What are we going to do when oil finishes?

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gaffo
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

Immanuel Can wrote: Sat Aug 29, 2020 2:26 am
bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:26 pm We will finish the oil in 200 years...
200 years ago, the hot technology was coal.

You want us to surmise that no new technologies will come along in the next 200, and we'll just run dry?

Well, let's imagine it will be so. In that case, "we" are not going to do anything about that. Because you and I are not going to be alive then, or for a long time before then. So you'd best ask people in another 150 years what their plans are. Of all the things we have to worry about, this is waaaaaaaaay down the list.
refer to my -

Coal

Nuclear

as the only options left in 3000 ad.
gaffo
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

my memory is poor, but pretty sure Harrison also wrote the short "rollarball Murder" which was made into another good movie in the mid 70's.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Immanuel Can »

gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:14 am Coal

Nuclear

as the only options left in 3000 ad.
Well, you and I are in no position to worry about what happens in 3,000 AD. We haven't the foggiest idea if such a year will even come, and if it does, what technologies will exist then.
gaffo
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:43 am
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:14 am Coal

Nuclear

as the only options left in 3000 ad.
Well, you and I are in no position to worry about what happens in 3,000 AD.

no to worry, but i think your attitude is flipant (i'll be dead so who give a fuck)

I don;t give much a fuck, becuase like a say i'll be dead, but i do give 1/10th a fuck, because there will be billions of folks living here 1000 hence (I assume since we had similar living here 1000 times that timeline in the past - back a million years).

if you can show me that there will not be billions living here in 1000 yrs - show me, provide your evidence.


Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:43 am We haven't the foggiest idea if such a year will even come,
we don't? i know (can't speak for you)

Earth is 4.6 billion yrs old, the chance it will make it to 4,600,001,000 is damn near 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 percent.


Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 1:43 am and if it does, what technologies will exist then.
don't worship Tech - its not a Religion (though i think the modern culture has replaced the former YHWH with Tech to solve all things.

"tech" - since the last 70 yrs has been in only 3 fields, first nuclear late 40s (fission then fusion), Integrated curcuit (CPUs) - since the mid 60s', and Genetic engineering - since the 80's.

that is not a global tech (the internal combustion engine is the same as it was 100 yrs ago - jet engine is the same since 70 yrs ago, rockets the same since 60 yrs ago).

no, tech will not be the savour of man.
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Immanuel Can
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Immanuel Can »

gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:00 am no to worry, but i think your attitude is plipant (i'll be dead so who give a fuck) I don;t give much a fuck, becuase like a say i'll be dead, but i do give 1/10th a fuck, because there will be billions of folks living here 1000 hence (I assume since we had similar living here 1000 times that timeline in the past - back a million years).
You missed my point completely. It doesn't matter how many people will or will not be alive then, or even if they will. YOU WILL NOT. So your decisions really change nothing, and you have no idea what technologies could exist then.
no, tech will not be the savour of man.
Saviour? Of course not.

Again, not the point.

Whether the technology of a thousand years from now will or will not make things better, we are in no position to know. That's all.
gaffo
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

Immanuel Can wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:05 am
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:00 am no to worry, but i think your attitude is plipant (i'll be dead so who give a fuck) I don;t give much a fuck, becuase like a say i'll be dead, but i do give 1/10th a fuck, because there will be billions of folks living here 1000 hence (I assume since we had similar living here 1000 times that timeline in the past - back a million years).
You missed my point completely. It doesn't matter how many people will or will not be alive then, or even if they will. YOU WILL NOT. So your decisions really change nothing, and you have no idea what technologies could exist then.
no, tech will not be the savour of man.
Saviour? Of course not.

Again, not the point.

Whether the technology of a thousand years from now will or will not make things better, we are in no position to know. That's all.
ok, i do not worship tech, and doubt there will one.

i wish the best to the future pop.
Age
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Age »

bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:08 pm Our economy, life, and everything else related to humanity depend on oil.
Are you absolutely SURE about this?

To me, 'our', human life, and everything else related to humanity and what humanity is actually depended upon is NOT oil at all. But rather, Air, which is clean enough, Water, which is also clean enough, enough Nutrients, Love, which is just the right kind of attention, and a home, which is what Earth is.

