OK. Whatever floats your boat. More power to you.Skepdick wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:16 pmI don't believe in identities outside of logic/mathematics.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:14 pm All those things are "identities." Either you believe we have identities or you don't. But without them you can barely form a sentence.
I am busy forming sentences.
Identity is not necessary. It's just another one of those Dogmas of Logic/Mathematics that has carried over into our daily lives.
Philosophy Clan
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Gary Childress
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Re: Philosophy Clan
Re: Philosophy Clan
More power indeed. If you want to empower yourself, abandon the stupid idea of "identity".
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Gary Childress
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Re: Philosophy Clan
Re: Philosophy Clan
Maybe that's why you invented your identity?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:30 pm I don't need any more power at the moment. I have plenty. I have all I want and all I care to have. And I have an identity.
So you can limit your own power.
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Gary Childress
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Re: Philosophy Clan
What do I need more power for? If I have all I want and care to have, then that is plenty.Skepdick wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:33 pmMaybe that's why you invented your identity?Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:30 pm I don't need any more power at the moment. I have plenty. I have all I want and all I care to have. And I have an identity.
So you can limit your own power.
Re: Philosophy Clan
If you don't want it then you don't need it.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:34 pm What do I need more power for? If I have all I want and care to have, then that is plenty.
If you want to do things that have never been done before (say cure cancer), then you absolutely need it.
But you don't want it.
Last edited by Skepdick on Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Gary Childress
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Re: Philosophy Clan
So are you saying you need more power, then?Skepdick wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:38 pmIf you don't want it then you don't need it.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:34 pm What do I need more power for? If I have all I want and care to have, then that is plenty.
But if you want to cure cancer, then you need it.
But you don't want it.
Re: Philosophy Clan
There is no "then".
Our inability to cure cancer IS lack of power.
Lack of knowledge.
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Gary Childress
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Re: Philosophy Clan
If you have cancer or are a researcher looking for a cure for cancer, then more power to you. Otherwise, I don't understand the reference to cancer. We all have what power we are allowed or allotted. We can exchange it between each other and whatever else we can do with it and we have identities based on that state of affairs (along with identities based on other states of affairs).
Re: Philosophy Clan
Who is it that allows or allots?
Identities are based on stories. A person can have a name and a history and a family and a job, etc., without being tangled up in some story of identity. Such a person can be free to be and do much more because he doesn't say, "No, this is who I am, and this is all I can do, and this is what is expected of me." Identities, on the other hand, are used to pretend or to limit.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:55 pmand we have identities based on that state of affairs (along with identities based on other states of affairs).
Last edited by Lacewing on Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Philosophy Clan
That's not true at all. Knowledge is power. To amass more knowledge is to amass more power.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:55 pm If you have cancer or are a researcher looking for a cure for cancer, then more power to you. Otherwise, I don't understand the reference to cancer. We all have what power we are allowed or allotted.
I was certainly not born allotted any knowledge. Learning happened.
Exchanging knowledge is not a zero-sum game. When you teach me something I didn't know you haven't lost that knowledge.Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:55 pm We can exchange it between each other and whatever else we can do with it and we have identities based on that state of affairs (along with identities based on other states of affairs).
You have replicated it.
Re: Philosophy Clan
[quote=Lacewing post_id=503609 time=1616427539 user_id=11228]
[quote="Gary Childress" post_id=503584 time=1616417745 user_id=6477]
We all have what power we are allowed or allotted.[/quote]
Who is it that allows or allots?
[quote="Gary Childress" post_id=503584 time=1616417745 user_id=6477]and we have identities based on that state of affairs (along with identities based on other states of affairs).
[/quote]
Identities are based on stories. A person can have a name and a history and a family and a job, etc., without being tangled up in some story of identity. Such a person can be free to be and do much more because he doesn't say, "No, this is who I am, and this is all I can do, and this is what is expected of me." Identities, on the other hand, are used to pretend or to limit.
[/quote]
"You" are the story you tell yourself about how you fit into the world.
[quote="Gary Childress" post_id=503584 time=1616417745 user_id=6477]
We all have what power we are allowed or allotted.[/quote]
Who is it that allows or allots?
[quote="Gary Childress" post_id=503584 time=1616417745 user_id=6477]and we have identities based on that state of affairs (along with identities based on other states of affairs).
[/quote]
Identities are based on stories. A person can have a name and a history and a family and a job, etc., without being tangled up in some story of identity. Such a person can be free to be and do much more because he doesn't say, "No, this is who I am, and this is all I can do, and this is what is expected of me." Identities, on the other hand, are used to pretend or to limit.
[/quote]
"You" are the story you tell yourself about how you fit into the world.
Re: Philosophy Clan
No, that's just your identity.
I am Skepdick.
I fit into the world by virtue of existing.
Last edited by Skepdick on Mon Mar 22, 2021 5:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Philosophy Clan
>That's not true at all. Knowledge is power. To amass more knowledge is to amass more power.
That's only true to a point, then it's untrue. You're more wrong than right. There's a sorting problem for finite beings. Also most knowledge will be irrelevant to a given specific situation, and you don't know what those situations will be.
>Exchanging knowledge is not a zero-sum game. When you teach me something I didn't know you haven't lost that knowledge.
>You have replicated it.
Even now, many seconds later, we are still finite beings, and that means absolute limits, and that means it is a zero-sum game. We can only fit so much information in there and it's hard to ensure good supplants bad.
That's only true to a point, then it's untrue. You're more wrong than right. There's a sorting problem for finite beings. Also most knowledge will be irrelevant to a given specific situation, and you don't know what those situations will be.
>Exchanging knowledge is not a zero-sum game. When you teach me something I didn't know you haven't lost that knowledge.
>You have replicated it.
Even now, many seconds later, we are still finite beings, and that means absolute limits, and that means it is a zero-sum game. We can only fit so much information in there and it's hard to ensure good supplants bad.
Re: Philosophy Clan
[quote=Skepdick post_id=503620 time=1616429819 user_id=17350]
[quote=Advocate post_id=503618 time=1616429580 user_id=15238]
"You" are the story you tell yourself about how you fit into the world.
[/quote]
No, that's just your identity.
I am I. I fit into the world by virtue of existing.
[/quote]
The exterior you that you're referring to is only you to you to the extent you claim it. Ever hear of body dysmorphia? There's no exact limit to where you end, it must be chosen. Ends, including boundaries, only exist in minds.
[quote=Advocate post_id=503618 time=1616429580 user_id=15238]
"You" are the story you tell yourself about how you fit into the world.
[/quote]
No, that's just your identity.
I am I. I fit into the world by virtue of existing.
[/quote]
The exterior you that you're referring to is only you to you to the extent you claim it. Ever hear of body dysmorphia? There's no exact limit to where you end, it must be chosen. Ends, including boundaries, only exist in minds.