is you [implied all normal human] can perceive without concepts which is ridiculous. You have not explained you claim yet.
The evidence you're using?
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Sculptor »

Angelo Cannata wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:42 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:02 am You should go back to philosophical kindergarten to start learning 'what is perception'.
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:14 am I noted you are totally ignorant of what is 'hermeneutics-proper' which lead to all your interpretation of what is reality as fatuous.
Is this forum moderated by anybody?
Veritas Aequitas, how do you evaluate these words of yours?
He has taken to routinely insulting those people with whom his "argument", I might say his obsession abiout moral objectivity, has gained no traction.
Rather than take on and respond to their criticisms, he merely repeats the old arguments and calls people ignorant.
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Sculptor »

Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:13 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:06 pm
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 6:52 am Point is all normal people perceived things with concepts [of nature and nurture] embedded in the brain as 'Angelo' had implied and I agreed with that.
What empirical evidence are you appealing to re how most people perceive? (And why would how most people perceive be relevant here?)
I stated ALL people [normal human beings] not 'most'.
I am referring to the perception of ALL possible empirical evidences.

Your point is you [implied all normal human] can perceive without concepts which is ridiculous. You have not explained you claim yet.
Evidence please!
commonsense
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by commonsense »

Anyone,

Can anything be rationally deduced and concluded to be true without empirical evidence?
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

Terrapin Station wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:24 am
Veritas Aequitas wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 6:13 am
Terrapin Station wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:06 pm

What empirical evidence are you appealing to re how most people perceive? (And why would how most people perceive be relevant here?)
I stated ALL people [normal human beings] not 'most'.
I am referring to the perception of ALL possible empirical evidences.

Your point is you [implied all normal human] can perceive without concepts which is ridiculous. You have not explained you claim yet.
The evidence you're using?
You are getting blur.

It is common knowledge at present.

I have already linked this;
Perception is not only the passive receipt of these signals, but it's also shaped by the recipient's learning, memory, expectation, and attention.[4][5] Sensory input is a process that transforms this low-level information to higher-level information (e.g., extracts shapes for object recognition).[5]
The process that follows connects a person's concepts and expectations (or knowledge), restorative and selective mechanisms (such as attention) that influence perception.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perception.
Veritas Aequitas
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Re: Hermeneutics: Applications?

Post by Veritas Aequitas »

commonsense wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:15 pm Anyone,

Can anything be rationally deduced and concluded to be true without empirical evidence?
There are various meanings of 'true'.
1. One is conformance with reality, i.e. real.
2. The other is accurate and exact, e.g. in pure mathematics, logic,

The second do not need empirical evidence.
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