There are No Things-in-Themselves

[Veritas Aequitas]

Here is one discussion and justification that claimed 'there are no things-in-themselves'

In the most basic, what Kant implied with things-in-themselves is things do not exist by themselves if there are no humans around to interact and actualize things.
To Kant whatever things exists, they exists as things-by-human_selves NEVER by "themselves" pre-existingly.

Thus what Kant meant is whatever are things existing as real, we cannot extricate the human elements from their existence.

For example you exists only as an empirical self and physically but not as person-in-itself as in an independent non-empirical soul that survives physical death.

If nothing is inseperable from human observation and one human observation is seperate from another, then things exist as separable from some human observation.
...

Point is;
1. At the ultimate level -U, nothing is separable from human existences [ not observation].
2. At the sub-level of U,- common and conventional perspectives, things are separable from human observations.
3. Since level-U overrides all, there is no thing existing as separable from human existence.

Note the analogy [dualism and monism] of the Pando Tree.

Pando (Latin for "I spread"), also known as the trembling giant,[1] is a clonal colony of an individual male quaking aspen (Populus tremuloides) determined to be a single living organism by identical genetic markers[2] and assumed to have one massive underground root system.

The clonal colony encompasses 43.6 hectares (108 acres), weighs nearly 6,000 metric tons (6,600 short tons), and has over 40,000 stems (trunks), which die individually and are replaced by new stems growing from its roots.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pando_(tree)

Here one will obvious see 40,000+ individual trees but actually they are all tree trunks from one root system.

In this case there is no tree-in-itself but trees-by-same-root-system.

The above analogy is similar to reality and its varied things.
The dualism and monism of reality is not as obvious as the analogy of the pando tree but the principles are the same.

What is reality is held by human consciousness on the collective basis and there is no thing-in-itself that is independent of that collective human consciousness.
Btw, that collective human consciousness is not a consciousness-in-itself - like a God.

Like the collective consciousness of a symphony orchestra, where if no collection of humans organized as an orchestra, then there is no orchestra,
thus, if there are no humans there is no collective human consciousness in itself.

As such there are no independent external things-in-themselves, there are only things-by-the_collective-human-consciousness.

The above limit to one claiming there is a soul-in-itself that can survives physical death and a God-in-itself that exists by itself independent of humans and the universe.

[Eodnhoj7]

Here is one discussion and justification that claimed 'there are no things-in-themselves'

In the most basic, what Kant implied with things-in-themselves is things do not exist by themselves if there are no humans around to interact and actualize things.
To Kant whatever things exists, they exists as things-by-human_selves NEVER by "themselves" pre-existingly.

Thus what Kant meant is whatever are things existing as real, we cannot extricate the human elements from their existence.

For example you exists only as an empirical self and physically but not as person-in-itself as in an independent non-empirical soul that survives physical death.

If nothing is inseperable from human observation and one human observation is seperate from another, then things exist as separable from some human observation.
...

Point is;
1. At the ultimate level -U, nothing is separable from human existences [ not observation].
2. At the sub-level of U,- common and conventional perspectives, things are separable from human observations.
3. Since level-U overrides all, there is no thing existing as separable from human existence.

Note the analogy [dualism and monism] of the Pando Tree.

Pando (Latin for "I spread"), also known as the trembling giant,[1] is a clonal colony of an individual male quaking aspen (Populus tremuloides) determined to be a single living organism by identical genetic markers[2] and assumed to have one massive underground root system.

The clonal colony encompasses 43.6 hectares (108 acres), weighs nearly 6,000 metric tons (6,600 short tons), and has over 40,000 stems (trunks), which die individually and are replaced by new stems growing from its roots.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pando_(tree)

Here one will obvious see 40,000+ individual trees but actually they are all tree trunks from one root system.

In this case there is no tree-in-itself but trees-by-same-root-system.

The above analogy is similar to reality and its varied things.
The dualism and monism of reality is not as obvious as the analogy of the pando tree but the principles are the same.

What is reality is held by human consciousness on the collective basis and there is no thing-in-itself that is independent of that collective human consciousness.
Btw, that collective human consciousness is not a consciousness-in-itself - like a God.

Like the collective consciousness of a symphony orchestra, where if no collection of humans organized as an orchestra, then there is no orchestra,
thus, if there are no humans there is no collective human consciousness in itself.

As such there are no independent external things-in-themselves, there are only things-by-the_collective-human-consciousness.

The above limit to one claiming there is a soul-in-itself that can survives physical death and a God-in-itself that exists by itself independent of humans and the universe.

You are falsely claiming that the soul exists in itself considering it it dependent upon the dimensions it progresses towards. If the soul survives and the soul survives through multiple dimensions then the soul does not exist in itself. Dimensions beyond this one necessitates the soul's migration to other facets of reality given the soul is pure observation, it is pure consciousness as pure observation. This pure observation occurs through the context in which it exists as observation is the mirroring of contexts, to observe something is to mirror it. The soul mirrors the dimensions of reality in which it exists.


And to repeat:

Existence is independent of human awareness through degrees. It is these degrees of awareness, where one human consciousness is seperate from another, which necessitates that being is independent of human awareness through degrees.

Dually collective human consciousness is empty in itself, and I am repeating this, thus necessitating some being observed beyond it as self aware. In simpler terms the totality of being as observing itself is independent of human awareness given the totality of being cannot be observed through human awareness. Things may not exist except through observation but this observation is not limited to human awareness. The relation between humans and collective human consciousness is a consciousness in itself thus a contradiction occurs given it as a phenomenon is empty and dependent upon something beyond it.