The economy depends only on greed.
bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:08 pm We are overpopulated and managed to reach this population due to the existence of an easy access fuel.
Is this the only reason why human beings reached 'overpopulation'?

If yes, then a perfect resolution for 'over'-population would be having NO easy access to fuel, like oil. So, when oil is depleted, then this can only be of benefit for earth and Nature, Itself.

Nature, after all, takes care of Its Self. Everything exists better when in harmony, which is when Everything is in equilibrium. So, if oil is what, supposedly, caused human 'over'-population, then, when there is no more oil, then human beings can NOT 'over'-populate, which will put them in more equilibrium with the very 'thing', which they NEED to keep living. That is; Earth, Itself.
bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:08 pm What are we going to do when oil finishes?
Keep living, just without oil.

Why? What are 'you' going to do when oil finishes?
Age
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Age »

Immanuel Can wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:19 pm
bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:08 pm Our economy, life, and everything else related to humanity depend on oil. We are overpopulated and managed to reach this population due to the existence of an easy access fuel. What are we going to do when oil finishes?
It won't for two reasons. One is that the human population will tail off, not increase forever, especially as the Developing World reaches minimum prosperity and education levels. The other is that there has been discovered more oil reserves in the last 50 years than in all the previous centuries combined. We're kind of awash in the stuff right now.

So we should pick something to worry about that's actually going to happen.
Just because more oil was found in the last fifty years, then previously before, then that does NOT obviously mean that there is an infinite supply of oil, and human beings are "awash in the stuff", forever more.

Also, human beings will NEVER 'run out of oil'. Not because of the reasons you gave but because human beings are so greedy, that the last gallon of oil left on earth would be worth so much no one will want to use it up. Human beings can be, literally, this STUPID when it comes to money and greed.
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Age »

bahman wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:41 pm
Impenitent wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:33 pm environmentalists can gleefully run on hamster wheels to generate electricity...

-Imp
You think they can provide electricity for 10 billion people.
Human beings do NOT 'need' electricity to live. 10, 20, 30, 100, 200, or more billion human beings can live WITHOUT electricity. Human beings, after all, have so far lived for one or 2 million years without electricity, so I am pretty sure they could live for a few more decades, centuries, or thousands of years WITHOUT electricity.

Besides that, have you not heard of the sun, the wind, thermal heat, ocean swells, ocean tides, and magnetism, to provide electricity?
gaffo
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:18 am

To me, 'our', human life, and everything else related to humanity and what humanity is actually depended upon is NOT oil at all.
willing to bet?

plastics - like all the food we now get - require oil.

oil is more vital than you assume here.

we could - will have to - go bck to paper, and less food shelf life.
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by gaffo »

Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:29 am
bahman wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:41 pm
Impenitent wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:33 pm environmentalists can gleefully run on hamster wheels to generate electricity...

-Imp
You think they can provide electricity for 10 billion people.
Human beings do NOT 'need' electricity to live. 10, 20, 30, 100, 200, or more billion human beings can live WITHOUT electricity. Human beings, after all, have so far lived for one or 2 million years without electricity, so I am pretty sure they could live for a few more decades, centuries, or thousands of years WITHOUT electricity.
yep, we managed to before and can hense.

not pretty, but doable.

Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:29 am Besides that, have you not heard of the sun, the wind, thermal heat, ocean swells, ocean tides, and magnetism, to provide electricity?
not enough to matter - 5 percent at most IMO.

but as i said, we lived without electricity (nearly all the world prior to the 1970's) - so doable again.

wars over not withstanding (though with the water table dissapearing, wars over water are more likely than over electricity (one can live without one, not without the other).
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Age »

gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:31 am
Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:18 am

To me, 'our', human life, and everything else related to humanity and what humanity is actually depended upon is NOT oil at all.
willing to bet?
Yes.
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:31 am plastics - like all the food we now get - require oil.
What are you suggesting here?

Are you suggesting that the food available now is plastic?
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:31 am oil is more vital than you assume here.
But I am NOT assuming anything at all.

I am LOOKING AT the facts. These facts are; Human beings have said to have been around, and so have lived for, millions of years. And, even according to YOU how long have human beings been around for, and, how many years have human beings used oil for?

