~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

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Bill Wiltrack
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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:46 am

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..............................................................Well put. Well done.




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Arising_uk
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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Arising_uk » Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm

Dontaskme wrote:Nothing belongs to you. ...
My thoughts belong to me, the possessions I buy belong to me, the things that I create belong to me.
There's a reason you don't stop to contemplate whether you should pull your hand off a hot stove, and instead simply do it,you're pretty much unconscious all the time. ...
That'll be subconscious as the unconscious is a contradiction in terms and the body has to be taught to respond to such things to reduce the response time.
There's no such thing as a wooden thief. Stop stealing my non-identity, for my love is free of charge. ...
Great! I'll be round to take your car, home and anything else you that doesn't belong to you then.
That which is of the sun is the sun. ...
So it belongs to the sun then?

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sat Apr 07, 2018 1:57 pm

Arising_uk wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm
Great! I'll be round to take your car, home and anything else you that doesn't belong to you then.
Things can be stolen apparently, but the not-a- thing that is everything cannot be stolen.


Arising_uk wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm
So it belongs to the sun then?
No, the sun makes no claim of ownership. The source of all things is not a thing, it doesn't blame or claim, or seek for fame.

It's totally fulfilled, self sufficient and self organising.

No one can steal life, someone can kill me and take my life, but I will have lost nothing.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sat Apr 07, 2018 2:14 pm

Arising_uk wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm
That'll be subconscious as the unconscious is a contradiction in terms and the body has to be taught to respond to such things to reduce the response time.
You are not aware of the Subconsciousness actions, in other words you are unconscious of your actions, consciousness is on contact with a surface, when unconscious awareness becomes aware of itself...there is no person doing this.
The brain's work is conducted at the unconscious level, completely without your knowledge. When the processing is done and there is a decision to make or a physical act to perform,that action is served up to the conscious mind, which executes the work and then flatters itself that it was in charge all the time. The middle man, aka the phantom takes all the credit for what it didn't do.

The information we perceive in our consciousness is not created by conscious thought,nor is it reacted to by conscious processes. There is no doer, for a doer to consciously control action would slow down what is operating at the speed of light.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sat Apr 07, 2018 2:18 pm

Bill Wiltrack wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:46 am
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..............................................................Well put. Well done.




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Plagiarism is the highest form of wisdom.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sat Apr 07, 2018 2:20 pm

Arising_uk wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm
My thoughts belong to me
The me is a thought.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sat Apr 07, 2018 2:27 pm

Arising_uk wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:35 pm
the possessions I buy belong to me, the things that I create belong to me.
Nothing belongs to you because you are not a thing.

That which is not a thing is everything, that which is everything does not claim anything...for it is everything, you came with nothing and you will leave with nothing, the apparent claiming part is the misery self.

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Nothing belongs to you.

Nothing belongs to the birds, bees, or the coconut trees.

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It's all free.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:29 pm

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REALLY like the previous dialog:



Arising_uk wrote: ↑Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:35 am

My thoughts belong to me


The me is a thought.


Arising_uk wrote: ↑Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:35 am
the possessions I buy belong to me, the things that I create belong to me.


Nothing belongs to you because you are not a thing.

That which is not a thing is everything, that which is everything does not claim anything...for it is everything, you came with nothing and you will leave with nothing, the apparent claiming part is the misery self.

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Nothing belongs to you.

Nothing belongs to the birds, bees, or the coconut trees.

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It's all free.





*THIS is the type of philosophical dialog that could easily be used to expand upon within a seperate thread or could be a direct excerpt from a notable philosophical book. - Socrates comes to mind...

WELL DONE everyone!


Thank you for being a part of this thread...









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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Arising_uk » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:05 am

Bill Wiltrack wrote:...
*THIS is the type of philosophical dialog that could easily be used to expand upon within a seperate thread or could be a direct excerpt from a notable philosophical book. - Socrates comes to mind...
You've quite clearly never read Plato's Socrates nor a notable philosophical book.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Arising_uk » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:11 am

Dontaskme wrote:Things can be stolen apparently, but the not-a- thing that is everything cannot be stolen. ...
Show me this 'not-a-thing'? And if it exists then it quite clearly will be a thing just not in this external world.

If a thing can be stolen it must have belonged to someone?
Arising_uk wrote:No, the sun makes no claim of ownership. The source of all things is not a thing, it doesn't blame or claim, or seek for fame.

