Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:59 am
I had opened the following threads;
As usual those who opposed will argue the above is absurd because they interpret that I am claiming humans literally and physically created the whole universe like humans created physical objects like furniture, motor vehicles, airplanes, ships, trains, building, and the likes.
I had emphasized and I did NOT say humans literally or physically created the entire universe somehow. Don't associate my sense of co-creating with the above.
What I am stating is the emergence of the existence of reality [creation of] is inevitably entangled with the human conditions.
But, when you claim "the emergence of the existence of reality [creation of] is inevitably entangled with the human conditions" are you also claiming that human beings have been around for as long as 'the existence of reality' has?
If yes, then could you be wrong?
But, if you are not claiming this, then the words "inevitably entangled" has a very strong inclination to mean that you are stating that human beings have been around since existence has.
Maybe you would like to clear up this apparent contradiction to 'us', readers? Or, do you REALLY BELIEVE that "the human condition", which means human beings, have "inevitably entangled" with "the emergence of the existence of reality [creation or]" for as long as "the emergence of reality [creation of] has been around for?
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:59 am
As such, humans are co-creators of the reality they are part and parcel of.
Seriously what could be more SIMPLE than this FACT.
Existence, Itself, has been around for longer than human beings have. This One and ONLY Universe, which is existing, and was existing before human beings were created, through evolution, creates EVERY thing, including 'you', human beings. Now, human beings, like other animals, can can also create 'things'. Thee Universe is NOT the only creator. Thee Universe is thee Creator of EVERY thing, and, human beings are just the creator of whatever 'it' is that they have created.
Therefore, the 'reality' that human beings live in 'now', when this is being written, that is; this human being created stressful, war-torn, warring, and pollution-riddled "world", which they have created for themselves on earth, could be argued to be a co-created "reality" that they are part and parcel. This is because thee Universe, Itself created the earth that they exist upon, and it is 'you', adult human beings, who have created that way of life that 'you' are ALL really living in now.
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:59 am
If anyone claimed otherwise, one cannot prove there is an existing independent-of-human-mind external world - reality-in-itself.
Could you use more sufficient words to explain "yourself" better?
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:59 am
So, prove to me reality-in-itself exists independent of human conditions and I will withdraw my claim.
Do you agree that there was 'an existence, or 'a reality-in-itself', BEFORE 'you', human beings, evolved and came along, and thus BEFORE ANY human, so called, "condition" could have evolved and came along also?
If yes, then what other proof do 'you' want that 'reality-in-itself' existed BEFORE, and thus independent, of human conditions?
But, if you do not agree with this, then I think it is up to you to prove otherwise.
What is an OBVIOUS FACT does NOT 'need' PROVING. But if ANY one wants PROOF that there was an existence/reality-in-itself independent of, or before, human conditions, then this is PROVE by that one's own existence.
No human being just magically appeared out of NOWHERE. Each and EVERY human being came about because of prior existing conditions, otherwise known as 'reality-in-itself independent of human conditions'.
Surely, this is NOT to hard to understand at all. Or, is it?