Now compare the two figures, how exactly is oil supposedly 'vital' for human beings survival?
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:31 am we could
Therefore, you OBVIOUSLY agree with me.
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:31 am - will have to - go bck to paper, and less food shelf life.
Oh, "you poor things".

'Life' just must be so hard for you, without human produced 'plastics', correct?

How "terribly hard" MUST OF LIFE BEEN before plastics were being mass-produced?
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by Age »

gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:36 am
Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:29 am
bahman wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 9:41 pm
You think they can provide electricity for 10 billion people.
Human beings do NOT 'need' electricity to live. 10, 20, 30, 100, 200, or more billion human beings can live WITHOUT electricity. Human beings, after all, have so far lived for one or 2 million years without electricity, so I am pretty sure they could live for a few more decades, centuries, or thousands of years WITHOUT electricity.
yep, we managed to before and can hense.

not pretty, but doable.

Age wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:29 am Besides that, have you not heard of the sun, the wind, thermal heat, ocean swells, ocean tides, and magnetism, to provide electricity?
not enough to matter - 5 percent at most IMO.
What do you mean by 'matter'?

And, what is YOUR OPINION about "5 percent at most" based on, EXACTLY?

Are you suggesting that human beings do not have the ability to devise, invent, and create new, or newer, things to obtain what they want in to the future?
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:36 am but as i said, we lived without electricity (nearly all the world prior to the 1970's) - so doable again.
I did not notice where you said this, but I am glad YOU did.

Of course human beings lived without electricity, and can do it again. There is NOTHING AT ALL hard NOR complex about understanding this FACT.

Let us if there was, for example, some reason there was NO electricity at all, all of sudden, then human beings do NOT just lie down and die. They adapt. They as well invent, design, and create new 'things'. They have been doing this for millions of years now, and I do NOT see human beings just changing doing this all of sudden, and just giving up on life and living, and just dropping dead, NOW.
gaffo wrote: Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:36 am wars over not withstanding (though with the water table dissapearing, wars over water are more likely than over electricity (one can live without one, not without the other).
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henry quirk
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What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by henry quirk »

Atomics!

Fission is tops!

I want this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Nucleon
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bahman
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Re: What are we going to do when oil finishes?

Post by bahman »

gaffo wrote: Sat Aug 29, 2020 11:39 pm
bahman wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:08 pm Our economy, life, and everything else related to humanity depend on oil. We are overpopulated and managed to reach this population due to the existence of an easy access fuel. What are we going to do when oil finishes?
what we are now, drilling deeper and deeper (the original forecast of end of oil (made in the 70's) was that we would reach the peak by 2000, instead in the interim we found more oil in all sorts of places.

so that timeline was wrong, where are we now? at the peak or not - no idea.

but oil is a finite resource, and we will need it for plastics at least, even if we can make gasohal via sugar/etc.


oil will prob be gone by 2150, and so as it ends we will probably have to move to Nuclear (as much as i hate nuclear - do to the waste problem of 20,000 yrs for storage (not possible - but i guess we can assume 100 yrs and let folks after 1000 yrs to worry about the radiation of their driking water - no longer our problem being long dead).

and since wind and solar will no be able to supply more than 10-percent ever, and we can assume Coal will be a no-go (but there will be coal in the rocks in 100 yrs so if the irradiated folks of 3100 find nuclear power not moral, they can dig for coal for power (and it will be enough for 2000 yrs - ah the circle of life/history repeats).

- but ya, after oil is gone we will have two actual options:

Coal or Nuclear.

and due to the cost benefit of polution/global warming of the former and the nuc waste radiation containment of the latter................for me, i kind of support coal over nuc, but the former has no popular support, and the latter has slowly reformed itself since the 70's.

so the people being sheep - the nuc lobby will prob prevail over the coal lobby after oil is gone (2180).

oh and though the bumper stickers say that you cannot hug your children with nuclear/radioactive arms - you can do so without harming your child (you are dead from radiation exposure and your arms near your kid will not measurably increase the chances of him dying due to your hug).

but you are both probably dead due to the waste no longer being contained and leaking into the drinking water, so no biggue,

when your kid dies, do not think it was due to you huggin them - you were both dead long before.
Thanks for summerizing thing.
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