It's totally fulfilled, self sufficient and self organising. ...
I see, so a Sun doesn't have blame or make claims of want fame but it can be fulfilled and have a self and sufficiently organise itself? :roll:
No one can steal life, someone can kill me and take my life, but I will have lost nothing.
Of course not as you will be dead so there will be nothing to experience the loss.

Although you are wrong as I can slowly poison you in such a way as to not kill you but shorten your expected life span so in effect I've stolen some of your life.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Arising_uk » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:15 am

Dontaskme wrote:Nothing belongs to you because you are not a thing. ...
But I am a thing, I'm a body with senses in an external world.
That which is not a thing is everything, that which is everything does not claim anything...for it is everything, you came with nothing and you will leave with nothing, the apparent claiming part is the misery self. ...
Who's miserable?

I came as a body and I will leave as a body.
Nothing belongs to you.
The things I make and create do.
Nothing belongs to the birds, bees, or the coconut trees. ...
Then you'll have to explain why they fight to defend their hives and nests?

I agree about the trees, although they seem to mightly strive to rise above their fellow and claim teir space upon the planet.
It's all free.
Another plagiarist in the making.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:06 am

Arising_uk wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:11 am
Of course not as you will be dead so there will be nothing to experience the loss.

Although you are wrong as I can slowly poison you in such a way as to not kill you but shorten your expected life span so in effect I've stolen some of your life.
Okay I'm wrong if that makes you feel justified and knowledgeable, but there is a more deeper truth knowledge beyond temporal appearances that come and go.

It seems your mind does not want to look at the bigger picture, it is concerned only for the misery existential self...so be it, nothing wrong with that expression...it's part of the experiencing.

The bigger picture tells us ..Nothing dies, Nothing is lost, Nothing is added or taken away .. there is only everything which is another word for nothing. Nothing belongs to YOU.

I AM the First and the Last.
Known is a drop, Unknown is an Ocean.
It's all YOU.

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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:38 am

Arising_uk wrote:
Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:15 am
Who's miserable?
No one.

It's just a figure of speech.

For the human ...the sense of having a ''separate self'' is an illusion of nature...because everything is interconnected at every level of existence. You don't need me to tell you that, ask google.

As far as I know animals do not exhibit the sense of a separate ''me'' ..therefore they are already enlightened, they are programmed to do what they have been assigned to do by life itself to survive ..they have not been artificially programmed to believe they have a separate ''me''.

Separation is the cause of all human misery and suffering...they carry this suffering within them as repressed negative energy and pass it on to their offspring. It never goes away as long as we are holding on to it. Awareness is the key, to let it go and know it's as easy as just letting go or even allowing it to be there without believing it is who you are...it is not who you are, it's just an energy like everything else looking for attention...give it no attention and it will leave you alone. Attention goes, where energy flows.

Animals live in the moment, and act out of pure instinct...whereas the human mind is uncomfortable with the immediate moment, it has a tendency to dwell in the past or dream of future...the now is much too boring for the human mind...that's it's dilemma, it the existential crisis of being human.

However, life being self transcending can change all that nonsense and return to itself. Or else it stays the same.

"No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it."

If you have no problems in your life now A_uk, then I'm happy for you. Have a great life.



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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Bill Wiltrack » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:31 pm

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"No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it."


I see what you did there.


Nature provides us a default state of consciousness for any normal human being. What Ouspensky calls Waking Sleep.

An actual philosopher will put the effort into understanding and experiencing a higher state of consciousness. What Ouspensky calls the third state of consciousness; Self-consciousness. That is the outlook and state that you were defining as you developed your premises and thesis. In that superior, philosophical state that you so artistically defined, we see ourselves as objects - no different than other objects within this three dimensional universe that we perceive. In that state you understand how what we consider as ownership changes...Well done & thank you.


The active member who you are having this interaction with is defending and experiencing the default state of consciousness.

That member will never be a philosopher. Will never experience an extended state of self-consciousness. However they will be able to defend the default perspective of the world.

What is even more entertaining & amazing is that you did this while being courteous, civil and articulate.

The member you were interacting with not only unconsciously defended an inherently inferior non-philosophical position. You allowed them to think they won...

Well done. *And appreciated.







...................................................Image








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Re: ~ The Brilliant Light of the Spotless Sun Now Shines Upon the New Citizen of the World ~

Post by Dontaskme » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:55 pm

And thanks for your amazing thought provoking thread topics Bill.

Much appreciated as always.

Love your ideas. . . and your accompanying images that compliment and add more juice to the topic.

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